HomeMy Public PortalAbout03-11-2008Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
CITY OF MEDINA PLANNING COMMISSION
Meeting Minutes
Tuesday, March 11, 2008
1. Call to Order: Chair Jeff Pederson called the meeting to order at 7:02 p.m.
Present: Planning Commissioners Jeff Pederson, Michele Litts, Robin Reid, Victoria Reid (left
meeting at 8:35 p.m.), Jim Simons and Mary Verbick.
Absent: Planning Commissioner Charles Nolan.
Also Present: Planning Director Tim Benetti, Associate Planner Dusty Finke, and City Wetland
Conservation Act Agent John Smyth.
2. Public Comments on Items not on the Agenda
Pederson stated that last year, Metro West Inspections and Highway 55 Rental had donated trees
which were planted at Maple Park during Clean -Up day. Loren Kohnen had already offered
trees again this year. Pederson stated that if the Planning Commissioners wished to take part
in planting trees at Clean -Up Day, Highway 55 Rental would donate an additional tree per
Commissioner.
3. Update from City Council Proceedings
Weir presented a brief summary of Council activities since the February Commission meeting.
The Council recognized Police Reserve volunteers; discussed regulations for oversized
accessory structures, and will address these regulations as part of the Comp Plan
implementation work; extended fire service agreement with Maple Plain; accepted plans and
specs for the Hamel Road reconstruction project; discussed the long-term financial situation
with Ehlers; approved Stauber with PC recommendations, and urged the developer to leave
the possibility for additional units to the south; approved of a very ambitious workplan for
updating ordinances in order to implement the recently approved Comp Plan; discussed
TMDL of phosphorus into Lake Sarah; and set up an LIC Workshop for April 29th , as well
as an Open House for improvements at the CR116 & Hwy 55 intersection for April 22" d
4. Planning Department Report
Benetti noted three applications the City had received , which hopefully can be heard at the April
Commission meeting: a site plan review, amended CUP, and lot combination for Walter G.
Anderson; a CUP for an addition to an accessory structure at Skyrock Farm; and a sign
variance for Holy Name Church. He said the department had also completed interviews for
the new Planning Assistant, and that person should be in place in early April.
5. Approval of February 12, 2008 Planning Commission Minutes
Motion by Verbick, seconded by Litts to approve the February 12 minutes, with two changes
noted by Commissioner Verbick. Motion carries unanimously (Absent: Nolan).
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
6. Ordinance Amendment — Section 815 — Pertaining to regulations related to signage.
Public Hearing - TABLED from the February 12, 2008 regular meeting.
Finke presented a brief staff report. He stated the ordinance approaches three primary topics: 1)
dynamic signs; 2) off -premise signs; and 3) additional signage for 4-sided architecture. He
said the staff report explained the three topics. He noted that the scope of the amendment
was limited because the City would be looking at this ordinance again in a few months as
part of updating the zoning code for consistency with the updated Comp Plan.
R. Reid inquired how many existing dynamic signs were within the City.
Finke noted there are two existing signs which the regulations may apply to along Highway 55.
There are also electronic gas price signs at some of the gas stations in the City, although
these signs are likely not to change more than once every five minutes, even with gas prices
rising the way they are.
Simons inquired if it would be easy to decide which existing buildings should be considered
four-sided, and which would not be eligible for a bonus.
Finke stated that if an applicant from an existing building requested additional signage for the
back of an existing building, staff could examine the planning files and look at architectural
design to determine if four-sided architecture was intended. Staff should be able to fetter out
the people who are just trying for additional signage.
V. Reid inquired if the major concern on the dynamic signage was safety.
Finke stated that it was a major portion of the concern, because the signs can be terribly
distracting to drivers.
Verbick stated the safety concerns are very legitimate, but there is also an issue with visual
pollution. The City should have reasonable guidelines for this.
R. Reid said when she passes the signs along I394 and I494, they are extremely distracting. She
wished the League would come up with some data on the safety issues.
Public Hearing opened at 7:26 p.m.
Jeff Pederson (Highway 55 Rental — 225 Highway 55) stated they have had an approved and
permitted message sign for 10 years. Through agreement with the City, they post public
messages for the City and other community groups. He said they believe the sign is not the
type being described and is not as distracting. They are requesting the sign be considered a
grandfathered community sign and be allowed to continue for the benefit of the community
and Highway 55 Rental.
