HomeMy Public PortalAbout2009_tcwsmin1013Council Work Session
October 13, 2009
Council Chambers, 25 West Market Street, 7:30 p.m. Mayor Umstattd presiding.
Council Members Present: David S. Butler, Thomas Dunn, II, Katie Sheldon
Hammier, Kenneth "Ken" Reid, Kevin Wright and Mayor Kristen Umstattd
Council Members Absent: Marty Martinez
Staff Present: Town Manager John Wells, Town Attorney Jeanette Irby, Deputy
Town Manager Kaj Dentier, Director of Planning and Zoning Susan Berry-Hill,
Director of Parks and Recreation Rich Williams, Director of Public Works Tom Mason,
Assistant Director of Capital Projects Management Tom Brandon, Economic
Development Manager Marantha Edwards, Deputy Zoning Administrator Wade
Burkholder, Capital Projects Senior Engineer Anne Geiger, and Management
Specialist Debi Parry
Work Session Items for Discussion:
a. Woodberry Road Capital Project
Tom Brandon outlined the Woodberry Road Capital Project and the existing
conditions on the street. He stated major issues include impacts to landscaping
and yards, impacts to on-street parking, pedestrian safety, impacts to traffic,
undesirable existing ditches, conversion of the neighborhood to a more modern
state and neighborhood appearance. He stated staff met with the neighborhood
in July and returned to meet with 16 individual property owners in August. He
stated in September a group of neighbors came to Council to petition against the
sidewalk and asked that the drainage improvements be limited to the area
where the improvements are needed. He stated based on the resident meetings,
emails, project questionnaire and details of the project staff recommends
supporting the current capital project goals of improving drainage and
pedestrian access with curb and gutter along the entire street and sidewalk
along the east side. Further, he stated if the Town Council direction is to delete
the sidewalk from the project, then staff recommends curb and gutter on both
sides only in areas required to improve drainage, terminating at approximately
116-1]7 Woodberry Road.
Mayor Umstattd asked if it is the understanding of staff that a strong majority
of the residents do not want the sidewalk.
Mr. Brandon stated this is a strongly divided community. He stated there is a
group of people who would like to delete the sidewalk from the project, a slightly
smaller group that want a sidewalk either on one or both sides and a few who
either have no preference or did not respond.
Council Member Dunn verified the questionnaire responses were gathered
before staff made a recommendation. He stated we do not know how the
residents who did not respond would feel about a sidewalk on either side. He
asked how staff came to the recommendation of a sidewalk on the east side?
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Paae 2
Mr. Brandon stated originally the project scope included pedestrian safety
improvements; however only one resident on the street Indicated support for
sidewalk on both sides of the road. He stated looking at the number of
pedestrians on this street staff felt a sidewalk on the east side would be
sufficient to serve their needs.
Council Member Dunn asked how many trees will be impacted by a sidewalk
on the east side.
Mr. Brandon stated 5-6 trees would need to be removed.
Council Member Reid verified the location of the drainage issue on the street.
He verified the curb and gutter improvements are only needed from the central
part of the street continuing to the north to eliminate the drainage issues. He
asked why the on-street parking would need to be removed if curb and gutter
were installed on the south end of the street.
Mr. Brandon stated the Town's right-of-way is narrower on the south end and
the road would need to be narrowed to avoid having to impact resident's yards
outside of the right-of-way.
Council Member Reid expressed support for the second option to provide curb
and gutter improvements in the central part of the street.
Council Member Butler verified the survey results reported were only from
residents who would be impacted by the improvements. He expressed concern
with installing curb and gutter only on one portion of the street. He stated given
that the residents are split on the sidewalk Issue, it is his feeling is that if curb
and gutter and sidewalk are installed on the entire street it would not be long
before the residents appreciated the improvements.
Council Member Wright stated it is his understanding that the majority of
work would occur in the Town's easement; however, some residents have
installed landscaping within the easement. He stated the biggest impact seems
to be to the two properties on Edward's Ferry Road which have side lots on
Woodberry Road in that they would lose their on-street parking. He questioned
whether all plantings that would be removed are within the existing right-of-
way.
