HomeMy Public PortalAboutMinutes - 1989/01/10 - RegularCITY OF TEMPLE CITY
PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
JANUARY 10, 1989
INITIATION:
1. CALL TO ORDER:
Pursuant to Agenda posted January 6, 1989, Chairman Seibert
called the meeting to order at 7:30 P.M. in the Council
Chambers.
2. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG:
Chairman Seibert led the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.
3. ROLL CALL:
Present: Commissioners Budds, Coolman, Muto and
Chairman Seibert
Absent: Commissioner Griffiths
Also Present:
City Attorney Martin, City Manager Koski,
Community Development Director Dawson and
Senior Planner Saldana
Commissioner Coolman moved to excuse Commissioner Griffiths
for cause. Seconded by Commissioner Budds.
4. CONSENT CALENDAR:
Commissioner Budds moved to approve the Consent Calendar.
Seconded by Commissioner Muto and approved unanimously.
A. APPROVAL OF MINUTES - Meeting of December 13, 1988
Approved as written.
B. MONTHLY CODE ENFORCEMENT REPORT - Month of December, 1988
Received and filed
5. UNFINISHED BUSINESS:
None
Planning Commission Minutes Page 2
January 10, 1989
6. NEW BUSINESS:
A. PUBLIC HEARING: PARCEL MAP 20350
ZONE VARIANCE 88 -962
Site: 10519 Olive Street
Owner:
Applicant:
Request:
Charles Bryan Gilbert Smith
9814 Nadine Street
Temple City, CA 91780
Owen Construction
2035 S. Myrtle
Monrovia, CA 91016
To subdivide one R -1 zoned
parcel into two parcels of
land, one being- a "flag" lot.
Also a variance to allow a
proposed two -story residence
with a seven -foot second story
side yard setback instead of
the required ten -foot side
yard setback.
Chairman Seibert asked if the notices has been sent.
Director Dawson replied they had and presented the staff
report. Senior Planner Saldana presented the video.
The public hearing was opened.
Mike Mangana, 2035 South Myrtle, Monrovia, representing
Owen Construction, stated their proposal was utilizing
the new flag lot ordinance and meeting all the require-
ments. He also thanked staff for the fine report and
offered to answer any questions the Commission might
have.
Rick Shroads, 135 E. La Porte Street, #E, Arcadia,
representing Civiltec Engineering, Inc., stated he would
be happy to answer any questions the Commission might
have regarding engineering.
Bryan Smith, 9814 Nadine Street, owner of the property,
stated that the Owen Development project would greatly
improve the property.
Candelario Delgado, 5430 Halifax Road, who lives di-
rectly behind the property, spoke in opposition to the
project, stating he would have no privacy with this type
of development. He would consider moving if this were
allowed.
Planning Commission Minutes Page 3
January 10, 1989
Commissioner Coolman asked if Mr. Delgado was aware that
it was legal to construct two -story dwellings in the
City of Temple City.
Mr. Delgado stated he felt a two -story at this location
would ruin the neighborhood. He felt the project was
overbuilding, the area and would not fit in with the
surroundings.
Linda Seymour, 5422 N. Halifax, also stated a two -story
home was not in keeping with the character of the neigh-
borhood, which are single story homes on large lots. She
selected this area because of the privacy it afforded.
She stated that with the proposed development they would
lose their privacy. She stated it would not ruin the
neighborhood, but still was not in keeping with the
existing neighborhood. She stated she personally did
not care for the flag lot, but she strongly objects to a
two -story development so close. It would affect five
lots if this is developed with two -story homes.
Sherry Christiansen, 5416 N. Halifax, strongly objected
to seeing "Disney -like castles" in her back yard, which
would happen if this project were approved. She was
concerned about the driveway access, privacy and the
character of the neighborhood. She was concerned about
possible concealed access to her property. She felt a
one -story development would be more in keeping with the
existing neighborhood. She presented the Commission
with a letter from Mary Morabito, 10511 Olive Street,
who was unable to attend the Commission meeting, but was
also opposed to the project.
Ann Vanderwindt, 10525 East Olive, next door to the
property, stated the proposed houses would be an eye-
sore, and provide no privacy for the neighbors. She
stated the existing house also provided no privacy, she
could look into their window and hear what the people
were saying. She stated they had put up with the ten -
ants of the property for a number of years. She was
concerned about fire trucks being able to access
property because of the number of vehicles parked.
John Seymour, 5422 Halifax, stated his lot would back up
to the side where the new two story dwelling would be
built. He stated this would change the character of the
neighborhood and he was opposed to the project.
"
"
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 4
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
W i l l i a m M u e l l e r , 5 4 1 6 H a l i f a x , s t a t e d t h a t c o d e s w e r e
a d o p t e d f o r t h e b e t t e r m e n t o f t h e c o m m u n i t y a s a w h o l e .
H e f e l t t h i s p r o j e c t w o u l d d o n o t h i n g f o r t h e b e t t e r m e n t
o f t h e c o m m u n i t y . H e w a n t e d t o k e e p t h e e x i s t i n g c h a r a c -
t e r o f t h e n e i g h b o r h o o d a n d n o t h a v e a t w o - s t o r y d w e l l -
i n g c o n s t r u c t e d .
