Loading...
HomeMy Public PortalAbout10-24-2007 Workshop Meeting September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 1 of 15 MINUTES Board of Commissioners Monthly Workshop Monday, September 24, 2007 – 7:00 p.m. Town Barn PRESENT: Mayor Tom Stevens, Commissioners Frances Dancy, Michael Gering, Evelyn Lloyd, and Brian Lowen. PLANNING BOARD: Tom Campanella,Edna Ellis, Kathleen Faherty, and Dave Remington. STAFF: Planning Director Margaret Hauth and Town Attorney T.C. Morphis. GUESTS: Tom O’Connor, Marshall Gray, Joe Dye, Brian Purdy, and Beth Trahos. 1.Open the Workshop. 7: 05:54 PM Mayor Stevens called the meeting to order. Ms. Hauth noted that the Planning Board was expected to join the meeting at approximately 7:30 p.m. 2.Agenda Changes and Agenda Approval. 7:06:32 PM Commissioner Gering asked to add a discussion on the Government Affairs Subcommittee of the Chamber of Commerce. Mayor Stevens suggested adding that as Item 5a. Commissioner Lloyd suggested hearing that after the Planning Board had left. Commissioner Gering said he would prefer to leave it as Item 5a. There was no objection from the Board. Upon a motion by Commissioner Lowen, seconded by Commissioner Dancy, the Board moved to approve the agenda as amended by a vote of 5-0. The motion was declared passed. 3.Recommend the Orange County Board of Commissioners re-appoint Frances Dancy to the Chapel Hill-Orange County Visitors Bureau. 7:07:43 PM Commissioner Lloyd asked if Commissioner Dancy was interested in staying on the Visitor’s Bureau. Commissioner Dancy replied yes, she was happy to do so. Upon a motion by Commissioner Lloyd, seconded by Commissioner Gering, the Board moved to recommend to the Orange County Board of Commissioners the reappointment Commissioner Dancy to the Chapel Hill-Orange County Visitors Bureau by a vote of 4-0. The motion was declared passed. 1 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 2 of 15 4. Interview and consider appointment of two in-Town candidates for two in-Town vacancies on the Water and Sewer Advisory Committee. 7:08:43 PM The Board interviewed Tom O’Connor and Marshall Gray for the two in-Town vacancies on the Water and Sewer Advisory Committee. Mr. O’Connor introduced himself to the Board and provided some brief information on his background, education, and interests. Mr. Gray introduced himself to the Board, noting he had lived in Cornwallis Hills for a year and one half. He provided some brief information on his background, education, and interests. Upon a motion by Commissioner Lowen, seconded by Commissioner Lloyd, the Board moved to approve the appointments of Tom O’Connor and Marshall Gray to the Water and Sewer Advisory Board by a vote of 5-0. The motion was declared passed. 5. Discussion/Presentation about possible Continuing Care Retirement Center to be integrated into the Corbinton Commons project. 7:13:57 PM Ms. Hauth said due to a scheduling conflict, this item would not be heard this evening. She asked the Board when they would like to reschedule this item. Ms. Hauth stated the representatives had requested 15-20 minutes for the presentation, and suggested either the October regular meeting or the October workshop. Mayor Stevens suggested leaving it to staff to fit it in on either of those two meetings. The Board agreed by consensus. 5a. Discussion on Government Affairs Subcommittee of the Chamber of Commerce. 7:15:43 PM Commissioner Gering stated he had been appointed to represent the Board on the Government Affairs Subcommittee of the Chamber of Commerce, but they had changed their rd meeting times to the morning of the 3 Tuesday, and he was not able to attend at that time. He offered the Board members the opportunity to replace him on that Subcommittee. Commissioner Gering noted the meetings were held at the Chamber’s Churton Street offices, and normally began at 8:30 a.m. He said the meetings typically lasted between one hour and one and one-half hours. Mayor Stevens said if someone would volunteer, he would serve as a back-up. Commissioner Gering stated that he held ex officio status and acted as a liaison between this Board and the Subcommittee, so it would not hold up the Subcommittee’s work if a Board member did not attend. Mayor Stevens suggested taking this back up at the next meeting. 2 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 3 of 15 7. Committee Updates and Reports. 7:18:23 PM Mayor Stevens suggested hearing Committee Reports at this time, while they were waiting for the Planning Board to join the meeting. There was no objection from the Board. Visitors Bureau – Commissioner Dancy stated last Thursday she had attended the FTZ Trade Zone meeting in Oxford, noting it was held at the Revlon Plant. She said they had recently approved that plant as a trade zone, and had found the employees to be paid well and happy in their jobs. Commissioner Dancy distributed some brochures she had obtained from the Visitors Bureau meeting last week, noting the brochures would be placed in various locations all over Town. Tourism Board – Commissioner Gering stated the Tourism Board was scheduling an hour and a half at the October meeting to receive the report from the Jennings Marketing Group about the branding effort they had been contracted to provide. He said the Tourism Board