HomeMy Public PortalAbout1975_03_10 185
PUBLIC HEARING OF -LEESBURG TOWN COUNCIL, MARCH 10; 1975.
A Public Hearing was held by the Leesburg Town Council- in the
School Board Annex, 30 West North Street, Leesburg, Virginia, at 7 :30
P.M. , for the purpose of considering an appeal by the Loudoun County
Board of Supervisors of the disapproval of the Leesburg Board of
Architectural Review of an application for a Certificate of Ap-
propriateness on a proposed County Office Building to be located
within the Old and Historic Leesburg District. The meeting was
called to order by the Mayor, with Councilman Orr offering a prayer.
Present were : Mayor G. Dewey Hill, Councilmen Charles E . Bange,
Mary Anne Newman, Robert A. Orr, Herbert L. Ridder, James A. Rock
and C. Terry Titus .
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Some 60 persons or more were in the audience for this Hearing.
- Mayor Hill advised them that tablets were being circulated, on which
they might sign their names and addresses to denote whether they are
proponents or opponents of the proposed County Office Complex. A
tabulation of these votes will be announced at the close of the meet-
ing.
Mr. Philip A. Bolen, County Administrator to the Board of Super-
visors , read to Council a prepared Statement of Appeal, setting forth
the background of the design of the proposed County Office Building
and stressing the fact that efforts were made by the County 's Archi-
tectural Review Board to have the architect design a building that
would enhance the old and historic district of Leesburg. He pointed
out that the administrative staff of the county and the architect
did proceed through the proper channels - they did apply for a Cer-
tificate of Appropriateness to the Town 's Board of Architectural
Review. In the interest of the public, a scale model of the pro-
posed building was created and placed on public display. After
comments and criticisms, the architect was requested to make modi-
fications to the design. The modified design was presented to the
Town 's Board of Architectural Review and a public hearing was held
by said Board, with the resultant vote of 5 to 2 to deny the request
for a Certificate of Appropriateness . Presented along with this
Statement were copies of letters from the National Trust, the Vir-
ginia Landmarks Commission and W. Brown Morton, III, Consultant for
Historic Architecture of the National Park Service, all expressing
their approval of the design of such a building as proposed by the
architect. The Board's appeal is based on the merits of -the build-
ing and the fact that this should be the basis of judgment of any
group charged with the serious responsibility of such a decision.
A copy of said Statement of Appeal may be seen in the Town Manager's
Office.
Supervisor James Brownell made two points :
(1) He hoped this Council will give serious consideration to
the citizens of the County, as well as the citizens of Leesburg;
(2) Concerning the rumors of the threat that the Board might
move out of Town, he quoted a resolution adopted by the Board on
May 6, 1969, which stated "Any further building to house County
operations will be built, assuming no insurmountable problems,
somewhere in the area centered by the Court House and the outer
edge of the School Board building property." He said he personally
has no part of any design to move the County Complex out of Lees-
burg in the past, now or in the future.
Slides on this project were shown at this time by Mr. Tom
- ' Kamstra of the architectural firm, along with explanation of same.
Supervisor Frank Raflo advised that all Board members are present
tonight, with the exception of Mr. Arnold.
Colonel Michael C. Grenata believed that the proposed building
could be modified further to include the Board of Supervisor's meet-
ing room in the center of the main building as now designed, and that
the front of this building -be located at the iron fence on North
King Street. He presented a sketch showing his suggestion. He felt
that this move would satisfy those people who are not in favor of
the present design. The slogan of the proponents of the present
186
MINUTES OF PUBLIC -HEARING,--MARCH 10, 1975.
design is "Build the Coggs egffice Building Now. " -He suggested, in
place thereof, "Build thelCounty Office Building and Build it Soon.-"
A copy of his statement may be seen in the Office of the Town Mana-
ger.
Mr. Leland Mahan said he had signed a Petition suggesting that
further study be made of the model first presented, however, after
talking with many people and hearing the presentation by the archi-
tect, he is convinced that his initial impression was wrong. He
now believed that the structure proposed by the County is compatible
with the downtown area of Leesburg, and urged the Council to adopt
this position and move along with the construction of the Complex.
Mr.,John Waller, representing the Board of Directors of Peoples
National Bank, said that they have quite an investment in downtown
Leesburg and, at the present time, they are engaged in a project
which will invest at least another $200,000. At a meeting of the
Board on February 13th, a resolution was passed supporting the
presently proposed County Office Building as it may be amended by
the Board of Supervisors but, most importantly, .urging that it be
built in downtown Leesburg on the old hotel site and that it be
built now. Delay would result only in time consumed and higher
costs. They requested Council to take such action as may be. neces-
sary to allow building this Complex as proposed and as soon as
practicable.
