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Exhibit MSD 104 - Transcript of Public Hearing July 10, 2019Exhibit MSD 104 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 1 METROPOLITAN ST. LOUIS SEWER DISTRICT 2 PUBLIC HEARING OF THE RATE COMMISSION 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS JULY 10, 2019 UMSL - 1 UNIVERSITY BOULEVARD WELLNESS AND RECREATION CENTER ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI 17 18 Reported by Susan M. Moody 19 ALARIS REPORTING SERVICES 20 711 North 11th Street 21 St. Louis, Missouri 63101 22 (314) 644-2191 23 24 25 www.aiaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 1 APPEARANCES: 2 COMMISSIONERS PRESENT: 3 Mark Schoedel 4 Tom Ratzki 5 John Stein 6 Chan Mahante 7 Steve Mahfood 8 Lloyd Palans 9 Don Bresnan 10 Gerald Beckmann 11 Mickey Croyle 12 13 ALSO PRESENT: 14 BRIAN HOELSCHER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR MSD 15 PATTY OLSEN, MSD 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 3 1 PROCEEDINGS BEGAN AT 6:00 P.M. 2 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: We'll go ahead and 3 get started. 4 Good evening. I am Mark Schoedel, a 5 member of the Metropolitan Sewer District Rate 6 commission, and I'll be presiding over the 7 public hearing this evening. 8 With me tonight are the following MSD Rate 9 Commission members: Gerald Beckmann, Don 10 11 12 13 14 Bresnan, Mickey Croyle, Chan Mahanta, Steve Mahfood, Lloyd Palans, and Tom Ratzki and John Stein. The Charter Plan of the district was amended at a General Election on November 7, 15 2000, and established the Rate Commission to 16 review and make recommendations to the district 17 regarding changes in wastewater rates, 18 stormwater rates, and tax rates proposed by the 19 district. 20 The Charter Plan requires the MSD Board of 21 Trustees to select organizations to insure a 22 fair representation of all users of the 23 district's services on the Rate Commission. 24 The Rate Commission represent organizations are 25 to represent commercial, industrial users, www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 4 1 2 3 4 5 residential users, and other organizations interested in the operation of the district, including organizations focusing on environmental issues, labor issues, socioeconomic issues, community neighborhood 6 organizations, and other nonprofit 7 organizations. The MSD Rate Commission 8 currently consists of 15 members from 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 issue its report on the proposed rate change 16 notice to the Board of Trustees of the 17 district, unless the Board of Trustees, upon 18 application of the Rate Commission, extends the 19 period of time for the issuance of the Rate 20 Commission report for an additional 45 day 21 period. 22 At its meeting on March 14, 2019, the 23 Board of Trustees approved the Rate 24 Commission's request for an extension. The 25 Rate Commission's report on the rate change organizations and institutions throughout St. Louis City and County. The Rate Commission received a rate change notice from the district on March 4th, 2019. Under the district's Charter Plan, the Rate Commission must, on or before July 2nd, 2019, www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 5 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 proposal must now be issued on or before August 16th, 2019. The MSD Rate Commission has engaged legal counsel and a rate consultant independent of those used by the MSD staff. Under procedural rules adopted by the Rate Commissions, as amended, any person affected by these rate change proposals has an opportunity to submit an application to intervene in these proceedings. An application to intervene has been filed by the Missouri Industrial Energy Consumers. This application has been granted. 13 Since March 4, 2019, the MSD Rate 14 Commission has received testimony from MSD 15 staff, rate consultant, and the intervenors 16 The parties have also engaged in discovery 17 requests. 18 A prehearing conference for the purpose of 19 identifying any issues raised by the rate 20 setting documents and prepared testimony 21 previously submitted will be conducted on the 22 record. All persons submitting testimony may 23 participate in the prehearing conference, and 24 each participant in the prehearing conference 25 shall submit a prehearing conference report www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 describing the issues raised by the rate setting documents and the prepared testimony, together with a brief description of each participant's position, if any, on each issue and the rational thereof. Rate payers who do not wish to intervene are permitted to participate on these on -the -record public hearings conducted in six sessions that began on May 14th, 2019. The Rate Commission published a public notice regarding these proceedings in the St. Louis Post Dispatch and in the St. Louis American. 13 These notices contained the time, date, 14 location of each of the conferences and 15 hearings. 16 The public hearing session tonight is for 17 the purpose of permitting the district to 18 present its wastewater change proposal and to 19 permit any rate payer an opportunity to 20 comment. 21 We will begin with the presentation by the 22 district, followed by a public comment period. 