had also given Ms. Hauth feedback regarding the wayfinding signage proposal. Ms. Hauth commented the information had been mailed out on Friday, and expected to begin receiving proposals by mid- October. Solid Waste Advisory Committee – Commissioner Lowen stated the Solid Waste Advisory Committee would be meeting on October 10 in the afternoon to make final decisions on the future of the recycling centers throughout the County. He said they would be making decisions on which ones to close, and if others should be kept open if a transfer station was added. Assembly of Governments - Commissioner Gering stated he had attended the Assembly of Governments meeting, and one thing that touched on Hillsborough was a discussion about having a more regional approach to transportation planning. He said that was because Chatham County and Chapel Hill were getting much more aligned as far as their approach to growth, and shared a lot of the same transportation concerns and some of the resources that could be utilized in regards to bus stops and other elements. Commissioner Gering said it was possible that Hillsborough would be asked to participate in a regional planning task force or to participate through the TAC. 7:24:54 PM Mayor Stevens thanked Commissioner Gering for attending that meeting. He said as Waterstone and Carolina North were developed they would see a convergence of regional planning. Commissioner Gering said there had been some discussion of Jordan Lake and the allocation for OWASA and some others, and there had been a brief mention of an allocation that was given back in the 1980’s that included a portion for Hillsborough. Ms. Hauth stated at one time Hillsborough did have an allocation from Jordan Lake for water, and after studying the mechanics of what it would take to move the water from the Lake to Hillsborough the Board at that time had said thanks, but they would pass. She said the Town had turned its allocation back in because of how difficult it would be to bring the water into Town. 3 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 4 of 15 Commissioner Lloyd said the expense would have been extraordinary, and the Board at that time had decided not to accept it. Commissioner Gering asked had any consideration been given to its economic value before it was given back. Commissioner Lloyd said at that time they had not thought they would need it, but was sure if given the opportunity again the Board would reconsider. She said her memory was the water would have to come through OWASA. Ms. Hauth said at that time she believed it was necessary that the Town make a cash contribution in order to stay in the allocation program. Break 7:28:01 PM Mayor Stevens called for a short break to allow the Planning Board time to join the meeting. 6. Joint Workshop with Planning Board to receive presentation and discussion of concept plans and renderings from American Asset Corporation relative to the Daniel Boone/Collins application. 7:34:08 PM Mayor Stevens called the Joint Workshop to order. He stated that the Town Board and the Planning Board would receive a presentation and discuss the concept plans and renderings from American Asset Corporation relative to the Daniel Boone/Collins application. Mayor Stevens stated that today the Boards would receive a response to some of the comments and questions that came out of the last meeting, as well as discuss any new ideas or issues. 7:34:50 PM Joe Dye, with American Asset Corporation and speaking as the applicant, provided an brief overview of what would be presented: a reduction in the number of housing units to 850; the provision of more open space; more central open space; expanded space for civic and municipal use; and, the 12-acre school site. Commissioner Lowen asked if the 850 units were for all types of housing. Mr. Dye said that was correct. 7:37:08 PM Brian Purdy, John R. McAdams Company, provided a summary of the plans presented over the last 10 months, noting that after public comment they had decided to break the project out and integrate the uses throughout the site more holistically. He said after the work session last month, they had taken all the ideas and comments and looked to see how the plan could be changed to make it stronger. Mr. Purdy stated the new plan represented a break out of the uses throughout the Collins site, with the southern portion dedicated more to multi-family residential, that is, apartments, condos, or townhomes. He said the residential was focused closer to the school site to the north, providing a better transition as you move from the retail. Mr. Purdy said to the north was the proposed 12+ acre school site, and they were introducing the potential for a 3.5-acre 4 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 5 of 15 community/civic use. He said both of those parcels comprised about 15.5 acres, and ideally the ballfields would be located within the school site. Mr. Purdy then described what the site could potentially look like, using scale drawings that depicted: how the residential blended with the commercial/retail by Churton Street; how the larger green space, about 2 acres in size, was an opportunity for gathering space; how the larger green space near the multi-family area could also be used for various purposes including