HomeMy Public PortalAbout2008-01-15 PC Minutes VILLAGE OF PLAINFIELD PLAN COMMISSION MEETING RECORD OF MINUTES DATE : JANUARY 15, 2008 LOCATION: Village Hall Chairman Sobkoviak cal led the m eeting of the Plan Commission to order at 7:04 p.m. ROLL CALL: Present: Commissioners Kachel , Renzi, Bonuchi, and Sanders ; Chairman Sobkoviak; and the Representative from the Plainfield Fire Protection District , and Plainfield Park District Absent: Commissioners McKay, and O’Rourke; Ex -Officio Commissioner Cox; Plainfield School District , Library District , and Plainfield Police Department Also Present: Michael Garrigan – Village Planner Village of Plainfield, Jonathan Proulx – Planner I I Village of Plainfield, Mike Schwarz – Planner II Village of Plainfield, Sara Leach – Planner Village of Plainfield, Caro l Millan – Secretary Village of Plainfield, and Steve Amann – Baxter and Woodman MINUTES: The minutes from the Plan Commission meeting of December 18 , 2007 were accepted as amended. Commissioner Sanders asked that the following change be made: Page 23, 3 rd stipulation wording for the motion made at 11:12 p.m. to read “as outlined by the four Village Planners who were present” instead of “as outlined in staff’s report.” DEVELOPMENT REPORT Michael Garrigan gave the development report. The Village Board considered the following cases: 1. Vista Pointe – The Village Board directed the Village Attorney to draft the ordinances for Special Use, Rezoning, and the Annexation Agreement. 2. Verizon Wireless – The ordinance for the sign variance was approved. Mich ael reminded the commissioners of a proposed workshop on January 28, 2008 between the Village Board and the Commission. It is an architectural design workshop. OLD BUSINESS: Chairman Sobkoviak moved the Text Amendment to the Sign Code case forward on the agenda. CASE: 1374 -110207.TA TEXT AMENDMENT SIGN CODE Request: Amendment to Village’s Sign Code Location: Village -wide Applicant: Village of Plainfield At 7:08 p.m. Commissioner Kachel made a motion to continue the Text Amendment to the Sign Code to February 19, 2008.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 2 of 23 Commissioner Sanders seconded the motion. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll call. Aye: Kachel, Renzi, Bonuchi, Sanders, Chairman Sobkoviak Nay: 0 The motion is carried 5:0 CASE: 1348 -071207.AA.RZ.SU.CP RIVER V ILLAGE Request: Annexation (Public Hearing) Special Use (Public Hearing) Rezoning (Public Hearing) Concept Plan Location: Route 59, south of Fraser Road Applicant: Lucky Luke Plainfield Partners, LLC TIME: 7:09 p.m. Michael Garrigan summarize d the staff report. He stated this is the continuation of a public hearing being held pursuant to Village ordinances, State Statutes, and proper notice. This has been continued a number of times since August . Staff has been working with the applicant an d the Village Engineer, and the project is now at a point to be present ed . This is approximately 222 acres located on Route 59, north of the DuPage River and South of Fraser Road. The applicant is asking for a rezoning of the commercial portion of the pr operty. This would contain 415,000 square feet of commercial space and a total of 600 residential units. Two -thirds of the property is located in a floodway or floodplain. The majority of the site is currently within the Village’s municipal boundaries a nd is zoned R -1. Approximately 39 acres of the property is currently not within the Village and the applicant wishes to annex that piece of property. Staff believes that this property is a logical extension of the Village boundaries. The applicant is al so proposing a special use for a Planned Development. Michael Garrigan went through the findings of fact for the special use. Staff finds these to be favorable. The applicant is requesting numerous variances to the Village’s Stormwater Ordinances. He d eferred to the Village Engineer to outline the requests. The applicant is requesting a modification of the Village’s current Comprehensive Plan. The Comprehensive Plan basically shows this approximately 220 acres to be low density residential and green way. The applicant is requesting this be changed to medium density residential. The commercial component of this project would reflect a continued development of the 59 Corridor as reflected in the Village’s Comprehensive Plan. The Rt. 59 South Corridor is a sub -chapter in the Comprehensive Plan , which outlines a number of special goals for the Rt. 59 South Corridor. Staff submits that the commercial component of this project facilitates and addresses those long term goals as it relates to enhancing the corridor appearance. The applicant has incorporated extensive architectural guidelines. They will be required to proceed with a future site plan review for each component.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 3 of 23 As part of the proposal, the applicant is proposing two major intersection im provements with future signalization, two full access points on Route 59 . They are also proposing two right -in/right -outs along Route 59. These have been solidified with IDOT. Staff believes the applicant i s addressing the goal of improving the traffic flow concurrent with the future improvements of Rt. 59, which will be completed by IDOT, hopef ully in 2009. Presently, approximately one -half mile of this property is agricultural in prime commercial areas. Staff believes the potential development of thi s property would address the long term goal of developing the future commercial gateway from the south into the Village of Plainfield. The applicant has proposed approximately a one -half mile long pedestrian pathway or sidewalk along the perimeter of the Rt. 59 corridor. M ichael Garrigan stated staff believes the applicant has complied with the 7 standards for a Planned Development in the Village of Plainfield. The applicant is also requesting rezoning of approximately 60 acres to B -3. This property i s currently zoned R -1. This is also a public hearing for the rezoning. He went through the 5 findings of fact for the rezoning. Staff believes the applicant has complied with the findings of fact for the rezoning. Michael went on to say the site poses many, many challenges, but staff believes the applicant has addressed many of those challenges in a very creative manner. He went over the concept plan. He stated the Village’s Traffic Committee did request that the traffic circle adjacent to the propose d school site be shifted to the east or modified in some manner. The Plainfield Police Department also has raised some issues about the existing traffic circle at the school site. The applicant is proposing the extension of Leewood Drive, which would pro vide direct access to the school site from Fraser Road. Leewood Drive would be the only stub street into another residential neighborhood from this development. The applicant is proposed 120 conventional residential lots, 53 neo -traditional residential l ots, and 31 townhomes. They are requesting variances to the setbacks, including 15 feet front yard, 8 feet or 16 feet between buildings side yard, 10 feet corner side yard, and 20 feet to garage rear yard. The applicant is requesting a density bonus. Th e overall density of the residential component of this site is actually below the medium density described in the Comprehensive Plan. It is 1.61 units per acre. That does not include the condominiums , as they are being included in the mixed use commercia l component of this project. Technically, the applicant did not require a density bonus based on the current Comprehensive Plan. Staff is generally comfortable with the residential density as it i s being proposed. Staff believe s there is a variety and d iversity of product within the development. The applicant is proposing a series of large man -made lakes, which will also be used for stormwater management purposes and recreational aspects. Each unit of this development would be adjacent to these water b odies. Staff believes this is a unique aspect of this proposed project. There also is the incorporation of an extensive pathway system, not only along the man -made lakes, but also potentially along the DuPage River . T he int erior pathway system around t he lar ge Commonwealth Edison easement runs through the middle of this development. There is a 3.9 acre park that would open up onto the Commonwealth Edison easement. The applicant is proposing to construct a pedestrian foot bridge over the DuPage River w hich would connect the Village’s extensive pathway system to the south. They are also proposing to incorporate a 1 acre pocket park to the west. There is an extensive pathway or bike trail system throughout this project. There is a pattern book. Archit ectural guidelines and standards have been created for both the commercial and residential components. There is a potential of a possible historical farmstead. This came before the HPC. Michael Garrigan stated it would be the Fritz farmstead located on Rt. 59, approximately along the northeastern portion of the property. The general assessment of the HPC was that this farmstead was clearly worth looking at more carefully. They believe it is a well preserved farmstead and perhaps it would be