Mr. Brandon stated the majority of the landscaping impacts are within the
existing right-of-way; however, there will be some temporary grading
easements needed outside the existing right-of-way that will effect some
landscaping.
Council Member Wright stated the Planning Commission has discussed similar
situations and generally felt that sidewalks should be installed while insuring a
more traditional, narrower street is maintained. He asked the current pavement
width and what the pavement width would be under staff's recommendation.
Mr. Brandon stated the current pavement width where there is existing curb
and gutter is 30 feet which allows parking on one side by Town standards. He
stated the area where there currently is no curb and gutter has an average
Town Council Work Session of October 13. 2009 Page 3
width of 22 feet with a minimum of 20 feet. He stated staff is proposing a width
of 30 feet in the central portion of the street and 22 feet In the southern portion.
Council Member Wright asked if the flooding is primarily limited to the yards.
Mr. Brandon stated there is only occasional yard flooding. He stated the main
issue is standing water in the ditches.
Council Member Wright stated he is leaning towards the sidewalk; however,
he does not want to eliminate the on-street parking utilized by the residents.
Vice Mayor Hammier thanked staff for their efforts in meeting with the
residents. She verified five to six trees would be lost if the sidewalk were
installed on the east side. She verified the majority of responders do not want
the sidewalk based on the most current Information provided. She asked the
cost savings to the project should the sidewalk be eliminated.
Mr. Brandon stated the savings would be approximately $50,000.
Vice Mayor Hammier stated based on the fact that we would save trees,
retain the character of the neighborhood and represent the largest number of
residents she would not be In favor of Installing the sidewalk.
Mayor Umstattd concurred with Council Member Reid and Vice Mayor
Hammier stating the charm is lost when older neighborhoods are modernized,
She stated she is mindful of the residents who want the sidewalks for safety
reasons; however, she does not want to see the trees or on-street parking
removed.
Mr. Wells stated staff will bring forward a motion tomorrow night.
b. SW Connector Trail
Anne Geiger provided background Information on the SW Connector Trail
stating for over 20 years the residents of Southwest Leesburg have been
petitioning the Town for connectivity to the W&OD Trail. She stated after
several unsuccessful attempts at consensus the Council established the SE/SW
Trails Ad-Hoc Committee in 2006 and accepted their recommendation to build
the Southwest Connector Trail. She stated on April 2 a letter was sent to the
affected property owners and the owners of the Country Club Green
Condominiums and the Tuscarora Creek Apartments came forward stating that
their concerns were not adequately addressed by the ad-hoc committee and as a
result the project has been phased to allow adequate time for a resolution.
Further, she outlined the three phases and construction schedule including
Phase 1, Clubhouse Drive across the Bypass to Lee Avenue starting In summer
2010; Phase 2, around Loudoun County High School starting in spring 2011; and
Phase 3 in the vicinity of the Country Club Green Condominiums with a
construction date to be determined. She stated some condo owners want only
Phase 3 eliminated while others want the entire project eliminated. Further, she
stated the Tuscarora Creek Apartment owners are requesting only that Phase 3
be eliminated.
Council Member Reid verified the proposed alignment of Phase 3 asking if the
trail could be put behind the condominiums along the Route 7/15 Bypass.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Paae 4
Ms. Geiger stated that change in alignment would require the removal of
trees that buffer the condominium residents from the Route 7/15 Bypass. She
stated the buffer area Is 40 feet, while the trail is proposed to be 10 feet and will
be constructed within a 14 foot easement.
Council Member Reid asked if the trail could be narrowed.
Ms. Geiger stated the trail could be narrowed to a minimum of 6 feet.
Council Member Butler stated he is well versed on this project and has spoken
with fellow members of the ad-hoc committee regarding these concerns. He
stated there are some misconceptions about the care the committee gave the
Chancellor Street residents as opposed to the other residents affected by the
trail. He stated the committee met once with the Chancellor Street residents at
the beginning of the project out of due diligence recognizing the process that
had gone on before. He stated after that there were no other meetings
specifically with the Chancellor Street residents. Further, he stated the other
members of the ad-hoc committee have no concerns regarding the proposal to
delay Phase 3 of the project for a while to determine the impact and use of the
other phases of the trail and the feeling of the rest of the community.