gathering space; that possibly a few of the office/institutional buildings could flank the multi- family/residential community space; how the single-family residential could conceptually be placed; how the road networks tied everything together; and, the proposed location for a civic/community building near the school site. 7:42:08 PM Mr. Purdy provided some representational perspective drawings that provided bird’s eye views of the plans. He pointed out various focal points, such as the retail shops, tree- lined streets, community gathering space, the residential areas, and the school site. Mr. Dye stated that many of the elements depicted were directly related to the Town’s guidelines, including streets and sidewalks, which were used as a framework to develop this plan. He said the undulation of the road followed the highline of the topography of the site, in response to previous questions about how the topography would be utilized. Mr. Dye stated they had paid attention to how the elements coming off the main road would fit in as you came back into the residential areas. 7:46:10 PM Ms. Faherty asked about the second road depicted on the drawings. Mr. Purdy stated that was the connection to Orange Grove Road, and for consistency they were illustratively showing a potential connection to US 70. Mr. Purdy invited the group to take a closer look at the drawings. The Boards did so. Commissioner Gering asked for an explanation of the direction of the renderings. Mr. Purdy provided an explanation. Commissioner Gering stated at a previous meeting someone had asked about the visual appearance of cutting all the trees on the mountain, and putting houses and roads in. Mr. Purdy stated that was a challenging topography, and the rendering was an attempt to visual what it might look like. 7:49:38 PM Mr. Campanella asked if there was a plan that showed the topography under it. Mr. Purdy said not at this time, noting that layer had not yet been produced. He said a topography map had been provided with the information, as well as a watershed delineation map that showed the delineation of the ridgelines on the property. 7:50:30 PM Mr. Remington said he could visualize a band shell on this site. Mr. Purdy agreed, noting at some point an amphitheater could be added. Mayor Stevens asked about the location of parking. Mr. Purdy stated it was massed behind the buildings with some along Churton Street, and the idea was to screen it as much as possible. He 5 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 6 of 15 said they were not planning to have large expanses of open parking, adding the parking areas would be broken up with plantings of trees and shrubbery. Mr. Campanella asked how large the green spaces were compared with the green spaces at Southern Village. Mr. Purdy stated he did not know, but noted one area was about an acre and the other was just over 1 ½ acres. Mr. Campanella stated he would like to know the green area of Southern village just for reference. Mr. Purdy said for reference the first green area was about 150 wide by about 300 feet long. 7:55:45 PM Mayor Stevens suggested that as soon as everyone finished looking at the pictures that they return to their seats to continue the discussion. After everyone was seated, Mayor Stevens asked if anyone had further questions. Beth Trahos, representing the applicant, stated they had no further presentation. She said they wanted to obtain additional feedback from the boards as to whether or not, in concept, they were moving in the right direction. Mr. Campanella stated that as an urban design scheme it was a competent scheme that created some compelling spaces and environments. He said the Boards did need to see the scheme against the topography, because there was some extreme topography on the site. Mr. Campanella said the design may work on the uphill vista, but the views did not show that topography. Mr. Campanella stated he would also like the site to show the possibility of a future rail station or transit facility of some sort. Mr. Dye stated that a school site had recently been developed in Charlotte that included a CAT facility on the southern rail line. He said it was a sterling example of what could be done with a joint venture with a school. 7:59:53 PM Commissioner Gering asked if the space set aside for the school large enough to service all three purposes; that is, a transit node, a school, and civic/municipal space. Mr. Dye said that was hard to say without knowing exactly how the site was used. He said the 3.5 acres could be a community service building, a police and fire substation, a combination thereof, or anything else that was chosen. Mr. Dye said the school itself would have an urban design, and could be used in the evenings for recreation, for meeting space, for adult education, or other services. He said the ability to be creative with the design would allow for those other uses. Commissioner Gering said if you add the third element of a rail stop, what would be needed to make all three work in that northern space. Mr. Dye stated that one idea was to use the Charlotte model, which he believed would work comfortably in that space. Ms. Hauth suggested contacting the City of Charlotte and asking them to share the plans for that site. Commissioner Gering agreed. 