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 4 of 23 appropria te to be identified as a potential preservation. The property has been identified in the Village’s Rural Survey as being contributing. There is no formal demolition permit application so it was not a formal hearing before the HPC. Michael Garrigan just wanted to bring this to the Commission’s attention. Chairman Sobkoviak asked if that was just the farmhouse or were all of the out buildings included. Michael Garrigan stated based on the general discussions of the HPC, they also believe the farm buildin gs would have potential for preservation. That includes the house , out buildings , and the centrally located barn. Michael Garrigan stated he would defer to the Village Engineer to discuss the stormwater engineering. The applicant is requesting a number of variances from the Village’s ordinances as it relates to stormwater. There are a number of engineering challenges on this property. Staff believes the applicant has come up with a very unique, innovative project. There is the opportunity to have a ve ry large new commercial gateway into the Village of Plainfield from the south . The applicant is using extensive Best Management Practices. Staff is making a favorable recommendation for annexation, special use for PD, and rezoning. Staff also believes t he concept plan is generally consistent with the Village’s various guidelines and policies with enumerated stipulations. Michael Garrigan concluded his report. Chairman Sobkoviak asked Steve Amann if he cared to comment from an engineering perspective, e specially on the requested variance for replacing the compensatory storage from 1.5:1 to 1:1. Steve Amann stated the variances they talked about with the developer and his engineers have been twofold. The first is the compensatory floodplain storage. Th e compensatory floodplain storage by the current Village Ordinance is at 1.5:1. Chairman Sobkoviak asked if that was by ordinance or by policy. Steve Amann stated it was by ordinance. Steve Amann went on to say that it means that if you pull out a cubic yard of dirt in the floodplain, you have to compensate for it by removing one and one -half cubic yards of dirt somewhere else nearby in the floodplain. It follows the model that was promoted by the Northeastern Illinois Planning Commission several years ago as a model ordinance for the Northeastern Illinois Area. The State regulations and Federal regulations do not require compensatory storage. The Will County Ordinance requires 1:1 compensatory storage. Generally speaking most towns are at a minimum o f 1:1. He felt from an engineering perspective it is difficult to justify going to that 1.5:1 except as a factor of safety. When those regulations first came out it was an attempt to try to remediate for some of the sins of the past when other areas were developed along rivers and creeks without any compensatory storage whatsoever. The developer is actively pursui ng all of the analysis he needs to do to show that this variance he is requesting will still meet these other regulatory requirements. The oth er variance the applicant is requesting is from the detention requirement. The Village Ordinance right now requires twofold detention: f irst of all that you detain the 100 year storm , and secondly that you detain the 2 year storm. Those both are suppose to be stored on site and then released at certain specified release rates. For the 100 year storm, it is .15 cubic feet per second per acre and for the 2 year storm it is .04 cubic foot per second per acre. These rates are in the Village ordinance and w ere promoted by NIPC as a model ordinance for the Northeastern Illinois Area, but they exceed to a great extent many of the ordinances in this area and really throughout the country. What the applicant is pursuing with their variance is a detention syste m that would , in effect , mimic the existing conditions. In other words, ins tead of meeting these mandated release rate s , they would simply create a detention pond with a release system that did not exceed the existing peak rates of runoff from this site u nder undeveloped conditions. That is generally the detention that is seen throughout the country. The Northeastern Illinois Area has kind of raised the bar to
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 5 of 23 this higher level of detention and a more restrictive release rate. Steve Amann stated becau se this project is on the floodplain and involves modifications to the floodway, there is going to be significant regulatory overview by the DNR (Department of Natural Resources), State of Illinois, Army Corps of Engineers, Federal Emergency Management Age ncy and the EPA as well. Commissioner Renzi asked if part of the proposal was to turn over the jurisdiction of the water to the State. Steve Amann answered that was a subject that was talked about with the developer and the applicant. It was really an interpretation of certain aspects of the ordinance relating to the floodway. He stated at the meeting with the developer back in December there was a mutual agreeable interpretation where they were not really giving any of the regulatory floodway authori ty to the State. Steve stated the regulatory review is going to be more e xtensive on this project because of the fact that the DNR has to review everything, as well as the Village of Plainfield. Commissioner Renzi had a question about the .15 and .04 flo w rates for the 100 year storm and 2 year storm. He figured t here had to be a reason why it was thought these flow rates were necessary. Steve Amann stated the .15 cfs/acre, which is the 100 year release rate, was based on a study that NIPC did some time ago that tried to access the natural capacity of the streams system in this area ; and because there is fairly flat typography in the Northeastern Illinois Area, streams really do not convey a lot of flow because they do not move very fast. They wanted to more closely replicate the natural drainage conditions in these streams that would have existed prior to any development in this area. Commissioner Renzi asked if we were not stepping back away from the flow standards. Steve Amann stated predevelopment standards are actually pre -farming. This is when there were marshes, swamps , forests, and native prairies in the area. That is the type of system they were looking at under the “natural conditions.” Right now, there are farms on this property and they h ave a much higher rate of runoff than was the case when it was a prairie, wetland, or forest back 200 years ago. Commissioner Renzi asked if it would not be better to have a development that has a water flow that maybe doesn’t have to go to the standards, but still would leave the water in a better place than it is right now under the farming conditions. Steve Amann stated you get that when you follow the ordinances. T he peak rates of flow are significantly reduced when you detain and restrict the flows. Commissioner Renzi had concerns about the quality of water entering the DuPage River. He wondered w here the natural cleansing was going to take place. His major concern was that if we know ahead of time that there will be dirty water entering the River , then why should we not take the opportunity to enhance the runoff. Steve Amann stated we should, and the development is taking care of this. One of the aspects of this development is the extensive Best Management Practices that will be part of this pro ject. The developer is actually promoting mo re Best Management Practices tha n have been seen even in the Grande Meadow Project. Because it is just a concept plan, there still needs to be details worked out. Chairman Sobkoviak suggested that the Commiss ion wait for the petitioner to explain how he is going to manage the stormwater. Steve Amann stated the oth er thing is the developer does have detention on this site. It is just not going to all run off into the River. There will be some pass through cl eansing in the ponds and the on -site BMP’s of this water from the grass and the parking lots and everything else before it actually gets to the River. Commissioner Renzi asked if Steve felt that with the additional work that is being done if that would th en allow for the compensatory relief that is being sought by the developer and address the flooding issues and cleansing issues. Steve Amann stated yes. He stated the Best Management Practices rely to a great extent
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 6 of 23 on infiltration of the surface water into the ground to clean it before it hits the water table and then goes into the River. The BMP’s do not work when the ground is frozen, which is one of the basis for the design of the detention ponds to hold back that water. In a rainfall event, a lot of water is just going to infiltrate into the ground water and is not actually going to show up in those detention ponds. The water will then be filtered through the ground water, through the soils, and into the River. Chairman Sobkoviak swore in all th e people representing the petitioner. John Philipchuck was the first to speak. He stated he is the attorney representing the petitioner. He stated they are very excited about the plans. The petitioner showed a PowerPoint of the project. John Philipc huck then introduced the rest of the team: Jennifer Mitchell, Metro Transportation Group – traffic engineer; Pat Davidson, civil engineer; Christian Smith, stormwater expert; and Brian Talman, worked on land plan and pattern book in conjunction with the v arious consultants. John Philipchuck went through some of the findings in the staff report. He stated the petitioner has selected some potential uses that there is a need for in the community (nice banquet facility, a hotel that would have a water park e lement, etc.). They need to still talk to staff and need to further perceive the idea of the civic center, expo center for the community with the Village Board. The petitioner has used the River to promote restaurant use. He stated the school obligation for this particular development would be 6.26 acres. The developer is proposing to donate almost another 6 acres of land to provide for the school site. They are proposing a 12.5 acres dedication. They will be working with the Park District