M i k e M a n g a n a s t a t e d t h e h o u s e s w o u l d n o t b e a s h i g h a s
t w o - s t o r y d e v e l o p m e n t s i n s u r r o u n d i n g c o m m u n i t i e s ; t h e y
w o u l d o n l y b e a b o u t 2 5 f e e t h i g h . H e s t a t e d t h a t i f y o u
l o o k e d a t t h e p r o p e r t y t o t h e e a s t , t h e r e a r e t h r e e
l o t s o n a l o t o f t h e s a m e s i z e . T h i s p r o j e c t f a l l s w e l l
w i t h i n t h e c o n c e p t s o f t h e l a w . H e s t a t e d t h e h o u s e s
w o u l d b e a n a t t r a c t i o n t o t h e n e i g h b o r h o o d . H e s t a t e d
t h a t t h e p r o p o s e d d r i v e w a y h a d b e e n m o v e d t o t h e o t h e r
s i d e o f t h e l o t a n d w o u l d n o t b e i n t h e b a c k y a r d s o f
t h e h o u s e s o n H a l i f a x . I t w o u l d p a r a l l e l a n o t h e r d r i v e -
w a y . H e s t a t e d t h e y w e r e a d h e r i n g t o t h e f l a g l o t
o r d i n a n c e .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n m o v e d t o c l o s e t h e p u b l i c h e a r i n g ,
s e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n s t a t e d t h a t l o o k i n g a t t h e l o t s i z e
t h e r e a r e o t h e r s i n t h e a r e a t h a t a r e s m a l l e r . S h e
s t a t e d t h e l o t s p l i t w a s r e a s o n a b l e . S h e d i d h a v e a
c o n c e r n w i t h t h e p r o p o s e d s e t b a c k . S h e s t a t e d t h a t t h e
C o m m i s s i o n h a d g o n e t o a g r e a t d e a l o f e f f o r t t o a l l e v i -
a t e t h e s e c o n d s t o r y p r o b l e m w i t h t h e c u r r e n t r e q u i r e -
m e n t s a n d s t i l l g i v e p e o p l e t h e i r r i g h t s t o b u i l d a
s e c o n d s t o r y . S h e s t a t e d t h a t t h e 1 0 f o o t s i d e y a r d
s e t b a c k f o r t h e s e c o n d s t o r y s h o u l d b e m a i n t a i n e d ,
e s p e c i a l l y o n a n e w h o u s e . S h e s t a t e d s h e w a s i n f a v o r
o f a p p r o v i n g t h e f l a g l o t s u b d i v i s i o n b e c a u s e i t w a s
w e l l w i t h i n t h e o r d i n a n c e , a n d d i s a p p r o v i n g t h e v a r i -
a n c e r e q u e s t .
C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o s t a t e d h e a g r e e d w i t h C o m m i s s i o n e r
C o o l m a n r e g a r d i n g t h e l o t s p l i t . H e a l s o a g r e e d w i t h
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n r e g a r d i n g d e n y i n g t h e v a r i a n c e . H e
s t a t e d t h a t t h i s p a r t i c u l a r v a r i a n c e i s s u e w i l l c o m e u p
r e p e a t e d l y a n d t h a t t h e C o m m i s s i o n s h o u l d n o t s e t a
p r e c e d e n c e .
C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s s t a t e d h e d i d n o t h a v e a p r o b l e m w i t h
t h e l o t s p l i t . W i t h r e g a r d t o t h e s e v e n f o o t s e t b a c k ,
h e s t a t e d t h a t i n t h e d i s c u s s i o n s o n w h a t t h e s e t b a c k s
w o u l d b e , i t w a s r e c o g n i z e d t h a t e a c h c a s e w o u l d b e
l o o k e d a t o n a c a s e b y c a s e b a s i s f o r Z o n e V a r i a n c e s . H e
s t a t e d t h a t t h e s e v e n f e e t t h e y w e r e l o o k i n g a t w a s f r o m
a d r i v e w a y t h a t w a s f i f t e e n f e e t w i d e , w h i c h w o u l d g i v e
a 2 2 f o o t s e t b a c k f r o m t h e p r o p e r t y n e x t d o o r . H e
"
1
"
. s . ,
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
P a g e 5
s t a t e d t h a t w a s m o r e f o o t a g e t h a n w h a t i s o n t h e o t h e r
s i d e . H e s t a t e d h e w o u l d s u p p o r t t h e l o t s p l i t a n d
g r a n t i n g t h e v a r i a n c e .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t s t a t e d t h a t w h e n h e f i r s t l o o k e d a t
t h i s p r o p o s a l h e q u e s t i o n e d t h e s e v e n f o o t s e t b a c k , a n d
h i s i n i t i a l r e s p o n s e w a s n o w a y . T h e C o m m i s s i o n h a d
g o n e t h r o u g h a l o t o f w o r k t o e s t a b l i s h t h e t e n f o o t
s e t b a c k . H e s t a t e d , h o w e v e r , t h a t a f t e r l o o k i n g a t t h e
p l a n a n d r e a l i z i n g t h e r e w a s a f i f t e e n f o o t d r i v e w a y i n
a d d i t i o n , h e d i d n o t h a v e a p r o b l e m w i t h t h e s e v e n f o o t
s e t b a c k . H e s t a t e d t h e l o t s p l i t w a s f i n e . H e i n f o r m e d
t h e a u d i e n c e t h a t t h e r e w a s n o l a w s t a t i n g a s e c o n d
s t o r y c o u l d n o t b e b u i l t , a s l o n g a s i t f o l l o w s t h e
r e q u i r e d s e t b a c k s . H e f u r t h e r i n f o r m e d t h e a u d i e n c e
t h a t e v e n i f t h e C o m m i s s i o n d e n i e d t h e s e v e n f o o t s e t -
b a c k v a r i a n c e r e q u e s t , t h e a p p l i c a n t c o u l d s t i l l b u i l d a
t w o - s t o r y d w e l l i n g w i t h a t e n f o o t s e t b a c k o n t h e s e c o n d
s t o r y .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n m o v e d t o a p p r o v e t h e l o t s p l i t a n d
t o d e n y t h e Z o n e V a r i a n c e . S e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r
M u t o .