Council Member Butler stated this trail is to benefit the entire southwest
Leesburg community, He stated there are some residents of the southwest who
are using the King Street Trail; however, there are others who do not feel that
trail is safe for their families to use. Further, he stated he is also aware of other
potential alignments and the ad-hoc committee has no problem with the
consideration of other alignments.
Council Member Wright asked how much of the design work for this project
has been completed.
Ms. Geiger stated the entire trail has gotten through 30 to 40 percent
drawings. She stated the second submission is going to be 70 to 80 percent
drawings for Phase 1 in February or March.
Council Member Wright stated when the Southwest Trail was being considered
the project was reviewed by the Parks and Recreation Commission, Planning
Commission and Town Council before being added to the Capital Improvements
Program. He stated the project phasing allows time to see if there is a better
alignment for Phase 3; however, the rest of the project needs to move forward
as the southwest section of the community has waited long enough for trail
connectivity.
Vice Mayor Hammier thanked the residents who have gotten involved in this
process. She stated in voting to approve this project she did so out of respect
for the process; however, she has since learned that the process was flawed.
She stated for ail of the reasons expressed by the residents of the Country Club
Green Condominiums and Tuscarora Creek Apartments she will support
eliminating Phase 3. Further, she stated an option for some interior ways to
move around the Town would be to add striping to the streets for bike lanes to
connect to Phase 1 and 2.
Town Council Work Session of October 13. 2009 Page 5
Mayor Umstattd concurred with Vice Mayor Hammler's desire to eliminate
Phase 3. She stated Dominion Virginia Power is looking to place some of their
transmission line poles in that area and asked if staff is aware of those locations.
Ms. Geiger stated staff has been working with Dominion Virginia Power to
design the trail around the poles.
Mayor Umstattd stated regarding the rest of the trail, she thinks about other
areas of Town that need pedestrian bridges across the route 7/15 Bypass such
as Edwards Ferry Road and Fort Evans Road. She stated this trail costs a lot of
money and is not the most pressing priority for Town funds and the residents of
Clubhouse Drive have made it clear that they feel left out of the process.
Further, she stated this trail is not her top priority and she would recommend
eliminating Phase 3.
Council Member Reid stated it is interesting that people who voted for this
trail two years ago are now backing off. He stated he tried very hard two years
ago to look at the A-2 option devised by the ad-hoc committee to put the trail
directly from Chancellor Street, under Dry Mill Road and along the Route 7/15
Bypass to the W&OD Trail. He stated he was the only one who supported this
option for approximately $3.5 million and now the Mayor and Vice Mayor want to
eliminate the phase providing interior access. He stated in the southeast the
residents have access to the W&OD Trail in Kincaid Forest and the residents in
the southwest would like to be able to bike on neighborhood streets and go up
through Chancellor Street and access either the Southwest Connector Trail or
the W&OD. He stated he does not support eliminating Phase 3 which would
deprive the residents in the southwest of this trail. Further, he suggested asking
VDOT whether the Town could build the A-2 alignment.
Council Member Butler stated the A-2 alignment travels along a ridge and
hooks up with the current bridge abutment. He stated he spoke unofficially with
a VDOT representative who indicated he would be very surprised if this received
VDOT approval.
Council Member Reid stated it is similar to the W&DO alignment in the
southeast where it travels under the Route 7/15 Bypass. He stated it does not
make sense to construct Phase 1 without the connection from the western
neighborhoods like Greenway Farm and Woodlea Manor. He stated he feared
there would be an outcry and the Chancellor Street connection would be
eliminated, which he believes is what some residents of Chancellor Street were
hoping in putting forth this expensive option. He stated he is willing to live with
the proposal by reducing the width of the trail and cutting back on the Lee
Avenue portion, or formally request approval for the A-2 option from VDOT.
There was further Council discussion of the A-2 option.