Verbick stated the signs at Highway 55 Rental and the Medina Entertainment Center have been
in existence and part of the community for a long time. She believes the draft allows the
signs to be grandfathered in, which is reasonable.
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
Finke stated that something which is non -conforming would be allowed to continue, but could
not intensify. The signs wouldn't be allowed to change more often, flash more, or be
increased in size. However, under the draft, they wouldn't be required to come into
compliance with the regulations.
Pederson stated that he would rather it not become a non -conforming sign.
Verbick inquired if there was some reasonable way to allow the sign to be designated as
continuing under a previous regulation and not be called non -conforming.
Finke stated that the sign would be non -conforming. The sign would be changing more often
than a sign would be allowed to under the updated ordinance. He stated it should be called
what it is, but that he would confer with legal staff to see if there was any other way to deal
with existing signs.
V. Reid inquired how a sign that was destroyed by a storm would be handled.
Benetti stated that the new sign would have to comply with the updated standards, or they would
have to apply for a variance.
Finke said he believed that statute now allows for a replacement of a non -conforming use that is
destroyed by a storm as long as a permit is pulled within a certain amount of time. The
Commission had a similar discussion with the wetland ordinance, and legal staff stated the
non -conformity could be built back to its original state. He stated that he would confirm with
the City attorney as to whether this was true.
Bob Raskob (Medina Recreations — 500 Highway 55) stated that their sign had gone up in 1999.
They have six businesses in the building and employ 113 employees. He said they have to
let the public know what they offer, and the sign does a good job of that. He stated that he is
unaware of any complaints on the sign. He believes it changes every 30 seconds. He stated
that he wishes for it to be allowed to continue as it is, because the sign is doing a good job as
it is.
R. Reid inquired why the bonus only applied to the Urban Commercial district.
Finke stated that it was thought this would be the most likely place for four-sided architecture to
occur. However, Commissioners could recommend it in other districts.
Public Hearing closed at 7:38 p.m.
Motion by R. Reid, seconded by V. Reid to recommend approval of the ordinance as written to
allow existing signs to continue as is and also with further research on other ways to handle
existing signs. Motion carries unanimously (Absent: Nolan).
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
7. Ordinance Amendment — Section 828.43 — Pertaining to Regulations Related to
Wetlands. Continued Public Hearing
Finke presented the staff report. He discussed the changes made to the draft since the February
Commission meeting and suggested specific topics which the Planning Commission may
wish to discuss.
Public Hearing continued at 7:50 p.m.
Paul Robinson (Bancor Group, Medina Country Club) stated they believe the Minnehaha Creek
watershed rules give enough wetland protection. They appreciate the maximum ratio and the
matrixes described by the staff report. He said he is concerned the setback is still too large
and he suggests more flexibility on the minimum buffer width. He stated a preserve requires
a buffer and setback of 40-50 feet, which doesn't allow a great deal of flexibility and is still
more than the largest Minnehaha buffer. He urged adding flexibility to setbacks and sliding
the minimums down a bit to allow additional flexibility. He stated that using buffer
averaging, the City doesn't lose buffer because the narrower portions are made up for
elsewhere.
Abdhish Bhaysar (2105 Chestnut Road) stated he was thinking about proactive ways to protect
wetlands. The wetland ordinance is reactive, not proactive. He stated he had two
suggestions: 1) Sequestering large portions of property for a set amount of time (using grant
money) in order to protect wildlife; and 2) incentivizing people to deal with their runoff,
perhaps through tax credits. He stated buffer zones a few feet wide aren't effective for
wildlife.
Public Hearing closed at 7:57 p.m.
V. Reid inquired if a small addition to a home would trigger the buffer requirements.
Finke stated that most work within 100 feet of a wetland which requires a permit is likely to
trigger the 20 feet buffer requirements. The 50 cu. yd./5000 sq. ft. threshold is fairly low and
will likely be triggered if there is land alteration/excavation.
Verbick stated she regrets the compromises that have already been made to the draft. The
Commission has focused heavily on people's rights and less on the broader context of the
environment, water quality and wildlife. We constantly impact the earth's ability to recharge
and refresh our limited water supply. She regrets that we haven't had a long-term view to
protect not only the public good, but for species habitat, species corridors and other things
that are so essential. She stated that hopefully this is a compromise that can move forward
without being further reduced or compromised.