R o l l C a l l :
A y e s : C o m m i s s i o n e r s C o o l m a n , M u t o , a n d S e i b e r t
N o e s : C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s
A b s e n t : C o m m i s s i o n e r G r i f f i t h s
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t i n f o r m e d t h e a p p l i c a n t s t h e r e w a s a 1 0
d a y a p p e a l p e r i o d .
B . P U B L I C H E A R I N G : P A R C E L M A P 2 0 3 5 6
S i t e : 1 0 1 1 9 G r e e n S t r e e t
O w n e r : T h e o d o r e S & M a r i a A . H o y t
1 0 1 1 9 G r e e n S t r e e t
T e m p l e C i t y , C A 9 1 7 8 0
A p p l i c a n t :
R e q u e s t :
O w e n C o n s t r u c t i o n
2 0 3 5 S . M y r t l e
M o n r o v i a , C A 9 1 0 1 6
T o s u b d i v i d e a n R - 1 z o n e d
p a r c e l o f l a n d i n t o t w o p a r -
c e l s , o n e b e i n g a " f l a g " l o t .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t a s k e d i f t h e n o t i c e s h a d b e e n s e n t .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d t h e y h a d b e e n s e n t a n d h e p r e -
s e n t e d t h e s t a f f r e p o r t .
"
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 6
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
S e n i o r P l a n n e r S a l d a n a : p r e s e n t e d t h e v i d e o .
T h e C o m m i s s i o n e r s h a d n o q u e s t i o n s o f s t a f f a n d t h e
p u b l i c h e a r i n g w a s o p e n e d . -
M i k e M a n g a n a , 2 0 3 5 S o u t h M y r t l e , M o n r o v i a , r e p r e s e n t i n g
O w e n C o n s t r u c t i o n , s t a t e d t h e p r o p o s a l w a s c l e a r a n d
c o n c i s e . H e f u r t h e r s t a t e d t h a t s t a f f h a d d o n e a n
e x c e l l e n t j o b a n d t h a t h e w o u l d a n s w e r a n y q u e s t i o n s t h e
C o m m i s s i o n e r s m i g h t h a v e .
T e d H o y t , 1 0 1 1 9 G r e e n S t r e e t , o w n e r o f t h e p r o p e r t y ,
s t a t e d t h e r e w e r e v e r y f e w p r o b l e m s a s s o c i a t e d w i t h
s p l i t t i n g t h e l o t . S e v e r a l o f t h e s u r r o u n d i n g p r o p e r -
t i e s a l r e a d y h a v e t w o - s t o r y d w e l l i n g s a n d t h a t h e w a s
n o t r e q u e s t i n g a n y v a r i a n c e s .
B o b P i t t s , 5 3 1 2 D e g a s A v e n u e , h a d a q u e s t i o n r e g a r d i n g
w a t e r s t a n d i n g o n G r e e n a t t h e i n t e r s e c t i o n o f D e g a s
a d j a c e n t t o t h e w e s t a l o n g G r e e n d u e t o t h e t e r r a i n . H e
w a n t e d t o k n o w w h e r e t h e d r a i n a g e w o u l d b e c o m i n g f r o m ,
a n d w i t h t h e a d d i t i o n o f a d w e l l i n g , w o u l d i t c o n t r i b u t e
t o t h e s t a n d i n g w a t e r o n G r e e n A v e n u e w h i c h s o m e t i m e s
b e c o m e s s t a g n a n t .
R i c k S h r o a d s , C i v i l t e c E n g i n e e r i n g , 1 3 5 E . L a P o r t e
S t r e e t , # E , A r c a d i a , s t a t e d t h e r e m a y b e a f l a t s p o t o n
t h e s o u t h e a s t c o r n e r . H e s t a t e d t h a t f r o m t h e s o u t h w e s t
c o r n e r t o t h e s o u t h e a s t c o r n e r t h e r e i s p l e n t y o f d r o p .
T h e C o n d i t i o n s r e q u i r e t h a t d r a i n a g e b e f i x e d i f p o s s i -
b l e a n d h e s t a t e d t h e g r a d e s w o u l d h a v e t o b e s u r v e y e d
a n d r e - e n g i n e e r e d f o r p r o p e r d r a i n a g e .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t a s k e d D i r e c t o r D a w s o n i f t h e C o n d i t i o n s
d i d r e q u i r e p r o p e r d r a i n a g e .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d C o n d i t i o n N o . 2 7 s p e c i f i c a l l y
r e q u i r e s t h a t t h e a p p l i c a n t m u s t p r o v i d e a d e q u a t e f a -
c i l i t i e s f o r d r a i n a g e . H e s t a t e d t h a t d u r i n g P l a n C h e c k
t h e C o u n t y E n g i n e e r w o u l d b e l o o k i n g a t t h e o v e r a l l
d r a i n a g e o f t h e p r o p o s e d t w o n e w l o t s .