23 The district will be presenting a lot of 24 information, so we would ask that you hold your 25 questions until the comment period, as perhaps www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 many of your initial questions may be answered by the end of the presentation. Those wishing to speak should sign in on the sheet provided, which is over to my right, and would be called on in the order of the names listed thereon. Each rate payer should 7 identify themselves and any organizations 8 represented by such rate payer. 9 Several housekeeping rules before we 10 begin. If you wish to present testimony, 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 expect you may have questions or comments, again, please sign in on the clipboard. Speakers will be recognized in the order they sign up. Each rate payer may have a maximum of ten minutes to speak regarding the proposed rate change. As the presiding officer, I can limit or expand the time should I deem it necessary. If you've not already done so, please silent your cell phones, and that includes the rate commissioners. Exits from this room are located as you can see; and once you exit, those doors to get out of the building in the case of an emergency are to the far end of that building there. Restrooms are located out this door and down www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 the hall to our right. Are there any questions regarding the procedures this evening? Is the district ready to proceed? MR. HOELSCHER: Yes, we are, Mr. Chairman COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Please step forward. MR. HOELSCHER: Thank you. My name's Brian Hoelscher. I'm the Executive Director and CEO at MSD. I'm going to give you a presentation on our proposed wastewater rate proposal. I'm going to spend time on one slide just giving you a little bit of background on MSD, and then we'll dive into the rate proposal. As far as an overview, MSD is a government 17 utility. We are formed under provisions of the 18 state constitution. We have a voter approved 19 charter that is MSD's organic law, the basis 20 under which we operate. We have a board of 21 trustees that oversee myself and the secretary 22 treasurer; six individuals, three of them are 23 appointed by the County Executive and three of 24 them appointed by the Mayor of the City of 25 St. Louis. www.afaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 It's important to remember MSD is two separate utilities. We are a wastewater utility and we're a stormwater utility. Tonight we're going to talk about proposed wastewater rates. What I would ask, if any of you have questions -- because we want to answer all of them -- about stormwater issues or billing or something else about the system, we've got a lot of MSD people here that will stay as late as it takes to answer any other questions you have that may be outside of what's presented here. And if we can't answer the question, we'll make sure we'll get back to you. Service area of MSD is 520 square miles. Currently we serve the City of St. Louis and about 90 percent of St. Louis County. There's 1.3 million customers and 88 different municipalities within that service area. One of the things that really drives our capital program with regard to the wastewater system is the fact that we have the fourth largest sewer system in the country -- very close to Los Angeles, slightly smaller than Chicago and New York. That's where a lot of www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 10 1 2 3 4 5 6 the environmental issues that we're addressing with this program, where they originated. Talking about the wastewater rates. First of all, these rates are to cover what is our fiscal years 2021 through 2024. So the first time you would pay a bill associated with this 7 rate proposal is in August of 2020. That's the 8 first bill. 9 The proposal -- first of all I'll talk a 10 little bit about the capital part of it. 11 There's over $1.5 billion worth of capital work 12 that's supposed to start within this next four 13 year period. That's over 300 different 14 projects. Some of the things that we'll 15 accomplish, we'll eliminate 50 wastewater sewer 16 overflows, from sewer pipes that are 17 discharging into our local creeks and streams 18 straplesses. Build 60 miles of new wastewater 19 sewers. 20 We're constantly inspecting the system to 21 make sure it's working properly. So we'll 22 inspect 64,000 manholes. A big part of the 23 program is the replacement of the incinerators 24 at our Bissell and Lemay treatment plant. We 25 incinerate our biosolids. These new www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 11 1 2 3 4 5 6 incinerators will bring us up to the current technology. And then finally building a tunnel from our current Fenton wastewater treatment plant down to our lower Meramec treatment plant that's located at Telegraph where the Meramec 7 River goes into the Mississippi River. That 8 9 10 11 will help us eliminate a lot of the overflows around the Fenton area. The rates I'm going to show you are assuming the use of $500 million more in 12 bonding authority. That's what the program is 13 that MSD is proposing. So what I've just 14 discussed is the capital program. That 15 represents the use of over 50 percent of the 16 revenues that we plan on collecting over the 17 next four years. 