8:02:21 PM Ms. Faherty said regarding that northern space and the possibility of a transit node, it had been mentioned that there was space set aside in the Hampton Pointe property for a transit node. She said that area already had the railroad going by it. Ms. Faherty asked if the upper northern space noted as part of the school would remain baseball fields. Mr. Dye said it 6 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 7 of 15 was up to the County and the Town to make that final determination. He said that the 12 acres had been offered to the County for the school site, and that area had been reorganized to get the school in a better location in regard to the terminus of the road. 8:05:46 PM Commissioner Lloyd asked if she wanted to attend a baseball game at that site, how would she get there from Churton Street. Mr. Dye indicated the route on the map. Commissioner Lloyd said if they decided the civic/municipal space should be a fire station, would that space be appropriate in regards to easy access. Mr. Dye said if they chose to use that space for a fire station or a similar use, that parcel would provide good ingress and egress. Commissioner Lloyd asked if that 3.5 acres was all the land the applicant was willing to give the Town for civic/municipal use. Mr. Dye said that was their current plan. Ms. Trahos stated that the school site would be dedicated to the County. Mr. Remington said in regards to access, should a fire station or other emergency use be made of the civic/municipal space, arrangements would need to be made at intersections to provide emergency vehicles with preemptive signal timing to allow signals to go to green for those vehicles. 8:10:03 PM Mr. Remington said if it appeared that a transit station became a reality, it might call for some shifting of the single-family versus the multi-family areas. He said he was not suggesting that it be changed now, only that it should be kept in mind. Mr. Campanella stated ideally, if you had a rail station it would be nice to have a mixed-use, transit-oriented development. He said if there was a school and other institutional functions in that area, he did not know if there would be room for a rail station as well. Mr. Campanella stated that rail station in Charlotte discussed earlier would be too huge for Hillsborough, noting it looked like a parking garage. Mr. Dye commented they had used it only as an example of what could be done, but on a smaller scale. Mr. Campanella stated a smaller facility with a reduced footprint would be something that could be integrated easily with a school, if a school indeed went on that site. 8:13:57 PM Mayor Stevens said there was a presupposition that they would continue to use the area as a recreation area, so there was some continuity but it did not necessarily have to be that way. Mr. Purdy said they had tried to make that point, in that they had weighed the needs of the community against some other kind of use. 8:14:21 PM Ms. Faherty asked Mr. Purdy to reiterate what the green stripes across the middle of the site were. Mr. Purdy said that was the existing power easement, and the idea was to provide a greenway trail all along that easement that would eventually take you back out to Churton Street. 8:15:12 PM Mayor Stevens said regarding the area noted for single-family housing, with other developments they had talked about methods other than clear-cutting and then replanting. He said he understood that might be on a lot-by-lot basis, but asked if there were some design standards to allow for the preservation of some of the existing foliage or trees. Mr. Purdy said he 7 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 8 of 15 did not believe there was any specific language regarding that, noting they had focused on creating buffers where you would want to preserve as much of the foliage and trees as possible. He said another design concept they had discussed was trying to create a grid pattern to make the orientation of the development work. Mr. Purdy said you certainly would not want to clear-cut but you would have to make all the roads work in conjunction with one another. He said there would not be wholesale clear-cutting of the entire site, but there would be significant grading to make the grid system work within the topography. 8:17:26 PM Ms. Faherty asked if the residential units now being proposed was 850 total. Mr. Purdy said that was correct. 8:18:31 PM Commissioner Lloyd noted the fact that having only two ways in and out of the development was bothersome for her. She said this was coming before South Churton Street was widened, which was not their fault, but this plan seemed to be ahead of the existing road system. Regarding the businesses, Commissioner Lloyd asked would there be apartments on top of some of the businesses, or would they be single story. Mr. Purdy stated their traffic engineer had studied the plan as a whole, and from an engineering standpoint there was significant improvements from the intersection at US 70A all the way down Churton Street past the interchange with I-85 that would be required to make the commercial work as well as the residential as a whole. He said some of their plans already presented were representative of what those improvements would need to be and how that would impact traffic. Regarding the density concerns expressed, Mr. Purdy said the plan was for single-story commercial development, with some multi-level apartments and townhomes, with single-family homes of one and two stories. He said it was more of a density concern to keep the number of units at 850 and integrate the residential horizontally rather than on top of each other. 