Council Member Butler stated it is difficult for residents outside the Route
7/15 Bypass to feel connected to the downtown, He stated they have to get in
their cars to access the downtown and once they do that they are just as likely
to go east to Brambleton or Lansdowne. He stated in Ashburn there is a trail
network that is utilized by the kids to travel around and visit friends. Further,
he stated the ad-hoc committee looked to create a trail network that would allow
Town Council Work Session of October 13 2009 Page 6
residents of the southwest and southeast to safely connect into interior
Leesburg.
Mayor Umstattd stated whereas there may be some people who discount the
South King Street Trail, she sees more people using it than most other trails in
Town.
Council Member Dunn outlined the history of this project. He stated the
South King Street Trail extension will connect to the W&OD Trail for much less
money, He stated we are only 30 percent into the planning for the southwest
connector and have already spent $50,000. He stated there is a need for a
bridge in the northern part of Town around Edwards Ferry and Fort Evans Roads
that far outweighs the need for this bridge. He stated the Planning Commission
suggested a few years ago that this project be capped at $2 million. He stated
he also has concerns that the first phase of the trail will serve few people and we
would be better served with improvements on Davis Avenue. Further, he stated
ten years ago the original Chancellor Street Trail could have been constructed
for $2 million and the southwest residents would have had the connection they
desire.
Council Member Butler stated the ad-hoc committee discussed this issue for
six months. He stated the original Chancellor Street Traii was eliminated
because it was not safe and it would have cost an enormous amount of money
to make it safe while providing only recreational access to the W&OD. He stated
the South King Street Trail between Country Club Drive and' Governor's Drive is
considered safe with the addition of the fence and guardrail. He stated the other
section from Governor's Drive into the downtown is where the main safety
concerns are. Further, he stated the Southwest Connector was conceived to
provide a safer alternative for families on bicycles.
Council Member Reid reiterated his proposal to formally request permission
from VDOT to construct the A-2 option from Chancellor Street to Dry Mill Road.
He stated if VDOT will not permit this option then he would support moving
forward with the Southwest Connector Trail by realigning the portion near the
Country Club Green Condos and narrowing the trail to six feet.
There was further Council discussion regarding the alignment of the A-2
option.
Council Member Wright stated the concern with the A-2 option is that it would
take away the consensus we have now for the trail among the residents who
have been promised a trail for a long time. He stated the Southwest Connector
Trail is more of a community connection whereas the A-2 alignment is a
recreational connection to the W&OD Trail.
Mayor Umstattd stated a citizen has pointed out that the Phase 1 section goes
across where there are golf balls flying through the air.
Council Member Dunn stated there is an unofficial trail behind the woods near
Chancellor Street and if Phase 3 is removed then more people will use this
unofficial trail as it is the most direct connection. He stated the South King
Street Trail is more of a commuting trail as it is more direct; whereas, the
Southwest Connector is more of a recreational trail.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 7
Vice Mayor Hammier stated it seems there are at least two Council Members
who would agree to hold off on Phase 3 till a later time, there are two others
who are ready to eliminate Phase 3 but would agree to hold off on it and asked
Council Members Dunn and Reid for their feelings on either option.
Council Member Dunn stated removing Phase 3 would be fine as long as it
means the rest of the project will also be stopped. He stated he favors a trail
with the A-2 alignment as proposed by Council Member Reid.
Council Member Reid stated he is against eliminating Phase 3, rather he
would favor realigning and narrowing the trail. He stated it seems Council is not
willing rescope the project; however, a Chancellor Street connection is needed.
Vice Mayor Hammier recommended moving forward with a resolution
regarding Phase 3 tomorrow. Further, she stated other recommendations could
be brought forward at that time.
Mayor Umstattd suggested two resolutions, one removing Phase 3 from the
project and the other delaying Phase 3 for a couple of years.
Vice Mayor Hammier suggested wording the resolution so it states that
Council action is required before any further resources are dedicated to Phase 3.
Council Member Butler stated he would support that recommendation.
Council Member Dunn stated the whole purpose of Phase 3 is to get people
safely to the trail. He stated removing Phase 3 means that residents will have to
use the South King Street Trail to access the Phase 1 bridge to access downtown
via Dry Mill Road when they could just travel straight on South King Street. He
stated he cannot support funding a trail that does not make sense,
Council Member Butler stated he agrees with Council Member Dunn that the
South King Street Trail is the best option if you are traveling on foot; however, it
is not viable for those traveling on bicycle.