M r . P i t t s r e i t e r a t e d h e w a s c o n c e r n e d a b o u t t h e s t a n d i n g
w a t e r a n d p o s s i b l e d e b r i s .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n a s k e d M r . P i t t s i f h e w a s c o n c e r n e d
a b o u t t h e s t r e e t d r a i n a g e .
M r . P i t t s s t a t e d h e w a s , a n d a l s o t h e p o s s i b l e a d d i -
t i o n a l d r a i n a g e f r o m t h e n e w l o t . H e s t a t e d h e w a s i n
f a v o r o f t h e p r o p o s e d l o t s p l i t , b u t w a s c o n c e r n e d a b o u t
w a t e r . H e s t a t e d t h e d r a i n a g e p r o b l e m s s t a r t e d w h e n t h e
c u r b s w e r e i n s t a l l e d .
Planning Commission Minutes Page 7
January 10, 1989
Director Dawson stated that curb and gutter would be
installed in front of the two new lots. He further
stated that he would have the Public Works Department
look into the standing water.
Sam Soldano, 10102 Randwick Drive, owner of Lot 8 behind
the proposed lot split. He stated he had done a lot of
community work. He stated he was opposed to the pro-
ject. He asked if the Commissioners would want to live
next door to a project of this size. He felt it was
about money and greed, not about living in Temple City
or raising a family in an R -1 area. He was opposed to
flag lots as he felt it was not consistent with the rest
of the R -1 housing in the area as it increases the
density.
Valerie Sadler, 10065 Green Street, stated she came to
the meeting to hear what was going on. Her only concern
with a flag lot was that when you have a lot of houses
behind other houses, you start to have difficulties in
the area. These problems bring police activities. She
stated that tensions seem to run high when you have
people living closely together. She stated they had
purchased their home in the area because there was
almost a rural character, and a quiet neighborhood.
There are large lots and it is nice to have room around
the houses. She was concerned that the neighborhood
density would be increased.
Commissioner Coolman asked if she had two units on her
lot.
She stated that there were two addresses on her lot. She
stated she had researched this and apparently the bache-
lor apartment behind the garage was at one time consid-
ered a second unit. She further stated she had opened
the bachelor to the garage and was using this for stor-
age, not as a dwelling unit.
Mike Mangana, pointed out that the intent of the flag
lot ordinance was to allow the approximately 280 lots
within the City that lent themselves to the possibility
of being developed to be split. The City is not going
to go through a big change over of flag lots. The
Ordinance does not allow most of the lots in Temple City
to be divided. He further stated that many of the lots
in Temple City were easement lots, which were created
prior to the incorporation of Temple City, and had
absentee owners. This might cause some of the police
activities about which the neighbors had concerns.
"
"
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 8
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s m o v e d t o c l o s e t h e p u b l i c h e a r i n g ;
s e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n .
C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s s t a t e d t h e i s s u e o f t h e p r o s a n d c o n s
o f f l a g l o t s w a s n o t b e f o r e t h e C o m m i s s i o n . I f a f l a g
l o t o r d i n a n c e w a s b e f o r e t h e C o m m i s s i o n h e s t a t e d h e
w o u l d a g r e e w i t h t h e p e o p l e i n o p p o s i t i o n t o t h e f l a g
l o t s . H o w e v e r , t h e r e i s a n o r d i n a n c e e x i s t i n g i n t h e
C i t y w h i c h d o e s a l l o w f o r f l a g l o t s w i t h m i n i m u m r e -
q u i r e m e n t s . H e s t a t e d t h a t l o o k i n g a t t h e o r d i n a n c e a n d
t h e m i n i m u m r e q u i r e m e n t s , t h e r e q u e s t b e f o r e t h e C o m m i s -
s i o n d o e s m e e t t h o s e r e q u i r e m e n t s , a n d o n t h a t b a s i s h e
w o u l d a p p r o v e t h e r e q u e s t .
C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o s t a t e d h e a g r e e d w i t h C o m m i s s i o n e r
B u d d s s t a t e m e n t s . H e a l s o s t a t e d t h a t s i n c e t h e r e q u e s t
m e t t h e s t a n d a r d s , h e w o u l d a p p r o v e t h e r e q u e s t .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n g a v e s o m e b a c k g r o u n d o n t h e c r e a -
t i o n o f t h e f l a g l o t o r d i n a n c e a n d s t a t e d t h e C o m m i s s i o n
h a d j u s t a s m a n y i m p a s s i o n e d p l e a s f r o m t h e o w n e r s o f
t h e l a r g e l o t s w h o f e l t t h e y c o u l d n o t d o a n y t h i n g w i t h
t h e m . T h a t w a s w h y t h e m i n i m u m r e q u i r e m e n t f o r 7 2 0 0
s q u a r e f e e t w a s e s t a b l i s h e d . C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n
s t a t e d a c o m p r o m i s e h a d b e e n r e a c h e d w h i c h w o u l d a l l o w
t h e p e o p l e w i t h l a r g e l o t s t o d e v e l o p t h e m b y u s i n g t h e
s e c o n d h a l f o f t h e l o t f o r a d w e l l i n g i n s t e a d o f h a v i n g
a w e e d p a t c h , a n d s t i l l k e e p a r e s i d e n t i a l q u a l i t y .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n s t a t e d t h e C o m m i s s i o n w a s b o u n d b y
t h e l a w s . T h e l a w s o f t h e C i t y s a y f l a g l o t s a r e l e g a l .