18 The balance of revenues, slightly under a 19 quarter of those, are for the debt service that 20 we have collected either on past bonds or else 21 that we would use on proposed bonds if this 22 goes through, and then a little over 25 percent 23 is for our normal regular operating activities 24 to operate and maintain the collection system, 25 as well as the treatment plants and pump www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 12 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 stations. There's some key issues that are considered. Our charter has five major categories that are supposed to be considered on rate proposal. There's things about meeting regulatory requirements, certain financial conditions. Probably the biggest one has to do with making sure the proposed rate is fair and reasonable for all classes of rate payers. Those five factors drive all three steps of the Rate Commission process. They drive 12 what the staff did in putting together this 13 rate proposal. They'll drive what the Rate 14 Commission will do in reviewing MSD staff's 15 recommendations. They'll also drive our Board 16 of Trustees who will review the recommendations 17 that come from this Rate Commission. 18 Another one is bonding versus cash. While 19 MSD right now is proposing and believes the 20 best way to move forward is to have additional 21 bonding authority and use some borrowed money 22 to complete this program, because the bonding 23 can only go in place with a positive vote from 24 the population, we also give a scenario where 25 no bonding is used and all that's used are the www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 13 1 rates that are paid on a monthly basis by the 2 rate payers. 3 Affordability is always important. We're 4 always checking the proposal, making sure we 5 make it as affordable as we possibly can. 6 Affordability was a huge issue in the consent 7 decree or the legal action that we signed with 8 the Department of Justice and EPA that's 9 requiring us to do this work that we're doing 10 for the next couple decades, making sure, 11 again, that everything is equitable across all 12 classes of rate payers. 13 There's some underlying rate assumptions 14 that you would see in the rate proposal. This 15 is some of the items that MSD staff presents 16 and that the Rate Commission considers and 17 discusses. One, we assume a certain level of 18 customer growth throughout our service area. 19 We determine what's going to happen with the 20 water usage. 21 what will happen with inflation. This is 22 a four year proposal, so what will inflation 23 look like three or four years from now. 24 Again, consent decree compliance. Almost 25 100 percent of the capital work we're proposing www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 14 1 is to meet requirements of a consent decree 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 that we signed with a federal judge based on the lawsuit that came from the Department of Justice, the EPA, and the Coalition For The Environment. And then finally on the affordability side, we do have a customer assistance program for low income and elderly individuals. If you qualify for that program, those individuals get charged one half the rate of everybody else. That program has been in place for a while and we'll continue it in the future. Here's what we're proposing on rates. Another version of this chart is in that one page handout that was laid out to you. What you see here are some costs per month. That is 17 for our typical customer. MSD's typical 18 customer uses 6 CCF, or 600 cubic feet of water 19 per month. And that's the way we bill. 20 That may not be what your monthly bill is 21 from MSD for wastewater. What every 22 individual's bill is depends on where you live_ 23 If you live outside the City of St. Louis, MSD 24 takes water data from your water provider for 25 the three winter months, November, December - www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 15 1 November, December and January, or December, 2 January and February. We take that data. 3 We assume that is representative of the 4 amount of potable water you would use that goes 5 6 7 down the drain. We don't want to measure what you use in the summer because we don't want to count things like filling swimming pools or 8 watering the grass or washing the car. So we 9 use those winter rates and we use that to bill 10 that same rate for the full year. 11 If you live in the City of St. Louis, your 12 potable water usage is calculated the same way 13 that the City of St, Louis Water calculates 14 your water usage. They do it by what they call 15 attributes. The number of water faucets. The 16 number of bedrooms. The number of kitchens. 17 It's supposed to be representative of the 18 number of people who would normally be in a 19 house, and thus the amount of water they would 20 use. 21 So what does this look like? So the 22 numbers up here, again, are for a typical 23 customer. They may not be the same for you, 24 but the percentage increases will. So if you 25 took a look at your bill that you will receive www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 16 1 in August 2019, that would be the starting 2 point. What we're proposing is in the next 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 year, we'll look for a 1.9 percent increase in that bill. So in fiscal 2021, means the average customer would be paying $56.63 per month. The typical customer. For fiscal year 2022 an increase of 3.8 percent in the rates. If you are a typical MSD customer, your monthly charge and your monthly bill will go from $56.63 a month to $58.78 per month. In fiscal '23 and '24, both of those we're 13 proposing 3.8 percent increases each one of 14 those years. The result would be that this 15 August, the typical customer -- and this is on 16 your sheet -- is paying $55.57 per month. Four 17 years later in fiscal 2024, the monthly cost 18 would go up to $63.63. That's on that top 19 line. 20 Under that -- that is the scenario 21 assuming the voters approve an additional 22 $500 million of bonding authority. If they 23 don't, MDS still has to do the program. 