for some la nd and cash in lieu. They would like an easement along the Riverfront. The developer is proposing a pedestrian bridge to link up the trails for bike and pedestrian usage. He stated it is a concept plan and they feel it justifies the request to make modi fications to the Comprehensive Plan. He stated the petitioner feels they have tied the areas together and have the buffers within the development, as well as around the perimeter with the River, and the Commonwealth Edison property. He stated the petitio ner did a Fiscal Impact Analysis and the numbers indicate a very positive cash flow to the Village of Plainfield. He stated they can support their densities even without the density bonus issues. It is a destination point for the community. Christian Sm ith, the stormwater specialist, spoke second. He stated this project reminds him of the Chicago Premium Outlots on I -88 and Farnsworth in Aurora, IL. He stated that was a complex project because of the floodplain, floodway aspects. He stated this is the same type of thing along Rt. 59. He stated they wanted to understand the river system on the DuPage River that flows through here down underneath Rt. 59 and on past Caton Farm Road. There is a gauge to the south that gives an understanding of what the h istoric discharge or water flow versus elevation is on the river. They took that very seriously in the design of the site so that they could understand the relationship of the River to this site. Baxter and Woodman provided photographs of the 1996 Event . They looked at the 1996 Event and looked at it relative to this site and found that it confirmed the information they had developed relative to the existing conditions. Based on the existing condition, they can make some judgments about what is happeni ng in the proposed system. He stated they know there is water flow that comes from the northwest to the southeast. The ponds are intended to provide for the conveyance capacity for the stream flows on the DuPage River. They do not propose any impacts to the upstream or downstream property owners. There will be some moderate benefit to the upstream property owners. They have talked to some of the residents about potential concerns they may have and have addressed concerns in this design. It is importa nt to the petitioner that the work they do does not impact the residents. There are internal ponds, which are very large storage facilities. As the water levels come up, these storage facilities will fill with water. They also provide a water quality be nefit. Water runoff will go to the detention area and then out to the River. They know how the water flow changes over time because of the River hydrographs. They believe they have provided a sound stormwater management solution that addre sses all of th e Village’s needs both from a conveyance standpoint to make sure there are
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 7 of 23 no flood damages, and also from a stormwater management standpoint to make sure that all of the onsite stormwater is managed well. Commissioner Sanders stated Chris tian Smith h ad mentioned there is something that measures the flow rate of the River at Caton Farm. He wondered if there was something similar to the north and if it could be determined how much basically was run off from farm fields , and that this development possib ly would be an improvement over the current existing conditions. Chris tian stated there is a gauge on the east branch of the DuPage River on Royce Road, and there is a gauge on the west branch of the DuPage River, Springbrook Creek, and Lily Cache that comes in just downstream of Rt. 59. The Shorewood gauge is actually south of Caton Farm Road. There is upstream information and downstream information. They used that information to get a sense of what the River was doing, what the timing was for flood f lows or stormwater flows as they came from the north down through the DuPage River , through the site , and then on down to the Shorewood gauge. They took all of that into consideration when they did the stormwater management design for this site. Commis sioner Kachel stated he knew that the DuPage River up in Bolingbrook and Naperville has been altered somewhat in certain areas to give it better flow. He was wondering if ComEd or anyone did anything differently over the years to change the course of the lower portion of the DuPage River. Christian Smith stated he felt that was more of a natural feature. He explained the stream system flow. Commissioners Sanders asked if it was ¾ mile river frontage. Christian stated he believed it was over 1 mile. Commissioners Sanders asked if there was a drop of approximately 8 feet from where it enters the site and then gets to Rt. 59. Christian was not sure that it was that dramatic. He stated there would be a change of about 2 feet , and he believed the natura l water surface would be roughly the same. Commissioner Kachel asked about the ponds. He stated when there are individual areas for detention, like this area, what is the potential for silt buildup later on and what would be done at that time. Christian stated that was part of what the floodway rules require with the State of Illinois. These ponds are being built in the floodway and the State requires that a management ordinance be put into effect where the property owner is required to maintain that ac cording to the plans that were forwarded to the Illinois Department of Natural Resources . T hese lakes will be managed and maintained to those elevations so there should be no loss of conveyance capacity or no loss of storage capacity below the normal wate r level. Commissioner Kachel asked who would be managing that. Christian stated it would be a combination of the Homeowners Associations and the commercial management companies. Chairman Sobkoviak opened the meeting to public comment. Chairman Sobkovia k swore in each person before they spoke. 1. Patrick Lieb – 16420 S. River Road, Pine Cone Woods. He stated he has met with the developer and they have been working with him. He addressed a lot of concerns of what is going to happen with the river syste m. He hired an engineer. He stated he saw plans that show a fill of 15 feet next to his property. He stated the existing topography is 3 feet higher than the existing level of his property. He stated when it rains, storms, or floods, his property would be inundated with water. It has outflow and the developer has to provide him with an outflow on his property as this is State Statute. He stated it was shown to him that they would provide a drainage ditch. He stated the pond by his property has an out flow at base elevation of 589. His property level at the drainage ditch is 590. There has been a lot of occasions where the River comes up
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 8 of 23 to the River edge, which is 592/593 and causes that water to back up into the pond, back up the drainage ditch, b ack up into his property and into Pine Cone Woods and all the way to River Pointe. He feels this can be pre vented with a backflow preventer or some kind of check valve. Chairman Sobkoviak stated the Commission will direct the Village Engineer to pay pa rticular attention to this aspect. The Commission will need to know that this has been remedied. Mr. Lieb stated he did ask the developer – they are showing a model with cross sections on how the water flows and they have given it to IDNR to issue them a permit to remove certain areas from floodway and floodplain. He asked that two cross sections, one at the bottom of his property , and one maybe about 200/300 feet from the corner of his property to the corner of the River be drawn. Chairman Sobkoviak stated the Commission will direct the Village Engineer to ensure that these issues are remedied prior to any further action on this parcel. Steve Amann stated that they have talked to Mr. Lieb. His concern about the connection, the drainage ditch that ma y aggravate the backing up of the River into his property, has been relayed to the design engineer and they are looking at it. 2. Asposie Nelson – 14401 S. Gordon Ct. – She wondered if there was any traffic exit on the west side of this development. She stated it seems like everything is channeled out to Rt. 59 and that is very crowded at the present. Chairman Sobkoviak stated the west side is the River. Ms. Nelson stated yes, but wanted to know if there were any other traffic exits other than Rt. 59. Steve Amann stated there will be interconnectivity of the local traffic onto Leewood Lane so it does not all have to go out on Rt. 59. 3. Ray Hayen – 16940 S. Plainsman Circle. He stated it looked beautiful, but he did have a concern because his house, among many, was hit during the Flood of 1996. He would like the Commission to go with the safety factor and keep the compensatory storage rate at 1.5:1. 4. Bob Rudisill – 17064 McKenna Drive. He asked about the water park facility. He had concerns about the noise level. John Philichuck stated families enjoy this type of facility. He stated it was an indoor water facility. Since there was no further response from the audience, Chairman Sobkoviak closed the public comment portion of the meeting. Commis sioner Bonuchi stated this is a beautiful development and a wonderful thing for Plainfield, but she had concerns about flooding issues for the residents in Pine Cone Woods. She wanted everything to be done for the homeowners to make sure these homes are n ot impacted by flooding. Christian Smith stated Pine Cone Woods in the mid to late 80’s was subdivided. In the initial subdivision, there was an area to the west side of the homes that was dedicated compensatory storage . A very large area was excavated below ground level so that the flood waters could come in and occupy that area. It could be that someone has purchased that property and is not aware that it is a dedicated compensatory storage area. There is a perception that it should be dry yard, when it was actually dedicated for that flooding purpose.