As an interested citizen of Loudoun County, Mr. Waller: felt
that it is possible to disagree and not be disagreeable so that two
people might see the same building in a different light, yet neither
would be right or wrong. He believed (1) that any County Office
Building should serve as a backdrop for the existing building,
rather than overpower, and that this building proposed by Ramstra,
Dickerson & Associates would accomplish this ; and (2) He thinks it
best to get outside advice, and the only outside or expert opinions
he has heard concerning this Complex have been favorable to the pro-
posed plans. He would, therefore, hope Council will take such
steps as to permit construction of this building as proposed as
soon as possible.
Gen. Bertram Harrison said it is unfortunate that the Chairman
of the Leesburg Board of Architectural Review did not permit the
Board to seek alternatives to the present design. He cited many
rumors that have developed as a result of the design of this build-
ing and said he has in his possession a Petition containing over 400
names objecting to this building as proposed at this time. The Super-
visor 's meeting room is the problem. He suggeste4 as alternatives,
the following : (1) Move it from its present prominent location to
the east side of the building near the parking lot where it would
not be so obvious ; (2) Make it into a rotunda in the center of the
building; (3) It could disappear altogether and be incorporated as.
additional space within the building. Any one of these suggestions
should not cost any more money and should not delay construction.
He believed the Board of Supervisors would welcome a compromise if
the Council would propose it . He asked that Council not be stam-
peded into a regrettable decision, but that they meet with and con-
sult with the decision makers . It took 30 years to develop the
concept of Historic_ Leesburg and he hoped it would not be negated
tonight. There is a middle ground and it should be sought. Coun-
cilman Orr asked to see the Petition mentioned and it was presented
at this time .
Mr. Stanley F. Caulkins, Chairman of the newly formed Downtown
Business Association, presented a Petition with approximately 90
names from principal businesses and business-associated people , who
feel that the present Complex as it has been presented should proceed
and construction begin as soon as possible. He said the commercial
and economic structure of the center of Leesburg depends on this Com-
plex. . Councilman Orr asked Mr. Caulkins about his signature on the
Petition presented by General Harrison. Mr. Caulkins said he regrets
that decision now and asked that his signature on that Petition be
retracted. He now feels that a delay would result in increasing
costs to the County.
187
MINUTES OF PUBLIC HEARING; MARCH 10, 1975.
Mr. B. Powell Harrison, Chairman of the County"Office Develop-
ment Committee which was active' in 1968-1970, and a member of the
County Architectural Committee, sought Council's complete approval
of the present Kamstra Plan without delay and presenuepoints in
support of this position. A copy of his Statement is on file in
the Town Manager s Office.
Mr. Tom Jewell read a resolution adopted by the Loudoun County
Chamber:.of Commerce: Board of Directors on March 4, 1975 in support
of the immediate construction of the County Office Building on the
old hotel site in Leesburg, in accordance with the plans and speci-
fications recommended by the Board of Supervisors. He compared the
new Conference Center in Williamsburg, along with the old and his-
toric landmarks, to Leesburg and said "the old and the new- can sur-
vive together. "
Mrs. Teckla Cox, whose 19th Century home is just behind the lo-
cation of the proposed building, urged the acceptance of the design
as presented. She said "Preservation is something for the present,
as well as the past ," and felt that the proposed building is emi=
nently harmonious with the existing Town and with all the periods
represented in the Town.
Mr. Paul McDonald said that, after watching this struggle and
reading letters to the Editor over the last few months , it is obvious
that the people are widely split on the concept of what is proper
for the-County Office Building. He believes that Government should
be by the people and for the people and that it is the job of Govern-
ment to try to please the greatest number of people. The question
in his mind is "Is there only one main proposal and one modification,
or is there something else down the line a little further that will
please a greater number of the people?"
• Mr. John A. Wallace, Jr. felt that there is a great need for
cooperation between the Town and the County. The Town needs this
County Office Building downtown and this is what the County is ask-
ing for. It would seem reasonable that the County cannot continue
to pay architects ' fees in the hope of finding a design that would
please all. He did not feel that the Council, or any other lay
group, is in a position to second-guess the panel of experts chosen
by the County to make a decision on the design of this building.
He, therefore, urged the Council, in the spirit of cooperation and
good judgment, to approve the County ' s plan in order that they can
get on with their work.