24 Without additional bonding authority, we have 25 to just use the rates coming from our rate vwuw.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 17 1 payers on their monthly bills- 2 That's what the bottom line, or on that 3 sheet you have with the white column looks like 4 on that one page sheet. You'll notice the 5 first year is the same. There's still a 1.9 6 percent increase. We always develop our rate 7 proposals that way. That gives us flexibility 8 as to when we would actually vote for 9 additional bonding capacity. 10 But just like if you had a house, if you 11 pay cash it's more expensive up front. So if 12 we don't get the bonding authority, you can see 13 there's a 15.1 percent increase in fiscal 2022; 14 17.1 percent fiscal year 2023; and a 15 13.1 percent in fiscal 2024. 16 So without bonding, the typical MSD 17 customer, over four years, their average 18 monthly charge will go from $55.57 per month to 19 $86.29 per month. Again, which one of those 20 plans we use to move forward is going to be up 21 to the voters as to whether or not they want to 22 authorize additional bonding authority of MSD. 23 MSD is certainly constantly looking to be 24 as cost effective as we possibly can, not just 25 in the rates we propose, but also in the rates www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 18 1 we're currently working under. One of the 2 biggest things we did, we had a -- I mentioned 3 a consent decree that required us to do certain 4 things to meet the Clean Water Act by 2034. 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Based on some changes in regulations, we went back to the EPA, talked about affordability issues. There was an additional requirement accelerated on us that was outside the consent decree. They agreed to extend our consent decree five years. So instead of ending in 2034, we have to get the same amount of work done by 2039. You'll see that benefited in these proposed increases. If we hadn't gotten that, the proposed increases would be much larger. Operation Maintenance expense. For the past four years, we're predicting we will be coming $43 million under the expenditures we anticipated in the last rate proposal for the current four years. That's about 5 percent under what we planned on spending. Onthe capital program over the past four years, we came in $110 million under budget, or about seven percent under budget. Those two are a little different. The operation and www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 19 1 2 3 4 5 maintenance expenses, having to do -- the main savings there came from technology, using technology to decrease the cost for our day-to-day activities in the collections systems and the treatment plants. Those are 6 redoable. Those are sustainable. You can see 7 those savings and we've got them loaded in the 8 future rate proposal. 9 On the cost of the capital program, that 10 is a job, project -by --project engineer savings 11 that comes when we actually do the detailed 12 design of projects. 13 And then finally, financing cost. MSD, 14 based on its proposed expenditures for 15 financing came in $27 million under budget. 16 That has to do with actively managing the 17 portfolio and the debt we have. A lot of that 18 is taking very key times and refinancing our 19 existing debt to a lower interest rate to save 20 the rate payer's money. 21 So what happens to those dollars? Well, I 22 will tell you there are no bonuses. We don't 23 make a profit. We're a municipal organization. 24 We don't have stockholders, so we don't have 25 dividends. The only place that money goes is www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 20 1 into this next rate cycle. So it's the first 2 place, it's the first pot of money we draw on 3 to pay for things in fiscal '21 through '24. 4 So the money is con-- any savings is constantly 5 turned back over and used in the next set of 6 years. 7 Timeline. I know I'm repeating some of 8 the things Mr. Chairman said, but to go through 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 proposal for consideration by our Board of 16 Trustees, 17 Our Board of Trustees will then take that 18 recommendation from the Rate Commission and 19 they kind of go through the same process the 20 Rate Commission did. They will consider the 21 recommendations from the Rate Commission 22 against the same five factors that we've all 23 used to develop this. That will result in 24 MSD's Board of Trustees making a decision on 25 how to proceed, setting rates; and also if the this: MSD's staff submitted our rate proposal and testimony to the Rate Commission on March 4th, 2019. The Rate Commission will review our proposal, and by charter they are scheduled to submit to our Board of Trustees their recommendations of MSD staff's rate www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 21 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 proposal goes through, setting a date and the conditions for a vote for the public to find out whether or not they would like MSD to use additional bonding authority to pay for that program for the next four years. That vote, because, I mentioned earlier, the first year we make it the same under either 8 scenario will be somewhere between