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 9 of 23 Commissioner Bonuchi stated she believes the residents know that. She just wanted to make sure that this would not further impact the area. Christian Smith stated that was why they spent so much ti me analyzing the gauge information, downstream and upstream gauge information, and understanding the River system so they could address that affect. Commissioner Kachel asked if basements are planned in these units on all of the residents. Christian Smit h stated the observation should be made that Baxter and Woodman is requiring that the sump pump pits be above the BFE (base flood elevation). Commissioner Kachel referenced a nearby area where there are problems. He stated the amount of storage needed is being decreased. Christian Smith stated he did not believe the amount of storage is being decreased. Commissioner Renzi asked about the aqua filter. Steve Amann stated the sump pump issue in Arbor Place was because the basements and sump pumps , which a re actually below the basements by a bit, were set based on incorrect or unavailable information related to the natural ground water in that area. The sump pits penetrated that ground water and some of the sump pumps are just pumping that water out of a m assive ground water table. The same type of soils is in this site. It is further downstream toward the River so there should be some expectation that the ground water would also be declining as you approach the River. However, given that the soil is ver y porous and that there is extensive floodplain on this property, they asked the developer to make sure that the basements of these houses are high enough so that even the sump pits will not be in the floodplain. The houses will be set back from the flood plain horizontally and it has also been asked that there be vertical clearance from the floodplain as well. There was a discussion about ground water. Commissioner Kachel asked if Steve did not see any problem with the rising water table and with basemen ts on this site. Steve Amann stated yes he does see a problem, but that is why they asked the developer to raise the houses up. Commissioner Renzi commented if the houses and basements are being raised up, and then correspondingly the landscaping is bein g raised, he was concerned that water would then be flowing backwards into Pine Cone Woods because a hill has been created south of Pine Cone Woods. Steve Amann stated that was the exact problem that Mr. Lieb had pointed out when he saw the older set of p lans. Since that time, the developer has added some drainage improvements along the westerly side of their site to convey that water that would normally flow from Mr. Lieb’s property onto the Fritz Farm and then back into the River. Commissioner Renzi asked if it would make sense to limit the number of basements that can be put into this development to avoid any issue by minimizing the amount of excavation rather than having them go upward. Steve Amann stated there are sensible limits. To a great exte nt the developer has done that by providing commercial properties over on the easterly side of this site. Those buildings will not have basements and will not have sump pump issues. He was not sure what the final plans for the townhouses and condos will look like, but he thought as the developer goes to market th ose and look s at the cost s associated with basements, perhaps many of those will not have basements either. It was his experience that people want basements. Michael Garrigan stated raised base ments can actually be done, such as the Carolina style house with a raised porch.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 10 of 23 Chairman Sobkoviak went over the requests of the petitioner. 1. He asked the commissioners if there were any issues regarding the annexation and that the Commission agre es it is a logical extension of the Village. He stated this is the western portion of the property. The eastern portion is already annexed. The commissioners agreed . 2. He asked if the Commission agreed with the issuance of the Special Use for the PD. The commissioners agreed . 3. He asked if the Commission agreed with the rezoning of the eastern portion from R -1 to B -3. The commissioners agreed . 4. He stated most of the issues were regarding the concept plan. Whether change to the Comprehensive Plan fr om current low density and greenways to commercial and medium density is appropriate? The commissioners agreed . Character of area – low density residential or commercial? Commissioner Renzi stated the frontage should be commercial. Chairman Sobkoviak s tated he felt it made sense to have commercial along the highway. He said in most cases it is problematic marketing homes that back up to a highway. Is proposal consistent with trend of development along the Rt. 59 Corridor? The commissioners agreed. Doe s Commission support commercial development on site? The commissioners agreed. Is Commission comfortable with extensive modifications to floodway and floodplain? Chairman Sobkoviak stated they would have to qualify that. Commissioner Renzi stated he was not comfortable with that. Chairman Sobkoviak stated if the engineering issues can be addressed and remedied would the Commission show support? Commissioner Kachel stated he wished there could be a compromise about the compensatory storage. Commission er Renzi stated he knows what the developer wants to modify from, but not what they want to modify to for the 100 yr and the 2 yr. flood capacity. He was not sure if the developer’s calculations took into effect the increas e d grade that may result by buil ding of the basements and also the overflow on the little tip that is down in the greenway. If debris collects, he is not sure what the plan is to get the debris out. Chairman Sobkoviak reiterated if the engineering issues can be remedied and can be wo rked out, would the commissioners then be comfortable? Commissi oner Renzi stated he would then be comfortable, but he would still want to see a final report that tells him what the change would be in terms of the flow so the development would be held acco untable to that . Chairman Sobkoviak reminded the commissioners since this is a concept hearing, the Commission could ask for anything. The Commission could ask for supporting documentation that shows that these engineering issues were remedied. Steve Amann stated that they have asked for that and he was not sure if they have received that. Chairman Sobkoviak stated this would need to be received at time of Preliminary Plat. Commissioner Renzi asked if the developer needs a variance for the hotel fo r the height. John Philipchuck stated they do not know the number of stories. He stated he felt it was an excellent suggestion as something that needs to be looked at.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 11 of 23 Commissioner Renzi stated he thought it was mentioned , as far as maintenance of the water , a Confederation of Associations would be formed. He asked how they would conceptualize the intricate waterway management when there may be 5 associations. John Philipchuck stated a consulting company that performs that type of service would be hi red. Commissioner Renzi asked if that would be in the covenants that run with the land. John Philipchuck stated yes. Chairman Sobkoviak stated there would be a dormant service area created also. Steve Amann stated because of the floodway permits that w ill have to be secured for this project, the DNR is requiring a maintenance plan and also the Village to sign off on that maintenance plan as ultimately being responsible for it. The Village would then look to the HOA to be the primary responsibility for the maintenance of the ponds and everything else in the floodway, and then to the dormant special service area if the Village has to step in to take over that maintenance because of the HOA’s failure to do so. Is the Commission comfortable with variances b eing proposed from the applicant to the Village’s Stormwater Ordinance and Compensatory Storage Relief? Chairman Sobkoviak stated if the engineering issues can be remedied and satisfactory alternatives are provided, the Commission can be comfortable with the variances. Is the proposed mixed use development appropriate for this site? Commissioner Renzi said maybe, but he did have a concern because there were items with the Fire Department and the Park District. He stated as long as they are all okay with the plan, he would be. Chairman Sobkoviak stated Chief Stratton was present and did not offer any negative comments. Cameron Bettin from the Park District stated they were okay with everything conceptually. They have to begin working on the agreement. Michael Garrigan stated the School District he believes has come to general terms in regards to the proposed elementary school. Commissioner Kachel asked the developer if they thought instead of having a hotel and a convention center, if they could be com bined. John Philipchuck stated whatever configuration it takes will evolve as they get into discussions with the Village Board. Commissioner Renzi stated conceptually his only issue would be in terms of seating. There was a discussion about the size of the convention center. Is the Commission comfortable with the densities as proposed and the lot sizes as proposed? The c ommissioners agreed. Commissioner Renzi asked Michael Garrigan if the walking path could be made wider to use for biking as well and built into the trail system. Michael Garrigan stated that was a good point , and staff could look at that. At 9:01 p.m. Commissioner Bonuchi made a motion that the Plan Commission make a favorable recommendation to the Village Board that the annexation o f the balance of the subject site would be a logical extension of the Village’s municipal boundaries. Commissioner Kachel seconded the motion. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll call. Aye: Renzi, Bonuchi, Sanders, Kachel, Chairman Sobkoviak Na y: 0 The motion is carried 5:0