8:23:13 PM Commissioner Lloyd said her concern stemmed from having buildings too high for fire trucks to adequately serve them. She said she wanted anything built to be within acceptable levels for fire safety. Commissioner Lloyd said she was also concerned about how the businesses would be placed and how they would relate to the site as a whole, noting there were many other things to think about as well. She said it would be helpful to have a plan with everything drawn in and catalogued as to what its purpose was. Commissioner Lloyd asked about the piece of property on the other side of I-85. Mr. Purdy noted it was designated as green space. 8:26:01 PM Mr. Remington commented that he liked the idea of the two green areas. He said when they had talked about redevelopment in the Churton Street area, he had thought about having a park area rather than an area for organized sports. He said he had envisioned an area that could be used for outdoor concerts, park benches and other passive uses that could perhaps be surrounded by a mix of residences and businesses. 8:27:23 PM Commissioner Dancy said she was thinking about the historic value of these two properties, and some of the things in the Daniel Boone complex now that could be used as a focal point for the redevelopment. She suggested things like the blacksmith’s shop or some other 8 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 9 of 15 historic item could be incorporated into the new development. Mr. Purdy stated that some interest had been expressed in recycling or at least reclaiming some of the materials in the existing village area, so there was an opportunity to do something like that. He said there was a lot of good siding and timber in some of the buildings that could be used in creative ways. 8:29:03 PM Mayor Stevens said he could envision coming down that street and seeing some of those materials used, perhaps even on building fronts. He said it would make it an interesting street to be on, and could be a draw for visitors, and would make it a unique place to live and to visit. He suggested there would always be a question of whether you could get enough commercial in there, and if it competed with the downtown or other areas. Mayor Stevens said it almost looked like another downtown, and did not know if that was a good thing or bad thing. Mayor Stevens said he did see the potential, particularly with a park or some unique elements brought forward from the existing Daniel Boone complex that defined it. 8:30:13 PM Ms. Faherty said the green areas were an attractive prospect and addressed comments from the last workshop. She asked who would be responsible for taking care of those green areas after construction. Ms. Trahos said it could be maintained by the owners association or maintained by the Town if that was the preference. Mr. Purdy said what was typically done was that you looked at the right-of-way internal to that green space, and what was inside that was managed and maintained by the homeowners association. Ms. Faherty said that took her back to her earlier question about whether those areas were only for the people who lived there or was it something that was intentionally desired to be for the public. Mr. Purdy said he did not believe there would be anything that would preclude seasonal activities within those areas. He said that it would be open space, and anyone who wanted to come and use it could do so. 8:32:34 PM Mayor Stevens said these were pertinent questions, noting part of it was would the space become a community space in the larger sense by connecting their various communities, or did it become a community that was competing with other parts of the community. He said they were desirous of something that blended with the larger community but stood on its own. 8:34:12 PM Commissioner Gering said regarding connectivity, he would still need to see some bicycle and pedestrian connectivity to downtown. He said he believed this plan was heading in the right direction, noting he liked the increased green space and the additional municipal space. Commissioner Gering said he was still unhappy with the total number of dwelling units, noting there was still too many. He said he wanted to understand more about the potential train station and how that would work with the municipal space and the school, and how much light would be needed. Commissioner Gering said as far as the dwelling units, he did not know what formula was used to arrive at 850 units, but it appeared to him it should include more office and institutional and less residential. Mr. Purdy stated they could consider that, but it was a balance of the diversity of 9 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 10 of 15 those unit types, whether it was single-family homes, apartments or townhomes. He said they wanted to balance that diversity with a lower number of units. Commissioner Gering said he understood the need and accepted hard density requirements, so for him the problem was the total number of dwelling units. 