spring 2020 9 and spring 2021. We'll want to find the right 10 place, make sure we can communicate to the 11 public what it is they're voting on, understand 12 the consequences of a yes vote, and understand 13 the consequences of a no vote. 14 The list of the rate commission public 15 hearings. You are currently at this one that's 16 the second from the bottom here at UMSL. There 17 is one more public hearing left two weeks from 18 today at nine a.m. -- Wednesday July 29th at 19 MSD's headquarters. That will also be a 20 streamed presentation as well when we give 21 that. 22 Before I turn it back over to the 23 chairman, I think what I'd like to repeat is, 24 again, we're here for a wastewater rate 25 proposal for the next four years. If you do www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 22 1 have a billing question, if have a stormwater 2 question, something not related to this, we 3 want to hear the questions. We want to get you 4 an answer. We've got a lot of district staff 5 here. We'll stay as long as it takes to answer 6 those questions. 7 Mr. Chairman? 8 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Thank you, Mr. 9 Hoelscher. 10 Do we have anybody who has signed up? 11 MS. PATTY OLSEN: We have one person. Is 12 there anybody else who'd like to sign up to ask 13 a question? 14 Anybody else have a question to ask? 15 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Okay. Thank you. 16 So, again, we'll take these in the order 17 they were signed up. John Coffman first, 18 please. 19 MR. JOHN COFFMAN: Where would you like 20 me? 21 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Right there is 22 fine. 23 MR. JOHN COFFMAN: Okay. My name is John 24 Coffman. I'm a customer of MSD and live in 25 Webster Groves, but I'm here primarily as a www.alaris.us ALAR1S LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 23 1 2 3 4 5 representative of Consumer's Counsel of Missouri. This is a consumer organization that's been based here in St. Louis for -- since about 1971. And throughout most of that time our 6 priority issue has been representing 7 residential utility customers. And we have a 8 particular focus on vulnerable customers, low 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 income customers, and -'m here today to ask you to keep those in mind. I appreciate the fact that MSD said affordability was foremost in their minds, and I hope that it will be in yours. I know that each of you represent a particular constituency here on the board, but we'd like you to review this rate to make sure it's not a dollar more 17 than it needs to be, and to recognize that many 18 of the customers in this community are not only 19 low income and struggling financially, but also 20 a great number of folks who might not even 21 qualify for a customer assistance program, you 22 know, just don't have another dollar to balance 23 the budget each month. So every dollar counts 24 and we hope that you do focus on that. 25 And also, as you consider the customer www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 24 1 assistance program -- and we support that and 2 we promote it, and we're glad to steer people 3 towards it -- recognize that not everyone who 4 qualifies for that necessarily gets it. If 5 6 there's any comparison for say lighting or energy assistance, we know that probably only a 7 third of the people who qualify ever find out 8 about it and go through the administrative 9 process and get connected to people that need 10 it. 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 watching every penny. I hope that you look at 20 this and -- as an opportunity to try to build So, again, just we hope you keep that in mind. We think that the rate increases that have gone -- hit the bills over the last four years have been a struggle; rate shock I think for many people. And I think there are many customers and members of the community that are looking to MSD, to the Rate Commission and the Board of Trustees to make sure that they're 21 more trust and to show some better stability 22 without quite as steep of rate increases in the 23 future. 24 With that, that's about all I have. I'd 25 be happy to answer any questions you might www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 25 1 have. 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Any of the rate commissioners have any questions for Mr. Coffman? COMMISSIONER CROYLE: No, thank you. MR. JOHN COFFMAN: Thank you. Thanks again. Thanks for your service. COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: I have one. I'm curious who are the members of your group and where do they come from? MR. JOHN COFFMAN: Throughout the state. 12 We're a statewide consumer organization. We -- 13 and have donors from around the -- well, 14 membership organizations. We get involved in 15 public service commission cases and involved in 16 matters that in fact say Ameren Missouri and 17 Spire and so forth, but also government -owned 18 agencies. So we're watching and we hope that 19 you keep the consumer foremost in mind. 20 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Thank you. 21 Go ahead. 22 COMMISSIONER BRESNAN: The people you 23 represent, is there a, you know, an average 24 group of people that usually come to you and 25 say, hey, we can't pay this? Does it fluctuate www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 26 1 year to year? 2 MR. JOHN COFFMAN: Well, we receive a 3 variety of letters and comments from people 4 that don't have -- but we're not a social 5 service agency. 