Council Member Reid asked if Vice Mayor Hammier would support the
realignment and narrowing of Phase 3 so the condominiums and apartments are
not impacted. He stated he would not want to leave this issue open ended as it
is unfair to the residents of Greenway Farms, Woodlea Manor, linden Hill and
Country Club.
Mayor Umstattd stated Council Member Reid mentioned the possibility of
placing the trail closer to Route 15 behind the condominiums. She stated it
seems there is not much room in that area and that this realignment would
impact these residents as much as the current Phase 3 alignment.
Ms. Geiger stated the residents have considered this option and have stated
they would not support the trail behind their condominiums,
Council Member Dunn stated some of their other concerns were with the
amount of additional traffic and potential criminal activity; however, their
neighborhood is the terminus of Phase 1 so those additional individuals will be
entering their neighborhood anyway.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 8
Council Member Butler stated the bridge terminus is before you reach the
condominiums and there is plenty of parking along Clubhouse Drive so there
would not be additional traffic in this area. He stated the ad-hoc committee felt
the trail would still be viable without the Phase 3 connection; however, that is
not their first choice. He stated they also would not have an issue with this
portion of the trail being constructed last or requiring Council action before
moving forward with Phase 3.
Council Member Reid asked why the ad-hoc committee would not support the
A-2 alignment.
Council Member Butler stated the A-2 alignment would not be the preference
of the ad-hoc committee because they agreed to a trail network that would
connect the schools, community and neighborhoods.
Council Member Reid stated he cannot believe that the Mayor and Vice Mayor
voted for this a couple of years ago and now want to eliminate this option and
now it seems the trails committee wants to eliminate the connection to
Chancellor Street as well. He stated this is what he feared three years ago that
the Southwest Connector is nothing more than a way to make the trail very
expensive, long and time consuming so there would be no connection to
Chancellor Street. He stated this is not about helping the residents of the
condominiums and apartments, but rather appeasing a couple of residents on
Chancellor Street who do not want a trail connection on their street even though
it would be cheaper and built faster and do more to connect people in this
quadrant to the W&OD Trail. Further, he urged Council to work with the
condominium and apartment residents to minimize the impact of the trail as it
makes no sense to spend $5 million on a bridge when that money could go for
improvements on Davis Avenue as Council Member Dunn suggested.
Council Member Wright asked Tom Mason what he would anticipate the
response from VDOT to be if Council requested the A-2 alignment considering
the future widening of the Route 7 Bypass and the Dominion Virginia Power
transmission lines.
Mr. Mason stated he believes VDOT would probably reject this proposal
because of the limited access right-of-way or would ask that Council reconstruct
the bridge outside of the limited access right-of-way. He stated pedestrians are
not allowed in the limited access right-of-way by law. Further, he stated this
alignment was considered before and was discounted because of Issues with the
right-of-way, building a bridge across the Dry Mili Branch and then connecting to
Dry Mill Road where the slope would be so steep that maximum tree loss would
be required for grading.
Council Member Wright stated without the possibility of the A-2 alignment we
are left with the question of whether or not we want the Southwest Connector
Trail, which he supports.
Vice Mayor Hammier stated she is firmly representing those that have come
forward based on their lack of due process along Clubhouse Drive.
Council Member Dunn stated in most cases we would all agree that the
answer from VDOT is "no". He stated for the money we would save on the
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Paae 9
bridge, Council could find a way to make the A-2 alignment less impactful. He
stated 10 years ago had Council voted on this there would be a trail there with
people using it. Further, he stated the bridge could be better served in the
northeast quadrant of Town by residents without transportation needing to get
to the grocery store and to work,
Council Member Reid stated the only other alternative he can think of would
be to build a bridge parallel to the Dry Mill Road bridge; however, there is still
the issue of getting the trail up on the east side of the Bypass. He stated he
accepts Mr. Mason's comments about A-2's lack of vlabillty, but there still needs
to be a connection at Chancellor Street and the way to move forward is to work
with the condominium and apartment residents. He stated the way to provide
pedestrian safety in the northeast is to construct the Edwards Ferry Road
interchange. Further, he asked that any resolution brought forward to delay
Phase 3 should set some sort of date for it to come back to Council and that
staff be encouraged to work to minimize the impact.