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 12 of 23 Commissioner Sanders asked if it would be appropriate to have a 6 th recommendation for the Special Use for a Planned Development addressing some of the concerns on the Best Management Practices and its relationship to the s tormwater management. He asked if that was covered under the stipulation regarding the Village Engineer. Michael Garrigan stated either one would be acceptable. It is the Commission’s prerogative to have a very detailed stipulation. The Best Management Practices would be reviewed by the Village Engineer . Commissioner Sanders wanted the 6 th stipulation worded as follows: A thorough review of site restrictions be investigated prior to final design and placement of Best Management Practices and stormwate r management. Michael Garrigan wanted to add a 7 th stipulation regarding the height for the future hotel. It was identified at 50 feet. Commissioner Sanders asked if there could be a range, rather than a specific height. Michael Garrigan stated it woul d be a maximum height. At 9:05 p.m. Commissioner Sanders made a motion that the Plan Commission make a favorable recommendation of the Special Use for a Planned Development subject to the following stipulations: 1. Compliance with the requirements of the Village Engineer; 2. Compliance with the requirements of the Plainfield Fire Protection District. 3. That the applicant works with staff on an economic feasibility study of the proposed civic center/expo center; 4. That the applicant submit concepts for th e pedestrian bridge across the DuPage River prior to this matter going to the Village Board; 5. That the applicant’s land planner and staff work on a conceptual gateway design for the Village’s gateway sign on Route 59 , and that the applicant be obligated to construct this sign as part of the first phase of the commercial development. 6 A thorough review of site restrictions be investigated prior to final design and placement of Best Management Practices and stormwater management; 7. Height of future hotel be at a maximum of 50 feet. Commissioner Kachel seconded the motion. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll call. Aye: Bonuchi, Sanders, Kachel, Renzi , Chairman Sobkoviak Nay : 0 The motion is carried 5:0 At 9:06 p.m. Commissioner Kachel made a m otion that the Plan Commission make a favorable recommendation of the requested B -3 (Business Highway District) for the commercial property within this development. Commissioner Renzi seconded the motion. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll call . Aye: Sanders, Kachel, Renzi, Bonuchi, Chairman Sobkoviak Nay: 0 The motion is carried 5:0
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 13 of 23 At 9:07 p.m. Commissioner Renzi made a motion that the Plan Commission make a favorable recommendation of the Concept Plan subject to the following stipulations : 1. Compliance with the requirements of the Village Engineer; 2. Compliance with the requirements of the Plainfield Fire Protection District; 3. That the applicant work with staff to relocate or redesign the traffic circle adjacent to the school site as p er the requirement of the Village’s Traffic Committee; 4. A thorough review of site restrictions be investigated prior to final design and placement of Best Management Prac tices and stormwater management. Commissioner Sanders seconded the motion. Chairma n Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll call. Aye: Kachel, Renzi, Bonuchi, Sanders, Chairman Sobkoviak Nay: 0 The motion is carried 5:0 Commissioner Renzi wanted clarification on the traffic study figures when this comes back to the Commission. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a break at 9:10 p.m. The Commission reconvened at 9:22 p.m. Chairman Sobkoviak moved Chatham Square Phase 4 before Plainfield Ventures on the agenda. CASE: 1379 -121007.SU/SPR LEGACY AT GRANDE PARK, LOT 3 Request: Site Plan Review Location: Grande Park Neighborhood 10 (SWC Wikaduke & 127 th St.) Applicant: Legacy Development & Consulting, LLC TIME: 9:22 p.m. Jonathan Proulx stated this does involve two proposed drive -through operations. Those drive -throughs are pe rmitted per the prior Planned Development approval. That Planned Development did call for the petitioner to submit a Special Use Application, but beyond that there is no requirement for a public hearing or special use approval. The Site Plan Review for the commercial development is before the Commission tonight. The proposed commercial development is on 2 lots, which are potentially proposed for consolidation into one lot. They are the lots at the rear of the commercial portion of the project adjacent to Legacy Drive. It will be a retail development of approximately 23,500 sq. ft. It will be constructed in phases. The first phase will enter toward 127 th Street, the second phase would face the Wikaduke Trail, and the third phase would potentially be a free -standing restaurant. Staff feels the orientation is very creative and addresses some of the challenges associated with this site. There is a full access point from 127 th Street and also a limited right -in/right -out access point , as well as addition al access points from Legacy Drive.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 14 of 23 Staff proposes two recommendations regarding pedestrian circulation. Both of those have been incorporated into the plan. They include the addition of sidewalk connections from the bike path on 127 th Street adjacent to or servicing both access points, as well as the extension of special pavement treatment in the planned pedestrian crossing to the other two commercial lots within the commercial portion of the development. The entrance to the drive -through operations w ould be from a secondary entrance point on Legacy Drive. The first drive -through is a fairly sharp turnaround in order to get the passenger side vehicle to the order board and pickup window at the building. Staff did originally have concerns about that, but the plan was presented to the Traffic Committee and identified to be acceptable to the Traffic Committee. Staff has recommended that the order board be placed as far north as possible to maximize stacking and to minimize potential conflicts with the i ngress and egress. Staff notes there is a bypass median that would allow people to exit the drive -through lane towards the commercial access point for an emergency. The second drive -through is located along the south elevation of the second phase of deve lopment. Staff would ask for the Commission ’s recommendations regarding the need for a bypass lane at this location. Staff feels these drive -throughs are more accessory in nature relative to a fast food restaurant or a bank. The proposed parking exceeds the required parking and provides flexibility for individual tenants. The trash enclosure is located at the rear of the building along the south elevation of Phase 1 building. They will be screened with side and rear walls incorporating the same materia ls as the principal building. They will also have a solid screen door and be buffered by the central bermed and landscaped area. The rooftop mechanicals will be screened with a roof -top screening system as opposed to a raised parapet wall. The site is p art of the overall Grande Park Neighborhood 10 development , and the engineering for that has already been approved. Detention would be provided in the existing detention basin in the adjacent Grande Park Neighborhood 12. The site meets the Zoning Ordin ance in regard to building height, floor area ratio, lot width, etc. This is Prairie Style architecture. Staff has requested to review a material sample board or sample materials, particularly with respect to the block/brick material. The landscape plan exceeds the Village’s requirements. There will be a pedestrian plaza area with a landscaped wall adjacent to the traffic circle. Staff has made two minor recommendations: landscape island should be added along the north row of parking adjacent to 127 th St ., inclusion of pedestrian benches, bike racks, and trash receptacles. A photometric plan has been submitted, but a revised photometric plan is required. S taff has made a recommendation to incorporate decorative wall lighting into the monument signs. Staff believes the proposed plans meet the requirements and the intent of the Village’s regulations and guidelines, and recommends approval of the proposed site plan. Chairman Sobkoviak asked Steve Amann if he had anything to add. Steve Amann stated the y have not seen plans for this project yet, but do not anticipate any problems. Chairman Sobkoviak swore in the representative for the petitioner. Vince Rosanova spoke. He stated this plan is consistent with the 2001 Annexation Agreement for Grande Park and more recently with the design guidelines and architectural standards set forth in the 2007 PUD Agreement. He stated they have considered staff’s recommendations and believe they add additional plan enhancements. Therefore, they have decided to incor porate all of the recent recommendations with the minor caveat that the landscaping