6 COMMISSIONER BRESNAN: Okay. 7 MR. JOHN COFFMAN: But we do work with, 8 you know, the various community action agencies 9 and with other antipopular groups [sic]. But, 10 yeah, our focus is -- focus is not necessarily 11 just the most needy customers. We're concerned 12 about residential rates generally as well. 13 COMMISSIONER BRESNAN: Sure. Thank you. 14 MR. JOHN COFFMAN: And the balance have to 15 make to -- but I have read the testimony that 16 you all have submitted to the Rate Commission 17 and I realize there are several adjustments 18 that are within your discretion to recommend, 19 so we hope that you consider those and shave as 20 much as you can off of it and show the public 21 that you're trying to tighten the belts and do 22 what's best for the public. 23 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Thank you. 24 MR. JOHN COFFMAN: Thank you. 25 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Next person we www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 27 1 have is Virginia and forgive me. Virginia 2 N. 3 4 5 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Hi. Actually, I was on my way to exercise and I saw this and I was interested, so I -- you moved to the 6 exercise room. So we had a significant rate 7 increase before, And I think you said -- I'm 8 just trying to clarify a couple things. I 9 think you said you came in under budget, but 10 then a percent of -- percentage of this 11 increase was going to pay for the debt on the 12 old increase, on the old -- on the old bond; is 13 that right? Did you say that in your 14 presentation? 15 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Go ahead. 16 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah. I think what I 17 meant to convey was there are two pots of money 18 that are going to pay for the increases. One 19 is any additional bonding authority we get to 20 borrow money, and the other is the rates that 21 we get. 22 So there is a third pot of money, and that 23 is any savings MSD has, revenues that it did 24 not spend in the first four years. So what I 25 was going over was: There was what we thought www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 28 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 our expenses would be. The revenues are set up to collect those. We collect those revenues, make expenditures. If we're good at what we do, we can come in under what we thought we would spend, that money doesn't go towards other things. It simply goes towards the next rate cycle. So that's the first pot of money we use to pay for the cost of the next four years. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Okay. And then the 10.6 rate goes in -- goes in effect regardless of the vote? Because the vote might take place 13 after the rate goes into effect; is that right? 14 MR. HOELSCHER: Let me do this. 15 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Yes, please. 16 MR. HOELSCHER: The 10.6 you see there, 17 the last rate proposal four years ago, the last 18 increase under that rate proposal will be next 19 month in August, and it's 10.6 percent. That's 20 something that's already been put in place, 21 already gone through the hearing. You'll see 22 that increase between your July and August bill 23 this year. After that, you see increases for 24 the next four years after that. 25 So the 10.6 is a starting point that you www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 29 1 will see in August. It's under an old rate 2 proposal And that will be the starting point. 3 And then you see the next four years that we're 4 proposing starting with your bill that you will 5 get in August 2020. 6 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: And I guess the 7 last one question would be, so Fenton -- part 8 of this is to reduce overflow in Fenton? Is 9 there any additional tax on Fenton to -- 10 because it's specifically aided by this or does 11 this just benefit the Meramec in general? 12 MR. HOELSCHER: So this program is to 13 benefit all of the local rivers throughout our 14 service area. 15 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Right, 16 MR. HOELSCHER: These overflows are 17 located throughout individual areas, local 18 streams. It's located -- we got outfalls 19 water that will reach the Missouri River. 20 Outfalls in the Mississippi River. Outfalls in 21 the Meramec -- they eventually get to the 22 Meramec River. River Des Peres. And then they 23 all obviously go to the Mississippi River and 24 leave the area. 25 So 'm mentioning that one just because www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 30 1 2 3 4 5 it's a large item. There is an awful lot of pollutants that enter. If -- you know, we've had floods down there the last two years. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Right. MR. HOELSCHER: One of the cost-effective 6 ways to eliminate those is simply get rid of 7 that plant, take that flow down to the Meramec 8 plant, and that gives us additional capacity 9 during nonflood periods to make sure the 10 collection system doesn't overflow into the 11 local environment. It allows -- gives us that 12 capacity. 