Mayor Hill called for any others who were opposed to the plan
to speak, however, there were none . He then called for proponents
of the plan.
Mrs. Robert S. Pickens of Ashburn, who was a member of the County
Planning Commission for 20 years and who is a member of various or-
ganizations dedicated to restoration and preservation, particularly
in Virginia, believed-this proposed building to be harmonious and
appropriate, however, she could understand why some believed the op-
posite. She explained the architecture of the Administration Build-
ing, the Court House and the old Valley Bank Building', all of which
are of a different period but , basically they are all constructed of
brick - this is what ties them all together. The proposed new build-
ing is also to be of brick, which ties in with the structures ,al-
ready existing. It has features which do not repeat, but which echo,
the tradition of the older buildings. She felt that those people
who are worrying about the break in tradition do not realize that
they are carrying on tradition by having something which speaks for
its own time. This would be a contemporary building, but of conserva-
tive nature, just as the earlier buildings are. She felt this worry
is needless and hoped the Council would approve this building.
Mr. Crossman, Chairman of the Board of Supervisors, stated that
he appreciated the comments made tonight.
Mayor Hill then declared the Public Hearing closed.
188
MINUTES OF- PUBLIC HEARII%,-MARCH 10, 1975. -
On motion of Councilman Rock, seconded by Councilman, Titus, the
following resolution was proposed\
BE IT RESOLVED, that the Town\Council of the Town of Lees-
burg does hereby grant a Certificate of Appropriateness to
Loudoun County for its proposed County Complex in Downtown
Leesburg.
Letters from other interested citizens and bodies were read or re-
ferred to by the Clerk, as follows :
(1) A letter from Mr. R. K. Gheen in favor of the building
and in hope that the Board of Architectural Review's decision would
be overturned by the Council.
(2) A letter from the Leesburg Committee for the New County
Office Building requesting Council ' s support and vote for the ap-
proval of the proposed office building so that construction can pro-
ceed as quickly as possible .
(3) A letter from Mr. John G. Lewis, Chairman of the Loudoun
County Board of Architectural Review, setting forth the work done
by this Board in connection with the design of this building and the
reasons for its approval.
(4) A letter from the Cecil B. Dicksons opposing the proposed
design.
(5) A statement from Mrs. Contee Adams asking for a compromise
by moving the Supervisors ' meeting room to the rear of the Court
House and placing the Office Building at King Street.
(6) A copy of a letter from Mrs . Teckla H. Cox to the Editor
of the Loudoun Times-Mirror in favor of the proposed building..
(7) A letter from The Steering Committee of the Downtown Busi-
ness
Association of Leesburg, seeking the Council 's support for the
economic future of Downtown Leesburg.
All of these letters may be seen in the Office of the Town Manager.
As to the resolution proposed, Councilman Ridder felt that those
who have spoken have been very articulate. He particularly liked
the statements made by Mrs. Cox and Mrs. Pickens - he isin strong
agreement with their sentiments. He has viewed the model and the
slides and finds the rendering to lend a sense of serenity and beauty
to the Court House Square. It does carry out the meaning of Down-
town Leesburg and he is in favor of it.
Councilman Rock agreed with Mr. Ridder and was especially im-
pressed with the remarks of Mrs. Pickens, especially her description
of what history really is. He congratulated Mr. Kamstra on his presen-
tation. He is in favor of the proposed building.
Councilman Titus felt that, although this Council is not bound
by the philosophical ideas or feelings of previous Councils, it must
keep in mind the public responses made by these Councils or their
representatives. In this vein, he referred to a resolution adopted
by the Town Council in November of 1969, whereby the Mayor was author-
ized to send a letter to the Board of Supervisors stating that the
Council and the Planning Commission agreed that the development should
be in the area of their present location. Also, he called attention
to a statement by then Mayor Rollins to the Board of Supervisors in
June of 1972, in which he indicated the Town 's willingness to cooper-
ate with the County in anything that was decided on the County Complex.
He referred to a sequence of events that eventually led to the meeting
of the Town's Board of Architectural Review, at which time a Certi-
ficate of Appropriateness was denied by a vote of 5 to 2. There were
certain allegations made at this meeting which he felt bear comment.
They are: (1) "The Town 's Board of Architectural Review was never
consulted." He felt that this had never been done in the past ; the
189
MINUTES OF PUBLIC HEARING, MARCH 10, 1975.