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 15 of 23 island located just south of 127 th Street receive landscaping to the point that it doesn’t detrimentally affect site visibility. Commissioner Kachel stated t he plans app ear to have all brick construction. Michael Lambert – Arris Architects, responded. He stated the material that is proposed is a brick block type of material. It is going to look like a brick when it is completed, but it goes up like a block construction . He showed a sample of the material. It is actually fired clay. Commissioner Kachel asked where the walkway will go over the WIKADUKE. Jonathan Proulx stated it is just south of Grande Park Boulevard, which is approximately ½ miles south of 127 th Stre et. Chairman Sobkoviak asked if there was anyone in the audience that cared to ask a question or make a comment. There was no response. Commissioner Sanders asked Jonathan Proulx if there has been a site plan review for the other lots on this propert y already. Jonathan Proulx stated this is the first site plan review and the developer has been in discussions with some potential users on the other lots. Commissioner Sanders asked if the architecture would be similar. Jonathan Proulx responded that w as correct. The Planned Development calls for design uniformity. There will be monument signage throughout the commercial development. There will also be decorative lighting, etc. Commissioner Kachel asked Michael Lambert if there were any malls in the area with the type of brick Michael previously described. Michael Lambert stated there are a couple in Naperville. Commissioner Renzi asked if anything needed to be done with cross access. Vince Rosanova stated the cross access provisions will be add ressed through the owners association. There will be a reciprocal cross access easement provided at the time of sale. Commissioner Renzi asked staff i f there needs to be something that attaches to the agreement that states there will be cross access ease ments allowed. Jonathan Proulx stated the cross access easement stipulation will be on the final plat approval. At 9:41 p.m. Commissioner Renzi made a motion that the Plan Commission recommend approval of the site plan review for the commercial developme nt on Lots 3 and 4 of the Legacy at Grande Park subdivision, subject to the following three stipulations: 1. Compliance with the requirements of the Village Engineer; 2. Compliance with the requirements of the Oswego Fire Protection District; 3. Submittal of revised site plan, landscaping and photometric plans to incorporate the recommendations of staff and/or the Plan Commission prior to Village Board consideration. Commissioner Bonuchi seconded the motion. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll ca ll. Aye: Renzi, Bonuchi, Sanders, Kachel, Chairman Sobkoviak Nay: 0 The motion is carried 5:0
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 16 of 23 CASE: 1382 -010408.FP CHATHAM SQUARE, PHASE 4 Request: Final Plat of Subdivision Location: Northwest Corner of 127 th Street & Heggs Road App licant: Gladstone Builders & Developers TIME: 9:42 p.m. Sara Leach summarized the staff report. The annexation agreement for Chatham Square was originally approved Feburary, 2005. Phase 1 was approved in February, 2006; Phase 2 was approved in June, 2 006; Phase 3 was approved in May, 2007. Overall, there will be 322 residential units, including 238 single family detached homes and 84 townhome units. Staff finds that the proposed land plan is consistent with the concept plan contained in the annexatio n agreement and the preliminary plat, previously approved by the Village Board. Phase 4 features 4 separate blocks throughout the project. Access to the subdivision is provided by two existing locations on 127 th Street and Heggs Road. Access to Phase 4 is provided through streets that have been dedicated on previous final plats and/or a blanket public easement. The annexation agreement provides for high quality architecture that incorporates a variety of materials and elevations. Lots 154 and 166 are d esigned as key lots in Phase 4, and Lots 13 through 16 are designated as through lots. The applicant has agreed to provide one parkway tree for each interior lot and three parkway tress for each corner lot. Staff recommends approval of the final plat s ubject to two stipulations. Chairman Sobkoviak swore in the representative from Gladstone Builders, Adam Dontz. He had no comments. Chairman Sobkoviak asked if there was anyone in the audience who cared to ask a question or make a comment. There was n o response. At 9:47 p.m. Commissioner Kachel made a motion that the Plan Commission recommend approval of Chatham Square, Phase 4 Final Plat of Subdivision, subject to the following two stipulations: 1. Compliance with the requirements of the Village Engi neer 2. Compliance with the requirements of the Plainfield and Oswego Fire Protection Districts. Commissioner Renzi seconded the motion. Chairman Sobkoviak called for a vote by roll call. Aye: Bonuchi, Sanders, Kachel, Renzi, Chairman Sobkoviak Nay: 0 The motion is carried 5:0
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 17 of 23 CASE: 1377 -120307.CP PLAINFIELD VENTURES Request: Concept Plan Review Location: North side of Renwick Road, west of Indian Boundary Applicant: Plainfield Ventures, represented by Bill Kozmin TIME: 9:48 p .m. Mike Schwarz summarized the staff report. This is a plan for 386 dwelling units, consisting of 328 detached single family lots and 58 attached single family (duplex) units. This results in a gross density of 1.9 dwelling units per acre. This is con sistent with the Comprehensive Plan. There is a total 18 acres combined school/park donation. There is buffer landscaping along Renwick Road and Drauden Road, and 41.34 acres of open space used primarily for stormwater management. The applicant has requ ested variances from the zoning ordinance. They have asked to reduce the minimum lot size from 12,000 sq. ft. to 10,000 sq. ft., and the minimum lot width from 85 feet to 80 feet. There may be other relief identified through staff’s review. They have as ked a variance from the subdivision ordinance to reduce the public right -of -way design standards for local streets from 66 feet to 60 feet, which is generally consistent with past practice on local streets. The concept plan does reflect a boulevard en try at each of the two entrance points on Renwick and Drauden. Staff is requesting that the boulevard median at Renwick Road be continued northward toward the school/park site. The applicant will be obligated to comply with the Residential Design and Plannin g Guidelines for Planned Unit Developments and Annexations, which will become an exhibit to the annexation agreement. The western portion of the project includes seven points of access: primary access at Drauden Rd. and Renwick Rd., internal connection to Creekside Crossing at West Cove Way, two internal street stubs for future connections to the north, and two internal street stubs for future connections to the west. The eastern portion of the project includes one point of access onto Drauden Road. The Plainfield Fire Protection District has indicated a single point of access is acceptable for the duplex portion of the project, but has indicated that two points of access are always preferable. The Traffic Committee reviewed the proposed access points an d street connections and has not identified any issues. Rowley Road at the northeast corner of the project is currently shown on the applicant’s survey as not being entirely a full dedication. Staff will work with the applicant and request approximately 90 ft. x 33 ft. segment of strip dedication along Rowley Road, coming off of Indian Boundary. Staff believes there is an opportunity to extend Rowley Road between Indian Boundary and Drauden Road. It should not significantly impact the land plan, but som e adjustment will be necessary. There is some discrepancy provided by the applicant and the Will County Tax Parcel Maps that currently show that there is additional right -of -way along Rowley Road. That will need to be addressed. Staff is not requesting that the developer specifically tie into Rowley Road as part of this project; however, through our negotiations on the annexation agreement, staff could seek a provision regarding some cash -in -lieu of roadway improvements for Rowley Road, especially if it is determined that the development should tie in with Rowley Road. Public Works has indicated that additional right -of -way may be necessary from the subject property in order to improve Rowley Road at some point in the future.