13 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Okay. And last 14 15 16 17 18 19 thing, so I understand you're complying with the agreement, but just generally repair, rehabilitate aging system, isn't that ordinary business you're always budgeting for rather than getting new bonds for or not? MR. HOELSCHER: Correct. Repair and 20 rehabilitate the existing system doesn't come 21 out of that 1.6 billion I talked about. That's 22 part of our normal operating budget. It's 23 something that happens in this proposal. I had 24 mentioned we spend just over 25 percent of the 25 proposed revenues on operation and maintenance, www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 31 1 and that's to make sure the system stays in 2 place, what we have is in good shape. 3 But parameters for us to properly operate 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 and maintain that system are also part of the consent decree. So the consent decree not only has improvements we have to meet under a schedule to meet The Clean Water Act, it also has parameters that the EPA monitors to make sure we're properly maintaining the system that we have so that it doesn't go into disrepair. So part of this rate proposal will pay for operation and maintenance as well. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Okay. COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Thank you. Any questions, Rate Commissioners? Next I have Alonzo Reed. MR. ALONZO REED: Yeah. Thank you. You answered -- you did a great job answering the question. Did I hear you right saying if the 20 public didn't pass the bond, that you're still 21 going to do a rate increase? 22 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: That is correct. 23 Because of the consent decree, MSD is required 24 to do these upgrades. So they're either going 25 to do it by cash or they can do it by borrowing www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 32 1 the money. And so they have to go to the 2 voters, all of us here, to let us decide do we 3 want to have lower rates and take a longer time 4 to pay for this or to pay for it quicker, which 5 means higher rates as shown by the handout he 6 gave you. 7 MR. ALONZO REED: That's what I thought I 8 heard. Thank you. You did a great job. 9 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: I'm sorry. I don't 10 know if I can ask another -- if other people 11 have other questions. So wasn't this on the 12 ballot in August or was there a bond issue on 13 the ballot in August? Or am I -- is this the 14 same thing? 15 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: No, this is not. 16 Anybody else want to handle that or can 17 do it? 18 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: So there was no MSD 19 bond -- 20 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: There was. So the 21 difference is April -- if you're referring to 22 the one that was this past April, that was 23 stormwater. 24 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Oh. 25 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: This is www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 33 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 wastewater. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: So we could be dealing with two increases. COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: The one in April did not pass. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: I know. COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: That increase did not happen. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: But I'm guessing it will come back, right, or will rates increase because there was no bond, like with the increase without this bond? MR. ALONZO REED: You're going to get a rate increase. If you fail to pass this vote -- voting for a rate increase, they are going to increase your rate no matter what. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: I understand. But the bond issue for the -- you know what I'm saying? The -- MR. RATZKI: On the stormwater side, the proposal would be -- MR. ALONZO REED: That was the stormwater 23 and sewer. 24 MR. RATZKI: On the stormwater side, the 25 proposal made was to establish a capital fund www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 34 1 2 3 to do projects to improve the stormwater system, prevent flooding and that type of thing. The public did not vote for that, so 4 there's not a pot of money, as Brian puts it, 5 there to do capital projects in the stormwater 6 system right now at MSD. 7 Perhaps in the future they may come back 8 and ask for that, but right now there's no 9 money being spent on capital projects. 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Got it. 18 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: The stormwater 19 does not require this. The consent decree 20 does. 21 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Got it. 22 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Wastewater is. 23 That's the difference. There are -- MSD 24 recognizes and there's several communities that 25 have flooding, erosion issues, that are MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: So even though if this didn't pass there would be money spent, but that didn't pass, there won't be money spent? MR. RATZKI: Right. Because of the consent decree, the federal government is requiring them to do these capital projects. www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 35 stormwater related. They don't have any money 2 to do the major capital projects needed to 3 repair those. So the public said that's okay, 4 we can put up with that. Is that clear? 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 clear that I heard you right, but I understand. 14 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Yes. Two separate 15 issues: Stormwater, and this is wastewater. 