Board's Chairman was a member of the County Review Board; and why
didn 't the members of the Town's Board take the time andmake the
effort to find out what was going on - even as interested citizens,
this should have been done. (2) Thee were charges Of] threats of
removal of the building from Leesburg or that the building would be
built regardless of the threat of lawsuits or invalidation of the
Board's authority. These are political and legal realities - the
Town 's Board is not a political body - they are appointed by the
Mayor. Political statements belong in this form, not theirs. He
classified the Board's work, with the exception of this issue, as
extremely exceptional. (3)"There was blatant disregard for the
citizens of Leesburg and Loudoun County by the Board of Supervisors
and its staff. " He felt this to be a totally unfounded, uncalled
for and untrue statement. He found the proposed building to be a
refreshing 20th Century a cU,cion to Leesburg and both harmonious and
congruous to its surround gnd the Town as a whole. ,Looking for a
perfect building would be like "looking for Jesus Christ in the Town
Manager. " As documentation or grounds for the Town to approve a
Certificate of Appropriateness, if needed, he referred to the let-
ters submitted by the Board from the National Trust, the Virginia
Landmarks Commission and Mr. Morton. He c ®plimented Mr. Kamstra
and his associates for the consideration shown the Town of Leesburg
in the design of the building and urged the Board of Supervisors to
begin as soon as possible with plans for the construction of this
budding.
Councilman Newman said that the primary reason for her vote as
a member of the Board of Architectural Review was that, when she was
running for Council seat, she stated she was interested in the preser-
vation of the old and historic area and she was reminded of this
statement. However, as a member of Council, she felt that she can-
not represent special interest groups. It was her personal opinion
that, if there had been some rapport between the Town and the County
Architectural Review Boards, this meeting may not have been necessary.
If the Leesburg Board had known that the architect was hired to de-
' sign a contemporary building, perhaps this problem could have been
avoided - there was no communication between the two Boards. Per-
haps if there had been, the Board could have possibly made a favor-
able decision when the Certificate of Appropriateness was requested.
Councilman Orr asked if the Board Room can be moved to the cen-
ter or another portion of the building without significantly changing
the aspects and the working of the building. Mr. Kamstra said "No."
Dr. Orr said the architecture of Leesburg is certainly not colonial.
Williamsburg is colonial, yet the Information Center and a series of
motels owned by Colonial Williamsburg are approved. One is "The Cas-
cades," which looks almost exactly like the proposed County Office
Building. He would like to please as many people as possible, but
he did not know whether you please them by doing what they want or
by doing what you think is best for them. He certainly did not want
to set himself up to say what is best for anybody - he is not an
architect. The Town went through this same type of thing with the
By-Pass. This is a country of specialization. He: wished that those
who want to do something about the architecture of Leesburg had joined
him five or six years ago when Council had a great desire to take
down every living tree. He feels that trees are the important thing
in Leesburg. He felt that the time and cost involved in changing the
building would not be minimal and that the architects have done the
best they can. They were chosen by and paid by the County and he
hoped the people would enjoy this building as proposed.
Councilman Bange said the County commissioned Mr. Kamstra to
design a building that was functional, yet would blend with the
area. When the original design was presented, he disagreed with it.
However, with the modifications made since that time, he feels the
present proposal now blends with the rest of the Complex. He noted
that three people have gone on record as asking for a compromise, and
he felt that some of the signators on the Petition presented by Gene-
ral Harrison might now change their minds since the modifications have
been made. He felt that this proposed building represents the archi-
tecture of our day and that the Council should issue a Certificate of
Appropriateness in order that the Supervisors might get on with the
building.
190
MINUTES OF PUBLIC HEARING MARCH 10; -1975.
Mayor Hill said that, from a technical aspect of design, he is
"really out in left field," citing a personal experience involving
an addition to his home. He said he has tried to keep an open mind
on this subject and he feels the overwhelming fact is that the Town
needs this facility in Downtown Leesburg. He did not think the Town
Council could jeopardize the building of this structure. He thanked
the County for following the channels. He also felt that the Board
of Architectural Review did their work to the best of their ability
and appreciated their convictions. He also appreciated the presence
of those in the audience at this meeting.
On a roll call vote of 6 to 1 abstention, shown below, the reso-
lution
proposed was adopted:
Aye: Councilmen Bange, Orr, Ridder, Rock, Titus and Mayor Hill.
Nay: None .
Abstain: Councilman Newman.
The ad_hoc vote taken from the audience was reported to be 26
for and 16 against.
On motion of Councilman Orr, seconded by Councilman Newman, the
meeting was adjourned at 9:45 P.M.
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