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 18 of 23 The Plainfield Fire Dist rict has indicated they are interested in a 3 acre parcel of land for a future fire station site. They have identified the southeast corner of the west portion of the project. This will need to be discussed further because it does alter the land plan. S taff will be happy to work with both parties and find a suitable site, if that is feasible, within this site. The Plainfield Park District is requesting a minimum park donation of 5 acres. Presently, the plan shows 3.41 acres on the west side of the prop erty and does not take into account what is labeled as a combined school/park site. The School District has verbally indicated they will be accepting the school site donation, which is the central part of the project. The Plainfield Park District has ind icated they would look to remove several lots along the periphery of the smaller park on the west, as well as the potential to expand the park to the north so the park has additional roadway frontage. In conclusion , staff generally supports the concept plan. Staff would be looking for additional design features, such as compliance with the mandatory architectural design guidelines, brick or cobblestone crosswalks at key locations, and decorative street lights. That could help balance the relief being r equested from Village Standards. Chairman Sobkoviak asked Steve Amann if he had any comments. Steve stated they do not have any engineering at this time since it is a concept plan, but they do participate in the Traffic Committee. They had some concer ns with some of the alignments and configuration issues. Chairman Sobkoviak swore in the representatives for the developer. Andrew Dystrup spoke first. He stated they are here for comments and feedback from the Commission. He stated they have done titl e searches, been out to the Township, and they do not believe that the Tax Maps are correct and that there really is a Rowley Road, other than what has officially been dedicated at Indian Boundary. Chairman Sobkoviak stated the Commission is going to be k eenly interested in this. This has happened in the past with Fraser Road. The Village had problems when they tried to extend Fraser Road. He asked that the petitioner do their homework and get this straightened out before it comes back through. Mr. Dys trup stated he understood. He stated they did some investigation. Part of the problem is how accurate are old Township records. The records only go back to about 1870. To find an official dedication, which is the way they use to do it through the Towns hips, may be impossible to find . O bviously , it has never been built so it has never been accepted. He stated that was an issue they would have to deal with. He stated the Fire Department wants 3 acres, which he was sure is more than what is owed to them u nder any kind of impact formula. T his im pacts the land plan. He stated they have some negotiations to do in regards to the fire station issue. Chairman Sobkoviak asked if there was anyone in the audience who cares to ask a question or make a comment regarding this project. There was no response. Chairman Sobkoviak stated the Commission would be supportive of staff on the bullet points in the staff report. • Additional discussion between the applicant and the Plainfield Fire Protection District; • Additi onal research is needed to determine the existing and future right -of -way needs for Rowley Road. • Per suggestion of Park District, certain lots should be removed in order to expand parks and provide additional street frontage.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 19 of 23 • Lot 207 at northeast corner of school/park site appears isolated from other lots and should be removed. • Boulevard entry into site from Renwick Road. • Appropriate path to get to school site. Commissioner Sanders had a question on the concept of the duplexes and the number of duplexes relative to the single family. He also noticed that the duplexes had 4 bedrooms in them and wanted to know what the footprint of these duplexes would be. Dave Waden stated they had met with staff and the Village Engineer . They met with the School Super intendent and the Park District to iron out any of the issues. They felt due to the extension of Drauden Road, they are trying to interject as many different product types as possible on this property, including a very enticing and intriguing land plan. They felt the triangle corner would be a great location to identify a duplex component. He stated it gives a new product style into this development, which is going to be beneficial to the developer that purchases this project from Plainfield Ventures. H e was not sure where 4 bedrooms came from. He stated Plainfield Ventures is the present landowner. They are going to take this project through the entitlement phase to get the project zoned, annexed, and then an approved preliminary plat . It is their ho pe that w hen t he market does come back around they will have a much more valuable piece of property and can sell it . He stated when they get to the Preliminary Plat aspect of it, they will have to do a much more detailed design guideline aspect of it, but at this point in time they have no idea on square footages or prices. Commissioner Sanders had a question on the Park District’s use calculation . Cameron Bettin stated he believed that staff uses the worst case scenario. Mike Schwarz stated that is w hat the subdivision ordinance actually requires in the absence of a known bedroom count, worst case scenario, to arrive at the acreage and dollar amounts. Commissioner Kachel had a question on the open space. He stated all of the detention ponds are la beled open space on the plan. He stated usually the open space has green space to go along with it. He also asked about the narrow areas going around the detention. Chris Lindley, the land planner, stated the detention basins will be naturalized plantin g basins. So, they will not have a 10 ft. depth to the base. There will be pockets of open water, but those pockets will only be 2 or 3 ft. deep. There will be naturalized plantings along the edges. Commissioner Kachel stated the detention is depicte d as open space and normally he considers open space an area where people can walk. It is community type open space. Yes, it is detention, but it is almost like a park setting. He asked if it is strictly detention. Chris Lindley stated in their overal l calculation they look at the land use legend . He stated 64.3 acres, about 31% of the site, is open space. He stated open space is such an open ended vernacular word in a sense because it encapsulates many different items. In a sense , open space would include detention basins and the buffers that are adjacent to it. Chairman Sobkoviak asked what the Village allows to be counted as open space. Mike Schwarz stated if there are useable paths around stormwater areas, overlooks, gazebos , etc . those types o f stormwater areas can count under the Village’s Residential Design Guidelines for PUD towards the open space. A discussion ensued about the open space in the concept plan. Mike Schwarz stated there is not enough detail at the concept level for staff to say certain areas will be deemed as open space.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 20 of 23 Commissioner Renzi stated there seems to be a lot of straight lines with the streets and he wondered in this area if the streets could be removed and there could be rear -loaded houses with garages and greenways since some of those could be adjusted to lead to the park , especially on the south. He asked if that would be an appropriate discussion at the conceptual level. Dave Waden replied they could take that under consideration. The initial thought w as because Plainfield Ventures is not the final builders on this plan, it ducktails them into a pretty tight preliminary plat, which may be extremely difficult to sell to another developer. Commissioner Renzi clarified his suggestion. He stated he was lo oking at 10,000 sq. ft., basically square lots with streets in a straight row. The Village usually likes to see curvatures, vistas, etc. Would it be possible to simply take the roadway out and just have back alleys for the access points. There would be smaller lots overlooking greenways, which would then make them more amenable to small lot sizes. Dave Waden stated when you deal with an alley product, in most instances whether it is a PUD development, which is where most alley products are, profit plann ing dictates that there should be a street in front of that house besides the alley because of all the guest parking, etc. Mike Schwarz stated staff would not be opposed to an alley, but there would be concern about removing the streets in front. It wou ld be extremely unconventional to have a single family product across a greenway from other single family. It is sometimes seen in apartment communities or in townhome projects. Commissioner Renzi stated it was his belief this had been done previously. Chairman Sobkoviak asked the developer if he was correct in his understanding that the developer will create this subdivision, but they will not be building the homes. The property will be sold to various builders and they will be coming in to do that wo rk. Dave Waden stated that was correct. Chairman Sobkoviak stated t he layout of the subdivision is the way it is because the developer will be marketing the properties. It will be easier for the developer to market this property if there is a more linea r design . Commissioner Sanders stated it seems like the duplex portion has a lot of flexibility for marketing purposes. He stated the duplex area compliments the triangular area. Commissioner Kachel referred to the detention ponds. He referred the Commission to another previously approved subdivision with very narrow ponds where there have been a lot of problems. He stated native plantings were put in, but they have been taken over by evasive type plants and the detention areas look like a swamp. He stated he does not have a problem with wetland areas when they look like wetlands, but when you put a detention pond with native plantings that are only taken care of for a short period of time before the Homeowners association has to worry about it; th ey end up filling up with everything else. He has a major concern about this. Commissioner Kachel asked staff about the school/park site. Mike Schwarz responded that since he wrote his staff report he has had verbal confirmation from the school district that this site was okay. He stated there is a caveat though that the School District is forwarding their plans to their architect to make sure the school layout will fit within the rectangular, oblong central area. Commissioner Kachel asked if they had anything for the Park District for this area. Mike Schwarz stated there is a 3.4 acre parcel on the west, which would be potentially expanded as the development to the west comes in. The Park District is looking to possibly expand that site along the in terior roadway so the park would have frontage on two sides , and possibly expand to the north depending on how much of the area is needed for stormwater management. Commissioner Kachel had a concern that there would be a detention pond right next to an el ementary school. Dave Waden stated that would not be a detention basin that has a safety shelf to it and a 10 ft. depth. There would be naturalized plantings in certain spots so it would not be a traditional detention pond. Commissioner Kachel stated it would still be full of water. Dave Waden stated only during rainy periods.