T h e r e f o r e s h e c o n c u r r e d w i t h t h e o t h e r C o m m i s s i o n e r s .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t a g r e e d w i t h t h e o t h e r C o m m i s s i o n e r s .
C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s m o v e d t o a p p r o v e P a r c e l M a p 2 0 3 5 6
b a s e d u p o n t h e f i n d i n g s a n d s u b j e c t t o t h e c o n d i t i o n s o f
a p p r o v a l a s c o n t a i n e d i n t h e d r a f t r e s o l u t i o n . S e c o n d e d
b y C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o a n d a p p r o v e d u n a n i m o u s l y .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t i n f o r m e d t h e a p p l i c a n t s t h e r e w a s a 1 0
d a y a p p e a l p e r i o d i f a n y o n e o b j e c t e d t o t h e d e c i s i o n .
C . P U B L I C H E A R I N G :
S i t e :
O w n e r / A p p l i c a n t :
P A R C E L M A P 2 0 4 6 2
9 3 6 1 L o w e r A z u s a R o a d
D a n N o r i e g a
1 4 0 S o u t h L a k e A v e n u e , # 2 7 2
P a s a d e n a , C A 9 1 1 0 1
"
"
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 9
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
R e q u e s t :
T o s u b d i v i d e a n R - 1 z o n e d
p a r c e l o f l a n d i n t o t w o p a r -
c e l s , o n e b e i n g a " f l a g " l o t .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t a s k e d i f t h e n o t i c e s h a d b e e n s e n t .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n r e p l i e d t h e y h a d b e e n s e n t a n d h e p r e -
s e n t e d t h e s t a f f r e p o r t .
S e n i o r P l a n n e r S a l d a n a p r e s e n t e d t h e v i d e o .
T h e p u b l i c h e a r i n g w a s o p e n e d .
D a n N o r i e g a , 9 3 6 1 L o w e r A z u s a R o a d , p r o p e r t y o w n e r ,
s t a t e d h e h a d l i v e d i n t h e a r e a a l l h i s l i f e a n d w a s
u t i l i z i n g t h e e x i s t i n g o r d i n a n c e t o d e v e l o p a n d i m p r o v e
h i s p r o p e r t y . H e s t a t e d i t w o u l d i n c r e a s e t h e p r o p e r t y
v a l u e i n t h e a r e a .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t a s k e d i f M r . N o r i e g a h a d r e a d a l l t h e
c o n d i t i o n s a n d u n d e r s t o o d t h e m .
M r . N o r i e g a s t a t e d h e h a d a n d b a s e d u p o n c o n s u l t a t i o n
w i t h h i s C i v i l E n g i n e e r h a d n o o b j e c t i o n s .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n m o v e d t o c l o s e t h e p u b l i c h e a r i n g ,
s e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o .
C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o s t a t e d h e a g r e e d w i t h t h e s t a f f r e -
p o r t . T h e r e w a s b a s i s f o r a p p r o v a l .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n a g r e e d .
C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s a g r e e d .
C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o m o v e d t o a p p r o v e T e n t a t i v e P a r c e l M a p
2 0 4 6 2 b a s e d u p o n t h e f i n d i n g s a n d s u b j e c t t o t h e
c o n d i t i o n s o f a p p r o v a l a s c o n t a i n e d i n t h e d r a f t r e s o l u -
t i o n . S e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n a n d a p p r o v e d
u n a n i m o u s l y .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t i n f o r m e d M r . N o r i e g a t h e r e w a s a t e n
d a y a p p e a l p e r i o d .
D . P U B L I C H E A R I N G :
C O D E A M E N D M E N T -
P A R K I N G R E Q U I R E M E N T S F O R
S H O P P I N G C E N T E R S W I T H M O R E
T H A N 7 5 , 0 0 0 S Q U A R E F E E T O F
G R O S S F L O O R A R E A
Planning Commission Minutes Page 10
January 10, 1989
Summary:
The Planning Commission will
consider a Code Amendment to
Part IX of the Zoning Code to
establish a specific parking
requirement for commercial
shopping centers with more
than 75,000 square feet of
total floor area. The park-
ing standard being recommended
for consideration by the
Planning Commission would
require a minimum of 1 off -
street parking space for each
250 square feet of gross floor
area for all uses in a commer-
cial center of more than
75,000 square feet.
Director Dawson stated a public notice had been adver-
tised in the newspaper 10 days before the hearing. He
presented the staff report.
Commissioner Coolman asked for clarification regarding
the parking at the K -Mart Center. It appears to have
less parking than that proposed by this study, yet it
seems adequate.
Director Dawson stated the K -Mart Center would need
slightly more parking.
Chairman Seibert stated that by taking all the various
uses at the K -Mart Center, the average came up to 244,
which is underparked at this time. The staff has
rounded up to 250.