Simons stated that he appreciates the comments on how important it is to look at the ordinance
from the more macro view. He said there had been quite a bit of compromise, but the real
question is how reasonable was the starting point before the compromising began. He stated
that he is very favorable of the flexibility that has been built in. He said he is concerned that
the minimums still seem higher than they ought to be, and that additional flexibility should
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
be built into the setbacks. Simons stated the Minnehaha Creek Watershed buffers are well
tested, and this current draft exceeds those standards, even without considering the setbacks.
R. Reid stated she appreciates the staffs efforts at integrating additional flexibility. She stated
the ordinance has addressed her main concerns and it is ready to move forward.
Litts stated the setback from the buffer is very important, whether it is 15 feet on all sides, or
some lower number. She said this is an ordinance the City can be proud of.
Pederson stated the staff did an excellent job listening to public and Commission comments. He
said he believes the setback should be reduced to 10 feet, but is not willing to argue about the
additional five feet if the Commission is supportive of 15. He stated that he is comfortable
with the draft as it stands.
V. Reid stated the draft is great, and that it is amazing that staff can listen to all the varying
comments and come back with a draft that approaches most of them. She inquired if a very
small setback should exist for all structures, so that people can paint and maintain them on
the side facing the buffer.
Motion by Verbick, seconded by R. Reid to recommend approval of the ordinance along with
the Commission's comments.
Simons inquired if there was a consensus on the Commission to recommend that flexibility be
added to the setback requirements of the ordinance.
Verbick suggested that Simons vote `no' on the recommendation and state that as his reason.
Simons stated that he will vote no in order to show his support for flexibility being allowed for
setbacks in addition to the buffers.
Motion carries (Opposed: Simons; Absent: Nolan).
Motion by Simons, seconded by V. Reid to recommend that the ordinance incorporate setback
flexibility, with an absolute minimum, similar to the language used regarding buffer width.
Finke noted that flexibility in setbacks will be much more difficult to formalize and administer.
Buffers are described through a legal description and can be shown graphically much easier,
while setbacks will be significantly more difficult. He suggested additional buffer flexibility,
perhaps by reducing the minimum buffer requirements, rather than trying to define some sort
of flexible setbacks.
Simons stated that there could certainly be innovative ways to accomplish it.
Motion carries (Opposed: Verbick and R. Reid; Absent: Nolan)
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
8. Abdhish and Mary Bhaysar — 2105 Chestnut Road (PID 15-118-23-24-0003) —
Conditional Use Permit for construction of a 8,400 sq. ft. accessory structure in the
Rural Residential (RR) zoning district.
Finke delivered a brief staff report. He stated the City Council had discussed accessory
structures in the RR district broadly during their March 3 meeting, but had not directed staff
to prepare ordinance amendments. He noted the Comp Plan implementation workplan shows
RR regulations being completed early in the process, so the Commission will likely be
discussing RR regulations, including accessory structure regulations, early in the summer.
He stated the applicant had integrated some architectural elements into the design since the
February Commission meeting, including windows, cupolas and overhangs. The updated
plans also identify an access drive as requested by the fire marshal. Finke noted that the
applicant has discussed a possible alternate location for the structure which would be more
screened from the east. He stated that staff had not fully reviewed the alternate location and
it was not part of the Commission packet.
Pederson stated staff could present the alternate location at the Council level if it seems like it
would work well, but the Commission probably shouldn't discuss it, since it hadn't been
reviewed yet.
R. Reid stated she would likely not support the alternate location if it would impact a lot of trees.
Abdhish Bhaysar (Applicant, 2105 Chestnut Road) stated they had taken the comments from the
Planning Commission and worked with their neighbors in an attempt to make the architecture
more pleasing and more like a barn. Additionally, 8-9 ft. Black Hill Spruce trees will be
planted to the east. He stated they have offered to lower the height of the building another
two feet to show their willingness to work with the Commission and neighbors.
Additionally, they could move the structure to the west farther into the woods which would
screen it even more. This would require removal of numerous trees, but they could save the
largest maples. He said his family had offered to purchase the Turnquist's property adjacent
to their property line if the Turnquists ever subdivided their property. The proposed structure
is complementary to their home and is made of steel and concrete. The siding is of high
quality paint with a 20 year warrantee. The siding and roofing steel is of higher quality than
was approved on the Schleeter and Evanson barn last year. He said they had moved to
Medina for the City's openness, freedom to do things with their property, freedom to raise
animals. He stated they were aware of the ordinances when they chose to move to Medina
and they are not trying to do anything that hasn't been done before, or anything that is
harmful to Medina.