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 21 of 23 During a 100 yr. flooding event or stormwater management event, there will be water. He stated there will be pockets of water 2 to 3 ft. deep. The entire rectangle will not b e water 100% of the time. Commissioner Kachel brought out that a child can drown in 2 to 3 ft. of water. Commissioner Renzi felt the detention would be at the other end where the traffic circle is located. He stated since this is conceptual, the Commiss ion can let the plan go further and let the School District figure out what their design issues are . He concurred with Commissioner Kachel that he was not comfortable with pockets of 2 to 3 ft. of water floating around the subdivision, especially around p arks and such. Commissioner Renzi asked if this would be a regional park or a neighborhood park. Cameron Bettin stated with the expansion that they are asking for they will probably increase it to 7.2 acres with the intent to be able to expand it once de velopment comes into the west. It could possibly be a 16 -20 acre park depending on what comes in to the west. It would be similar in size to Springbank. Commissioner Renzi ask ed about the access to the park. Cameron Bettin stated obviously the roads ar e going to continue to the west. The access would be okay for this type of Community Park . It does not necessarily need to be on a major road. Commissioner Sobkoviak polled the commissioners on several items: • Is the Commission comfortable with lot siz es? The commissioners agreed. • Is the Commission comfortable with 50 to 60 duplex units on lot sizes of 15,000 sq. ft.? The commissioners agreed. Commissioner Renzi felt there should be two access points to the duplex units. Commissioner Sanders asked i f there could be access for an emergency vehicle only as an additional access point for the duplex area that could come off of either one of the two adjacent streets. Cameron Bettin made a comment that he believes the gas pipeline might provide another ac cess point to the duplexes. Mike Schwarz stated the Fire District would have to weigh in on that. • Is the Commission comfortable with gross density of 1.9? The commissioners agreed. • Is the Commission comfortable with reducing minimum lot size from 12,000 sq. ft. to 10,000 sq. ft. The commissioners agreed. • Is the Commission comfortable with reducing minimum lot width from 85 ft. to 80 ft. The commissioners agreed. Mike Schwarz clarified that was on a number of lots, but not on all the lots. • Is the Commis sion comfortable with reducing the public ROW from 66 ft. to 60 ft. The commissioners agreed. • The Plan Commission commented that there is an issue with the Fire Department donation. Chairman Sobkoviak further stated the Commission has no standing there . • The Plan Commission has identified that Rowley Road is an issue that needs to be addressed. • The Park District has a couple of issues with moving of a couple of lots and/or expanding the park site. • There are a few issues with the school site, especially i nvolving the detention basin. Commissioner Renzi asked if there should not be bike trails on Drauden. Mike Schwarz stated that he failed to mention that the Open Space and Trails plan calls for several trails either adjacent to the site or just offsite: one to the north generally north of Rowley parallel with the north property line along Springhole Creek, on the west side of Drauden, and also along Renwick Road. Chairman Sobkoviak stated there is a bike path already on the east side of Drauden. Mike S chwarz stated that would cover what is called for in the plan. He stated staff wants to work with the developer in creating an appropriate path to get people to the school site from the north and also coming off the regional path off of Renwick.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 22 of 23 Commissi oner Bonuchi stated the school site is a very important point and that will probably be a point of discussion for the School District. She stated it is a nice size develo pment with decent size lots. Dave Waden stated their original plan before this one d id not have a school site. It just had a 5 acr e central park site . In the discussion with the School Superintendent, it was mentioned that they would prefer to see the school site centrally located within the development. Dave Waden further stated they know that the S chool District has a typ ical architectural boiler plate. T hey felt that the length and the dimension of this site would be acceptable . T hey know though that this has to go before the School District to get the building footprints to make s ure this proposed site fits within the School District’s concerns. Commissioner Kachel asked staff if the Rowley Road easement is needed how much open space will be lost. Mike Schwarz stated there would be an impact at the northeast corner of the trian gular parcel, east of Drauden. Staff would be looking for an addi tional one -half right -of -way, 33 ft., to connect. Chairman Sobkoviak stated the whole 60 ft. might be needed. Mike Schwarz stated he knew there was 40 ft. half right -of -way on the north si de of the road for the first lot. Staff would be looking for additional right -of -way to be determined through staff’s review with the goal of improving Rowley for the 3 lots that are in the County at the present, partially through the subject property, an d then Rowley would come off of that alignment and maybe then connect with Drauden. Dave Waden stated the Alta Survey and the land title commitment do not show any dedicated right -of -way for Rowley Road. The pipeline company, Tinder Morgan, has no record of any right -of -way going across their property. Commissioner Kachel stated there is a road there at present that everybody uses. There was a discussion of the origin of Rowley Road. Mike Schwarz stated it was brought to his attention that there is a landscape median on Drauden and that would be the break to provide the access. There would be a need to modify that. Commissioner Renzi asked if the Commission had to worry about turning lanes also. Steve Amann stated yes, there will have to be a lef t turn lane cut out of that median to get into the subdivision from Drauden Road. Commissioner Renzi asked if the Commission needed to address that or would it go with the annexation agreement. Mike Schwarz stated those things will be brought forward whe n there are engineering plans and plats, etc. He stated this is just a general picture of lot arrangements, street layout, connections, etc. Mike Schwarz stated it was up to the Commission if they desired to make a motion or just give comments. A motion is not necessary. The feedback of the Commission is first and foremost. Chairman Sobkoviak did not ask for a motion. He stated the Commission has offered input to the developer and the developer understands the Commission’s position. DISCUSSION: Commissioner Kachel asked if the Village is taking care of Indian Boundary now or if the Township is taking care of it. He was wondering because of the pot holes. Jonathan Proulx stated Indian Boundary south and west of Renwick Road is, to his knowledge, the Village’s maintenance responsibility. Staff is talking with the developers of Creekside and Springbank on what is the best way of closing Indian Boundary Road.
Village of Plainfield Plan Commissi on Minutes January 15, l2008 Page 23 of 23 Commissioner Sanders asked if Indian Boundary has been vacated between Rowley and Drauden by the Village and if it is part of the Creekside Development. Jonathan Proulx stated the south and east half of Indian Boundary has been vacated. He stated all of Indian Boundary has been vacated between Renwick Road and Rowley Road. Jonathan Proulx stated the south and east half is part of Creekside, and the north and west is the property of the petitioner who was just before the Commission. He stated an important consideration is that it would be staff’s hope that the overhead pow er lines on the north and west side would be relocated as part of the development of this parcel. Commissioner Renzi stated the Comprehensive Plan showed the Rt. 59 area as residential and it clearly should not be residential. He referred to the Hospita l Zone just recently established off of 127 th Street. He asked if the Comprehensive Plan could be looked at again and possibly updat e d to list this area on Rt. 59 as potentially commercial. Michael Garrigan asked if Commissioner Renzi was talking about u pdating the South Rt. 59 Corridor Comprehensive Plan. Michael stated staff could look at that. He said staff has outlined their concerns about strip development as they do not want it all to be strip commercial down there, but there is the potential for more commercial. Commissioner Renzi suggested possibly creating a new category that is residential/potential mixed use commercial so that someone looking at the Comprehensive Plan knows the possibilities. Since there was no further business before the P lan Commission, Chairman Sobkoviak adjourned the meeting at 10:53 p.m. _________________________________________ R espectfully Submitted Carol Millan – Planning Secretary Village of Plainfield