8:36:43 PM Commissioner Dancy said she believed it was important to have connectivity to the downtown, noting that biking and walking trails were important. She said she saw this as an opportunity to be creative in connecting Hillsborough’s downtown to this area, which would cause people to walk or bike or run between the two areas. Commissioner Dancy said there were things you could do to attract the usage between both areas. 8:37:45 PM Ms. Faherty commented that baseball was an important pastime in Hillsborough and HYAA was a wonderful organization. She said it had been indicated that the fields could be at the school, but that should be thought out because the fields were operated by HYAA and ownership of the fields may be a conflict. Ms. Hauth said the fields still belonged to the family but HYAA had a “handshake” understanding for use of the fields. Ms. Faherty said if the land was given to the County for school property, she believed it would be a shame to suffer a net loss of baseball space. She said she did not want to risk loosing or diminishing such space, but wanted to increase such space. Mr. Purdy said everything was a concept at this time. Ms. Faherty said the issue was if the land was given to Orange County, would it still remain as baseball fields. Commissioner Gering suggested a condition could be placed on the land that the fields remain. 8:41:25 PM Mr. Remington questioned the number of access points, noting he believed the long-term vision should have additional access points that would tie into one of the streets in Boone Square. He said such a connection would be advantageous in the future as far as moving vehicles in and out. Mr. Purdy agreed that an additional connection point would be desirable and should likely be identified now. 8:42:57 PM Mayor Stevens asked about the transition for the existing businesses in Daniel Boone and the infrastructure necessary. Mr. Purdy said they had made a commitment to not disturb those businesses for a period of at least 12 months. He said construction of the road and the water and sewer that went with that would be the beginning of meaningful development. Mr. Purdy said the build-out for this area and the residential component was around 5 years, and that 5 years would not start until that meaningful development of the land began. He said it would likely take 12 to 24 months of planning before starting a meaningful level of development. Mayor Stevens said he agreed that the plans were moving in a more positive direction. He asked for additional thoughts or comments on affordable housing from the applicant. 8:45:00 PM Mr. Dye stated previously they had a discussion on quality versus quality, noting the number of families displaced by this development numbered around 30. He said they were proposing 20 affordable units, although 30 might be workable. Mr. Dye said they had focused 10 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 11 of 15 on single-family units being 3-bedroom, two baths, which was preferred by Robert Dowling at Orange Community Housing. He said perhaps there needed to be more variety, and 30 may dictate a greater mix of something other than just single-family to help balance that. Mayor Stevens said he was hearing that they were willing to increase the number of affordable units, and having a mix of single-family and other. Mr. Dye said that was correct. 8:46:30 PM Ms. Faherty said at the last workshop there was some discussion of what the houses would look like, noting she did not want everything to look the same. She asked if it would all be designed by the developer, or could people buy lots and build at will. She also asked if the residential component would have a stylistic theme. Mr. Dye stated they did not want everything to look the same, but would want it to compliment. He said they would want some level of variety but not altogether different, either. Ms. Faherty asked if the dotted lines on the plans were potential roads. Mr. Dye replied yes. Ms. Faherty asked if there was a point where they went under the power lines. Mr. Dye said they would have to consider some crossover points. 8:48:54 PM Mayor Stevens said there were some minor design guidelines that spoke about such things as orientation, garages and setbacks. He asked if that was already in the current design guidelines. Mr. Dye said the intent was to have the orientation of the buildings towards the street, but did not recall specific language regarding garages. He said the idea was that you could open your front door and get out to the street, not open your garage to get out to the street. Mayor Stevens said that was particularly important, that sidewalks came to the front door and not the driveway. He said they would favor designs that put garages in the back or at least recessed, or some combination thereof. Mr. Dye pointed out on the plan how the homes and garages were oriented. Mr. Purdy said the plan also showed illustratively the eastern side of the main road and the homes fronting there with direct driveway access. He said that could also be provided in the rear, but the homes would still face the front to give a pedestrian feel. Mr. Dye said they would also look at different architectural fenestrations to the homes to keep from getting a “cookie cutter” effect on the front elevations. 