Commissioner Budds asked why gross square feet was used
to establish parking requirements.
Director Dawson replied that most cities use gross area
for traffic studies and determining parking. From an
administrative standpoint it makes it much easier. You
don't have to debate useable versus unusable space.
Commissioner Budds stated that using net would then
require less parking space. He was concerned about
utilization of space.
Director Dawson stated again that by using gross square
footage there was no debate on usable space.
Planning Commission Minutes Page 11
January 10, 1989
Commissioner Budds said the reason he asked the question
was because of the the scenario laid out with regard to
a shopping center. He asked if the parking requirement
could be reduced even further to provide more space for
buildings.
Chairman Seibert stated it should be kept simple, and
not get into debates as to what was useable and not
useable. The formula itself could be modified as far as
ratios are concerned. He stated the Commission was
there to determine if the ratio of 1 parking space for
every 250 square feet of gross floor area was adequate.
Commissioner Budds replied he felt it was more than
adequate.
The public hearing was opened.
William H. Bretz, 8723 East Hermosa, stated the City is
involved in working out a project at the corner of
Rosemead and Las Tunas and the parking requirements of
this proposed project should be looked at very closely.
The K -Mart Center parking is not completely full, but at
times, it is quite full. He stated that to establish a
set standard of 1 parking space for every 250 square
feet of gross floor area may not work because it is not
known what is going into a shopping center of 75,000
square feet. He understood that although there would be
a Conditional Use Permit and the type of businesses can
be regulated; only a certain amount can be restaurant.
He stated there was a parking problem in the area al-
ready with the Edwards Theaters. Quite a few times the
parking has been underestimated. There is a lot of
overflow parking going across Rosemead and up and down
Rosemead as well as into the residential areas. He
stated that someone had dropped the ball on that par-
ticular project.
Director Dawson stated that the problem with theaters
was feast or famine. Most times there is more than
enough parking, but there are times with big hit movies
or over the holidays when the lot has an overflow. That
is a problem inherent with that particular use.
Mr. Bretz stated it was a seasonable thing, that the
movie industry does put on a big push over the Christmas
holiday season, which fills the lot as well as the
shopping centers across the street filling their lots at
the same time. He stated that the minimum number of
parking spaces should be based upon the maximum possi-
ble usage at peak shopping hours to compensate for all
potential shoppers. If the shoppers cannot park, they
will go elsewhere to shop. He stated the City has to be
"
"
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 1 2
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
v e r y c o n c e r n e d w i t h m a k i n g s u r e t h e y h a v e e n o u g h p a r k i n g
f o r p e a k s h o p p i n g h o u r s . T h e t h i n k i n g s e e m s t o b e t h a t
i f w e k e e p t h e p a r k i n g r e q u i r e m e n t l o w e n o u g h w e c a n
b u i l d o u t l a r g e r a n d h a v e m o r e s q u a r e f o o t a g e i n t h e
b u i l d i n g s . T h e n i t i s p u s h i n g t h e p a r k i n g i n t o t h e
r e s i d e n t i a l n e i g h b o r h o o d s i n t h e c o m m u n i t y a n d t h a t i s
w h a t t h e c i v i c l e a d e r s s h o u l d b e v e r y c a r e f u l o f d o i n g .
O n c e i t i s d o n e , i t i s d o n e . I t i s t h e p e o p l e i n t h e
a f f e c t e d a r e a s t h a t w i l l h a v e t o p a y t h e p r i c e . T h e r e
w i l l b e c o n g e s t i o n . I t w i l l h a v e t o b e w e l l t h o u g h t o u t
i n a d v a n c e .
B o b P i t t s , 5 3 1 2 D e g a s A v e n u e , a s k e d w h a t t h e c u r r e n t
r e q u i r e m e n t s w e r e .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d t h e r e w e r e n o c u r r e n t s t a n d a r d
r e q u i r e m e n t s f o r t h a t s i z e d e v e l o p m e n t . H o w e v e r , t h e
g e n e r a l c o m m e r c i a l r e q u i r e m e n t i s 1 s p a c e f o r e v e r y 2 5 0
s q u a r e f o o t .
M r . P i t t s a s k e d i f t h e r e w a s a r e q u i r e m e n t a t t h e K - M a r t
C e n t e r .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d t h e r e w a s n o t a s p e c i f i c r e q u i r e -
m e n t f o r l a r g e s i z e s h o p p i n g c e n t e r s t h a t w o u l d h a v e a
m i x t u r e o f u s e s .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t s t a t e d t h a t K - M a r t w a s l o o k e d a t i n d i -
v i d u a l l y . K - M a r t s t o r e h a d t o h a v e s o m a n y s p a c e s ;
C l a r k D r u g h a d t o h a v e s o m a n y , e t c . , b u t a s a t o t a l
s i z e t h e r e w a s n o s t a n d a r d .
M r . P i t t s a s k e d i f t h i s s t a n d a r d w e r e a d o p t e d w o u l d i t
a f f e c t t h e K - M a r t s h o p p i n g c e n t e r .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t s t a t e d i t w o u l d n o t a f f e c t K - M a r t .