Mr. Wells stated staff will bring forward an alternative set of motions
tomorrow night to move forward with Phases 1 and 2 while either eliminating
Phase 3, delaying it or delaying it to a date certain.
Council Member Dunn stated he would also like a resolution to support the
original A-2 alignment.
Council Member Butler stated given the potential impact to the southwest he
would like to see these resolutions delayed for two weeks.
Council Member Reid supported Council Member Butler's suggestion.
Mayor Umstattd stated her preference to vote tomorrow night because some
citizens are already planning to attend the meeting.
Council Member Butler stated he would feel comfortable moving forward with
a resolution to delay Phase 3 but would want staff to speak with residents from
the southwest before Phase 3 is eliminated.
It was the consensus of Council to move forward tomorrow night.
c. ARC of Loudoun Funding Request
Mr. Wells stated at a previous meeting it was requested that Council consider
funding a playground to be constructed at the ARC facility at Paxton. He stated
Council asked staff to report back regarding funding this project with Uran
funds. He stated the current balance of available Uran funds is $210,000 and it
is anticipated that $200,000 will be needed for the FY2011 budget to continue
current programs. He stated Mr. Wolfson indicated the total cost of the
playground would be $60,000.
Council Member Dunn stated ARC is looking for $60,000; however, Mr. Wells
is recommending that $10,000 be provided. He asked why Council could not
provide the $60,000.
Mr. Wells stated Council could provide $60,000 for the project; however, that
will mean that there will be $50,000 less to fund the FY2011 programs.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 10
Council Member Dunn stated he would be in favor of funding the $60,000
request.
Council Member Reid concurred with Council Member Dunn's comments. He
stated he is disappointed to see that the Uran funds are being used for Town
programs. He stated the Recreation Outreach Community Kids (ROCK) program
needs to be reevaluated. Further, he stated he would support the ARC request
for $60,000 as they are helping disadvantaged kids, which was Mr. Uran's
intention.
Council Member Butler concurred with comments to fund the $60,000
request.
Council Member Wright stated as he understands it the Uran funds are being
used in the budget as Mr. Uran intended. He stated the ROCK program is a
model of what he Intended as is the ARC project. He stated he is not sure that
he would be willing reduce services next year but would support awarding the
$10,000 recommendation.
Vice Mayor Hammier asked for a description of the playground project and
the number of Leesburg children who would benefit from it.
Jennifer Lassiter, ARC of Loudoun, stated the playground would be disability
safe and accessible by children in wheelchairs. She stated this would be the
only playground of its kind in the County. Further, she stated the playground
would be used for afterschool activities by all of the kids in the ARC program.
Vice Mayor Hammier asked if other funding sources have been sought.
Ms. Lassiter stated they have written a couple of grant requests for the
overall upgrades and ongoing programs, but not specifically for this playground,
Vice Mayor Hammler asked if ARC would consider making it a publically
accessible park during off hours if Town funds are provided.
Ms. Lassiter stated the zoning regulations would need to be modified for that
use.
Vice Mayor Hammler asked for staff to follow up on the zoning Issue.
Mayor Umstattd stated she would support the allocation of $10,000 but would
not want to see cuts to the ROCK program as it benefits the most disadvantaged
children in Leesburg. She stated she does not agree with Council Member Reid's
comments that the program should be reevaluated as it has tremendous
community support.
Council Member Dunn stated he would like to see how we are allocating funds
for the ROCK program. He stated it might be short-sighted to say that we
cannot fund other programs with Uran funds because they are dedicated to the
ROCK program.
Council Member Reid stated he likes the ROCK program but is concerned that
it could be a good candidate for grant funds and could be redundant with the
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 11
CASA program offered by Loudoun County. Further, he stated we have never
checked the immigration status of participants in this program.