16 MR. ALONZO REED: I totally understand. 17 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: So this one is 18 going to happen. There's going to be a rate 19 increase, 20 MR. ALONZO REED: That's right. 21 MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Yes. COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Because it is confusing. MS. VIRGINIA NESMITH: Yeah. There's a difference in -- (An off the record discussion was had with the court reporter.) MR. ALONZO REED: I just wanted to be COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Depending on what 22 the voters vote for will depend on what the 23 size of that rate increase is. 24 MR. ALONZO REED: That's right. 25 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Thank you, Alonzo. www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 36 2 3 Anybody else? If not, do any of the rate commissioners have any questions or even comments to clarify 4 anything that was said tonight? 5 A comment with respect to go ahead. 6 MR. DAVID RICHARDSON: Yeah. My name is 7 Dave Richardson. I'm a customer. And if I 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Yes. 18 MR. DAVID RICHARDSON: Because I look at 19 it from a corporate world. I can go out and 20 issue additional bonds, but you're not a 21 corporate entity. 22 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: We are not allowed 23 to -- they are not allowed. Keep in mind, we 24 are separate; we are not part of MSD. 25 MR. DAVID RICHARDSON: Right. understand what you're saying currently, if the bond issue passes, we're going to have a rate increase, but it will be lower. If we -- the bond issue fails, then you might have a rate increase, but it's going to be higher? In your charter then, you are required to have the public vote to indicate whether you can use -- increase the bonds, is that the way that works, for your organization? www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 37 1 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: We're a separate 2 group. They are not allowed to increase the 3 bonding capacity they have without a vote. 4 MR. DAVID RICHARDSON: Okay. 5 COMMISSIONER CROYLE: It's a part of the 6 Missouri Constitution and the laws that -- for 7 8 9 10 11 rates and taxes, you have to do it by vote. MR. DAVID RICHARDSON: Okay. And that's required for all utilities in Missouri? COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Public utilities. COMMISSIONER STEIN: Public. 12 MR. DAVID RICHARDSON: Public utilities. 13 Okay. All right. 14 COMMISSIONER SCHOEDEL: Any other 15 questions or comments for the Rate Commission? 16 If not, the next public hearing, as has 17 been stated several times, is on July 24th, 18 2019, at 9 a.m. It will be held at MSD at 2350 19 Market Street. However, that particular 20 meeting will also be streamed so it can be 21 viewed on Facebook live. 22 So if you want to hear about this again or 23 have additional questions that come up, you 24 would have an opportunity at that point to 25 present those questions. www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 38 i Hearing nothing further, this public 2 hearing is adjourned. 3 (Whereupon, the Public Hearing was 4 adjourned at 66;42 p.m.) 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 1 13 14 15 1 17 18 19 0 21 22 23 24 5 ww . &arts us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone:1.800.280,337 Fax:314.644,13 4 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 Page 39 1 REPORTER CERTIFICATE 2 1, SUSAN M. MOODY, a Certified Court Reporter within and for the State of Missouri, do hereby 3 certify that the MSD Rate Commission Public Hearing held on July 10, 2019, commenced at the UMSL Campus, 4 1 University Boulevard, Wellness & Recreation Center, St. Louis, Missouri 63121; that said hearing was reported by myself, translated and proofread using computer -aided transcription; and the above 6 transcript of proceedings is a true and accurate transcript of my notes as taken at the time the 7 proceedings were had. 8 I further certify that _ am neither attorney nor counsel for nor related nor employed by 9 any of the parties to the action in which this hearing was taken; further, that I am not a relative 10 or employee of any attorney or counsel employed by the parties hereto or financially interested in this 11 action. 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 24 25 Dated this 29th day of July, 2019. Susan M. Moody, CCR #430 www.alaris.us ALARIS LITIGATION SERVICES Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 PUBLIC HEARING 7/10/2019 A a 3:4,14,21 4:11 5:4,18,25 6:3 6:10,22,23 7:14 8:11,13,16 8:18,20 9:2,3 9:9,25 10:6,9 10:22 11:3,8,18 11:22 12:23,24 13:1,6,17,22 14:1,2,7,11 15:18,22,25 16:3,9,10 17:5 17:10,13,14 18:2,3,25 19:10,17,19,23 19:23 20:24 21:1,2,12,13,19 21:24 22:1,1,4 22:13,14,24 22:25 23:2,7 23:14,16,20,21 24:6,14 25:12 25:23 26:2,4 27:6,8,10,22 28:25 30:1 31:6,18,21 32:3,8,12 33:13,15,25 34:4 35:8,18 36:5,7,9,11,19 36:20 37:1,3,5 39:2,6,9 a.m 21:18 37:18 about 9:4,8,9,17 10:3,10 12:5 18:6,20,24 23:4 24:8,24 26:12 30:21 37:22 above 39:5 accelerated 18:8 accomplish 10:15 accurate 39:6 across 13:11 aided 29:10 6:2,5,12,14,18 26:9 Act 18:4 31:7 ALARIS 1:19 7:5,7,19,22,25 any 5:7,19 6:4 action 13:7 26:8 all 3:22 5:22 8:10,14,21,23 6:19 7:7 8:2 39:9,11 9:710:4,9 9:3,13,16,18 9:6,11 20:4 actively 19:16 12:9,10,25 9:25 10:17,24 24:5,25 25:2 activities 11:23 13:11 20:22 11:3,22,24,25 25:3 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