8:51:12 PM Mayor Stevens said some variation in mass and design was preferable. He said using Waterstone as an example, they had found that the designs were too similar. Then, he said, a different builder was brought in and they had the opportunity to renegotiate that. Mayor Stevens said that was important as the design aspects evolved that tended to promote community and a neighborhood feeling. Mr. Dye said they would monitor what was happening, what the quality level was, and how things looked as they sold pieces of land. He said it would not replace input at the Town level, but it would be a first blush of what it would take to make the development look as good as everyone wanted it to look. 8:52:51 PM Mr. Campanella stated he believed they were moving in the right direction. 11 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 12 of 15 8:52:58 PM Ms. Ellis asked had there been any change to the traffic pattern on Churton Street, that is was it still right in and right out. Mr. Dye said one of their challenges was that they did not have a lot of frontage to close a lot of driveways, but the ones they did control would be closed so that there would be a primary entrance at Mayo Street and then a right-in/right-out further to the north. He said their plans show medians at the appropriate spots, so even those areas that did have direct access would have to circulate on a bigger pattern to help facilitate the flow of traffic up and down Churton Street. Mayor Stevens said then it might actually reduce some of that congestion. Mr. Dye said it would help alleviate so much crossover movement, in that you would have to travel more up and down rather than across. Ms. Ellis said the traffic coming on to Churton Street was a real problem for her. She said it would only create more problems for people in Town. 8:54:36 PM Commissioner Lowen appreciated the changes made in terms of handling the traffic issues. He said when they got to the SUP stage it would be nice if they were able to connect to one or two of the streets coming through the property. He said his biggest concern was what may or may not happen with the access over the railroad, noting he believed a lot of people would come down Highway 70A to access this development. Commissioner Lowen said those railroad tracks needed to be kept on the radar as they moved forward. Mr. Dye said their plan was to make sure that that became dedicated right-of-way, and they would push as hard as they could to do that. He said their goal was to have a road there for connection at some point. 8:56:21 PM Mayor Stevens said they would continue to look at the fiscal implications for the Town, noting even the most perfect plan still had to work. He said they were concerned that the current residents not become burdened with some of the transition costs, even if there was a positive flow later. Mr. Dye said getting feedback that they were moving in a positive direction indicated that their next step would be to “sharpen their pencils” on the fiscal impacts and the aspects of affordable housing and so on. He said they were looking at an end of the year timeframe, and wanted to focus on the bigger intangibles not seen in the plan, now that they know that were heading in the right direction. Mr. Dye said certainly one of those was the fiscal impacts and some of the elements of affordable housing that were also critical elements of the Master Plan. 8:57:57 PM Mr. Remington wanted to make sure they did not loose site of the Churton Street streetscape, that is, the question of whether it was a six foot median or the lighter median in the Churton Street Corridor Plan. He said from what he saw when comparing them it would certainly fit within the right-of-way. 8:58:47 PM Ms. Ellis asked had they considered using green building techniques for the residential component. Mr. Dye said the current guidelines contained sustainable ideas, although it was not to a LEED standard. He said the Durham HBA had a green building program that they were studying. Mr. Dye said they had incorporated into the planning the use of Energy Star appliances, as well as using a water conservation plan either as a whole or by parcel. He said 12 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 13 of 15 more research would be done on using green building methods and how those might affect other elements of the plan. Ms. Ellis said they only had so much water, and they did not want to move to Phase 2 any sooner than was necessary. She said they should not expect the Town to contribute financially. Ms. Ellis asked if they would be building this development or would they be selling the land to someone else to build the houses and they would build the commercial, or some other scenario. Mr. Dye said they would build the commercial property, and would partner with someone to build the residential component. He said another possibility would be that they would sell the parcels, in that one developer would build the single-family homes, another would build the townhomes, and so on. 9:02:28 PM Ms. Faherty asked who would build the roads. Mr. Dye said it depended, noting if they had a partner it would be coordinated with them. He said they had considered that if they were selling it in segments then certainly the infrastructure would need to be present for access. 