M r . P i t t s a s k e d i f t h i s w a s f o r f u t u r e p r o j e c t s o r w a s
t h e r e o n e n o w .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n r e p l i e d t h i s w o u l d b e f o r a n y p r o j e c t
i n c l u d i n g t h e B l o c k " A " a r e a . H e f u r t h e r s t a t e d t h a t
w h e n p a r k i n g s t a n d a r d s a r e l o o k e d a t , t h e y a r e b r o k e n
d o w n b y u s e a n d w h e n s t a n d a r d s w e r e r e w r i t t e n w i t h t h e
i d e a o f h a v i n g s i n g l e u s e s o n s i n g l e l o t , i t d i d n o t
c o n s i d e r l a r g e s i z e s h o p p i n g c e n t e r s w h e r e p e o p l e w i l l
p a r k a n d g o t o s e v e r a l d i f f e r e n t s t o r e s w i t h o n e s t o p .
I t s e e m s r e a s o n a b l e t o h a v e a s t a n d a r d , s p e c i f i c a l l y f o r
t h o s e t y p e s o f s h o p p i n g c e n t e r s w h e r e i t i s n o t a s i n -
g l e , l o c a t i o n a l t r i p .
"
"
"
P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 1 3
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
M r . P i t t s i n q u i r e d i f t h e s a m e p h i l o s o p h y t h a t w a s
a d o p t e d f o r t h e K - M a r t s i t u a t i o n w o u l d b e a p p l i e d t o t h e
n e w p r o p o s e d s h o p p i n g c e n t e r .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d t h a t t h e K - M a r t c e n t e r w a s l o o k e d
a t i n d i v i d u a l l y a n d i s u n d e r p a r k e d b y t o d a y ' s s t a n d a r d s .
K - M a r t i t s e l f n e e d s 1 s p a c e f o r e v e r y 2 5 0 s q u a r e f e e t ;
m a r k e t s n e e d t o h a v e 1 s p a c e f o r e v e r y 2 0 0 s q u a r e f e e t ,
e t c . W h e n t h e K - M a r t c e n t e r w e n t i n t h e p a r k i n g s t a n -
d a r d s w e r e m o r e l e n i e n t . H o w e v e r , t h e r e h a s n o t b e e n a
s i g n i f i c a n t p r o b l e m a t K - M a r t a l t h o u g h i t d o e s n o t m e e t
c u r r e n t s t a n d a r d s .
M r . P i t t s i n q u i r e d a b o u t t h e d o w n t o w n a r e a b e i n g l o o k e d
a t a s i n d i v i d u a l s t o r e s a n d u s e s f o r p a r k i n g r e q u i r e -
m e n t s .
C h a i r m a n S e i b e r t r e p l i e d t h e - d o w n t o w n w a s l o o k e d a t
i n d i v i d u a l l y .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n r e p l i e d t h e d o w n t o w n s i t u a t i o n w a s a
l i t t l e d i f f e r e n t a s t h e C - 1 a r e a w a s i n p a r k i n g d i s -
t r i c t s .
M r . P i t t s a s k e d i f a r e s t a u r a n t w a s p r o p o s e d i n t h e
f u t u r e s h o p p i n g c e n t e r , h o w i t w o u l d a f f e c t t h e p a r k i n g .
W o u l d t h e s q u a r e f o o t a g e b e t h e s a m e ?
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d t h a t w a s a v e r a g e d i n w i t h t h e
p r o p o s e d 1 s p a c e f o r e v e r y 2 5 0 s q u a r e f e e t o f g r o s s
f l o o r a r e a f o r a l l u s e s .
M r . P i t t s s t a t e d t h a t r e a l i s t i c a l l y h e u n d e r s t o o d w h y
t h e C o m m i s s i o n w a s l o o k i n g a t t h e p a r k i n g s t a n d a r d s , b u t
o n t h e s u r f a c e w e r e n ' t t h e y p u t t i n g t h e c a r t b e f o r e t h e
h o r s e s i n c e t h e C i t y h a d n o 7 5 , 0 0 0 s q u a r e f o o t s h o p p i n g
c e n t e r t o c o n s i d e r ?
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n s t a t e d i t s e e m e d t o b e a j u s t i f i a b l e
s t a n d a r d t h a t s h o u l d b e i n t h e c o d e s o t h a t w h e n a n d i f
t h e p r o j e c t h a p p e n s , i t i s a s t a n d a r d t h a t i s a p p l i c a -
b l e .
M r . B r e t z a s k e d i f t h e c u r r e n t c o m m e r c i a l r e g u l a t i o n w a s
1 s p a c e f o r e v e r y 2 5 0 s q u a r e f o o t a n d r e s t a u r a n t s w e r e
o n e s p a c e f o r e v e r y 1 0 0 s q u a r e f e e t .
D i r e c t o r D a w s o n r e p l i e d t h a t w a s t h e s t a n d a r d .
Planning Commission Minutes Page 14
January 10, 1989
Mr. Bretz stated that since they were discussing a
75,000 square foot complex and there is a very good
chance that in the only complex of this size in the
future there will be a restaurant, wouldn't it be wise
to instead of saying 1 for every 250 square feet to try
and average in the restaurant space to possibly lower
the square footage?
Director Dawson replied that was one of the points of
the suggested code change because of the experience with
the K -Mart Center in particular, and with other cities
experience with shopping centers in general, there is a
shared parking that happens in the larger size centers
that includes some restaurant uses. The K -Mart Center
has restaurant uses and market use and general retail
use.