Simons inquired which location the applicant preferred.
Bhaysar stated the alternative location would require the loss of more trees than they wished.
However, if it kept the peace, they would be willing to place it there.
T. Cody Turnquist (2000 Chestnut Road) thanked Bhaysar for spending the time on the new
design. There have been improvements, but they are still concerned with the overall height.
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
He stated they preferred the alternate location because it hid the structure from all portions of
their property. He said they were afraid of all of these `super -structures' being built for
purposes outside of the character of Medina.
Jim Lane (2605 Hamel Road) stated his comments didn't pertain to this application, per se, but
rather with the City's overall regulations pertaining to accessory structures in the rural area.
He stated this is the fourth application for these massive structures and the Commission and
Council have basically punted. He urged the Commission to think conceptually about
accessory structures. They should bear some relationship to the primary structure on the
parcel. A primary use of 5000 sq. ft. shouldn't have an accessory structure twice its size.
The Commission shouldn't let four more of these massive structures bite us. He urged the
Commission, regardless of what they decide on this application, to recommend that the
Council use its authority to remedy this problem proactively.
Verbick stated that being proactive is good. However, you can't always anticipate what the next
generation thinks is a `reasonable use of property.' Going back a generation, it was quite
common for a house to be quite modest and the accessory structures to be much larger.
These things should be kept in mind as we go forward.
Pederson stated he believes the City should regulate size of accessory structures in the future.
The applicant has done a great job trying to break it up. He suggested different materials on
the bottom, perhaps concrete. It meets the requirements, and the plantings are nice. He said
if staff believes the structure should be moved to the alternate location, and the Council
agrees, he wouldn't have a problem with that.
Litts said she agrees that it is a very large. She prefers the secondary site, not only because it is
more hidden, but also because it opens up potential pasture area. The structure does look
better. It may be nice to differentiate materials, but this may get too expensive and not
practical.
R. Reid stated that these things always end up looking larger than you think. The new design
looks like a barn and has been improved. The structure will not be visible from the road.
She stated the offer to purchase the property is generous. She said she would not oppose this
barn, but definitely thinks the accessory structure regulations should be looked at. Maybe it
is a square foot multiplier. She doesn't want these all over, but this one won't be seen.
Simons stated the secondary location may have a marginal benefit. He said the Commission will
be discussing this issue in a few months, and it will likely be fairly complicated, with all sorts
of formulas to consider.
Benetti inquired if the Commission were comfortable with the red color scheme.
Pederson stated the red may make the structure seem larger than a neutral color would.
Verbick inquired if the Commission should get to the level of regulating color schemes. She
inquired if the applicant really wished for a red barn on the property.
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Medina Planning Commission March 11, 2008 Meeting Minutes
Bhaysar said most of their house is white with yellow accents. However, in the interior, there are
grey and red steel accents. He said the Commission seemed to want a structure that looked
more like a barn, and they thought the red may help with that.
Christian Dean (Applicant's architect) stated that the design is based off a traditional barn and
was designed to appease neighbor and Commission concerns.
Verbick said she wouldn't regulate the color scheme, although she may think differently if it
were orange with purple polka dots.
Motion by Simons, seconded by Verbick to recommend approval of the CUP along with
conditions of staff report, an added condition requiring the trees as shown, and a
recommendation to have the Council review the alternate site. Motion carries unanimously
(Absent: Nolan and V. Reid).
9. Future Meeting Information
Benetti stated that the Hwy55/CR116 Open House on April 22 was meant as an invitation for the
Commissioners who wished to attend. However, the City Council wanted all Commissioners
to attend the Low Impact Design workshop on April29th. He noted that the Commission
may also wish to use the opportunity for an additional meeting regarding some of the
ordinance updates.
Finke noted the Commission should call a special meeting for the LID workshop, since the
Commission will have a quorum. He stated this would allow the Commission to also meet
after the LID workshop for additional agenda items if necessary.
Motion by Verbick, seconded by Litts to call a Special Planning Commission Meeting on April
29, 2008. Motion carries unanimously (Absent: Nolan and V. Reid).
10. Adjourn:
Motion by Verbick, seconded by R. Reid to adjourn at 9:20 p.m. (Absent: Nolan and V. Reid).
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