9:03:08 PM Commissioner Lowen asked Mr. Dye if he would provide Ms. Hauth with electronic copies of what he had presented this evening. Mr. Dye agreed to do so. 9:03:57 PM Mayor Stevens asked Ms. Hauth was there anything that she could point to that they should be asking of the applicant that they had overlooked. Ms. Hauth responded that there were two things that came to mind, and one of them had been touched on. She said Ms. Faherty had asked who the green space would belong to. Ms. Hauth said in Waterstone, because of the street tree program, the homeowners association had accepted responsibility for the long-term maintenance of all the landscaping within the right-of-way. She said that saved the Town money in the long run. Ms. Hauth said you could work out an agreement about how public was the public space, so that should be kept in mind. Ms. Hauth said something not focused on was the residential driveways onto the streets, and how busy those streets might be. She said rather than have residential driveways on those primary streets they may want to look at a different arrangement, such as some type of alleys. She said it was just something to keep in mind, noting she did not think it was necessarily something that had to be talked about at the Master Plan level but was better carried into the SUP level. Mayor Stevens stated he would ask the Town Attorney to draft some language so they could have the option of having some specificity regarding that. Ms. Hauth said they had talked about the school and who would actually get the land. She said staff had thought about that, and although it was designated as a school site the question was whether it needed to be owned by the County. Or, she said, could the Town own it so that the benefit came to the Town, then work a lease agreement with the County. Ms. Hauth said that had never been done, but that did not mean it was necessarily a bad idea. She said there were ways to make it work so that it was a win-win for everyone. 9:07:29 PM Mayor Stevens said essentially what Ms. Hauth was saying was that area noted as a school site could be dedicated to the Town, then the Town would negotiate what was a school, 13 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 14 of 15 what might be a fire station, or what might be some other use. Ms. Hauth said they could capture the intent for a school to be there with conditions so that the applicant had a guarantee that the Town would do what it said it would do. But, she said, there were ways to be creative about how that was done. Mayor Stevens asked would it make sense to continue to have another joint meeting, or should this now go straight to the Planning Board. Ms. Ellis said she would like to have another joint meeting. Mayor Stevens said he was leaning in that direction as well. Ms. Hauth said the next step was to determine whether the applicant was close enough to let them finish their proposal and bring it back for public hearing. She said they would likely need a ruling from the Town Attorney as to whether the plan was different enough to trigger a new public hearing. Mr. Morphis commented that since the dwelling units had been reduced by 250 units, that was likely enough to trigger a new public hearing. He said he would consult with Bob Hornik, but believed a new public hearing would be necessary. Ms. Hauth noted when they got to the fiscal analysis of the project, another round of hearings would be necessary in any case. She said there was some expectation by the applicants that there would be another round of hearings once they got closer to the final package. Ms. Hauth asked if they were saying tonight that the applicants were close enough to the final package or did they want another round of workshops. 9:11:42 PM Mayor Stevens said that was the question he was posing. Mr. Remington said the believed the public would want to see the changes, so perhaps something like an open house would be beneficial as well as another hearing. Mayor Stevens asked if they were close enough to a final package that a public hearing would be meaningful. 9:12:23 PM Commissioner Gering said from his perspective it had not gone far enough to go to a public hearing. He said the plan should be reworked and discussed again in a workshop format. Mr. Dye said he would like to come back with a final proposal at the next workshop, keeping in mind that they had a self-imposed end-of-the-year deadline. He said at that next workshop they would like to have a roadmap of where they would go from there. There was general agreement that an additional workshop would be held. Ms. Hauth suggested that unless they were going to delay this longer, she suggested putting this on the agenda for the October workshop. 14 September 24, 2007 Monthly Workshop ApprovedNovember 13. 2007 Page 15 of 15 8. Other It was noted that the next workshop would be held on October 22 at 7:00 p.m. in the Town Barn. 9. Adjourn Upon a motion by Commissioner Gering, seconded by Commissioner Lloyd, the Board moved to adjourn the meeting at 9:17 PM by a vote of 5-0. The motion was declared passed. 15