Mr. Bretz asked how many square feet were in the K -Mart
Center.
Director Dawson replied there were 225,955 square feet.
Mr. Bretz asked what the percentage of Denny's Restau-
rant was.
Director Dawson replied. 4,500 square feet.
Commissioner Coolman stated there were five restaurants,
not just Denny's.
Director Dawson stated there was Denny's, King Arthur,
Burger King, Pioneer Chicken and the Submarine Restau-
rant, with almost 14,000 square feet.
Mr. Bretz asked if a percentage thing could be worked
into the ordinance to keep a percentage of restaurant to
a percentage of commercial in order to keep the parking
under control.
Director Dawson stated it would be possible, but would
be a more cumbersome standard.
Chairman Seibert stated that the requirement for restau-
rant was figured into the average.
Mr. Bretz stated the K -Mart Center was a lot smaller
than what possibly might be in a new center.
Chairman Seibert stated no one knew that. It might
possibly be less. He further stated that the restaurant
was figured into that average.
"
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P l a n n i n g C o m m i s s i o n M i n u t e s P a g e 1 5
J a n u a r y 1 0 , 1 9 8 9
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n m o v e d t o c l o s e t h e p u b l i c h e a r i n g .
S e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s .
C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o s t a t e d t h a t s t a f f m a d e a v e r y g o o d
c a s e f o r t h e p r o p o s a l o f c e n t e r s o v e r 7 5 , 0 0 0 s q u a r e
f e e t . H e s t a t e d w e s h o u l d n o t w a i t u n t i l s o m e t h i n g i s
u p o n t h e C o m m i s s i o n b e f o r e s t a r t i n g t o p r e p a r e . T h i s
w o u l d f i l l t h e v o i d .
C o m m i s s i o n e r C o o l m a n c o n c u r r e d . I t i s v i r t u a l l y i m p o s -
s i b l e t o a l l o w e n o u g h p a r k i n g f o r a C h r i s t m a s E v e d a y .
T h i s p r o p o s a l i s r e a l i s t i c . S h e s t a t e d s h e h a d b e e n a t
K - M a r t C e n t e r w h e n i t i s v e r y b u s y a n d B u i l d e r s E m p o r i u m
h a s a s m u c h t r a f f i c a s K - M a r t . S h e f e l t t h e r e q u e s t w a s
r e a s o n a b l e a n d w o u l d s i m p l i f y t h e o r d i n a n c e .
S h e r e a l i z e d e v e r y o n e l i k e s t o p a r k c l o s e t o t h e f r o n t
d o o r , b u t t h e r e a r e t i m e s w h e n p e o p l e d o h a v e t o w a l k .
S h e s t a t e d s h e p e r s o n a l l y h a d n e v e r s e e n t h e K - M a r t
C e n t e r f i l l e d t o c a p a c i t y . T h e r e a r e a l w a y s s p a c e s ;
t h e y m a y n o t b e c o n v e n i e n t a n d c l o s e , b u t t h e r e a r e
s p a c e s . S h e s t a t e d t h i s w a s a r e a s o n a b l e a v e r a g i n g .
R e s t a u r a n t s d o b r i n g p e o p l e i n t o t h e a r e a a n d t h e y w i l l
s h o p . S h e s t a t e d t h a t p e r h a p s a l l t h e r e s t a u r a n t s i n a
s h o p p i n g c e n t e r s h o u l d n o t b e i n t h e s a m e c o r n e r . T h e
p a r k i n g i s a r e a s o n a b l e s o l u t i o n .
C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s c o n c u r r e d .
C o m m i s s i o n e r M u t o m o v e d t o a d o p t t h e R e s o l u t i o n r e c o m -
m e n d i n g a p p r o v a l . S e c o n d e d b y C o m m i s s i o n e r B u d d s .
A p p r o v e d u n a n i m o u s l y .
7 . C O M M U N I C A T I O N S :
N o n e
8 . T I M E F O R T H O S E I N T H E A U D I E N C E W H O W I S H T O S P E A K :
W i l l i a m B r e t z , 8 7 2 3 E a s t H e r m o s a D r i v e , s t a t e d h e h a d h o p e d
t h a t m o r e o f t h e p e o p l e w h o w e r e a t t h e m e e t i n g e a r l i e r h a d
s t a y e d b e c a u s e h e w a n t e d t o a d d r e s s t o t h e m t h a t t h e r e a s o n
t h e y h a d t o b e h e r e w a s b e c a u s e t h e y h a d n o t b e e n c o m i n g t o
m e e t i n g s a n d d i d n o t k n o w w h a t w a s h a p p e n i n g i n t h e i r C i t y .
T h e y d o n o t k n o w w h a t i s a f f e c t i n g t h e m w h e n t h e y n e e d t o
k n o w i t ; i n s t e a d t h e y w a i t u n t i l t h e l a s t m i n u t e .
9 . M A T T E R S F R O M C I T Y O F F I C I A L S :
N o n e
Planning Commission Minutes
January 10, 1989
10. ADJOURNMENT:
Page 16
As there was no further business, Chairman Seibert adjourned
the meeting at 9:06 p.m. The next regular meeting of the
Planning Commission will be held on Tuesday, January 24, 1989
at 7:30 P.M. in the Council Chamber, 5938 North Kauffman
Avenue, Temple City.
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