Mayor Umstattd stated she doubts that Council Member Reid has spent
anytime with the children in the ROCK program if he is making those claims.
Council Member Reid stated he was told that 60 percent of the children in the
ROCK program were foreign born and that he has attended ROCK programs.
Council Member Dunn asked that staff provide information regarding the
makeup of the children in the ROCK program as part of their evaluation of the
funding. He disclosed that he has a special needs son; however, he has no
intention of his son using this playground.
Ms. Irby stated it is not appropriate for Council to inquire as to the
immigration status or nationality of any child either in the ROCK or ARC
program. She verified ARC is a SOic3 program.
Council Member Wright stated going into this budget we still have the
advantage of the Uran Funds as we have for many years. He stated in FY2012
Council will have to Zook at other ways of funding the programs currently
receiving Uran Funds and he does not want to start that process in 2011.
Vice Mayor Hammier stated if the playground can be made public it may
change the discussion of how it can be funded.
Ms. Lassiter stated she would be interested in information on the ROCK
program and how ARC can collaborate with them.
Mr. Wells suggested that staff return with further Information in two weeks.
There was further Council discussion of this request and it was the consensus
of Council to consider funding $10,000 tomorrow night and discussing the other
issues in two weeks.
d. Sandwich Board/Signs/Zoning Ordinance Change
Susan Berry-Hill stated sandwich board signs have been prohibited in the
Town since 1983; however, an exception was made for the H-1 District in 1996
and for business special events in 2008. She stated over the years staff has
received questions regarding why the sandwich board signs are not permitted in
the rest of the Town. She stated the Town Attorney has expressed concern that
we need to have similar treatment for businesses both inside and outside of the
Historic District. Further, she stated staff is working to implement an education
program for businesses regarding the Town's sign regulations.
Council Member Dunn expressed concern that 57 percent of our zoning
violations are sign related. He stated perhaps we need to direct staff to back off
on the enforcement given the current economic climate. He stated the second
step is to look at our sign ordinances to create consistency.
Mayor Umstattd stated that does not go far enough. She stated staff follows
the law as we have established it. She stated she does not see the harm of
sandwich boards.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 12
Council Member Dunn stated he was recognizing that it might take time to
review the sign ordinances and that enforcement could be curbed until the
review is complete.
Council Member Reid stated this came before Council four or five years ago he
spoke as a petitioner regarding how prescriptive and detailed the regulations are
regarding the type of signs and materials allowed. He stated he would support
allowing other businesses in Town to use sandwich boards. Further, he asked if
staff is addressing the businesses in the downtown who are not following the
rules regarding sign materials.
Ms. Berry-Hill stated staff will talk to the business owners when they see
signs that are not permitted.
Council Member Reid stated out of the 271 zoning violations 57 percent deal
with signs. He asked what percentage pertained to overcrowded houses.
Ms. Berry-Hill stated staff is currently dealing with 40 active overcrowding
cases. She stated staff will be coming forward soon regarding needed
improvements in enforcement.
Council Member Reid stated we need to be putting our enforcement resources
to other areas. He stated the sign guidelines are too extensive and need to be
less onerous. Further, he suggested the possibility of off-site sandwich boards
for restaurants or businesses on side streets.
Council Member Butler asked Ms. Irby to address her concerns.
Ms. Irby stated her concern is that the signs not block the right-of-way. She
stated we need to be consistent regarding what we regulate.
There was further discussion regarding off-site signs.
Council Member Wright stated he thought this issue had been addressed. He
stated Council Member Reid had raised the concern regarding materials and
stated he is fairly certain that materials other than wood area allowed.
Wade Burkholder stated essentially the regulations do not permit plastic and
are not something that the BAR would normally approve. He stated there are
size regulations and regulations regarding clearance for pedestrian passage.
Council Member Wright stated he would Tike to know the type of sign
violations we have received. He stated it was his understanding that our zoning
enforcement is mainly complaint driven; however, it seems lately someone has
gotten proactive on these issues and perhaps while we look into this issue we
should not pursue these businesses unless a complaint is received.
Mr. Burkholder stated what has happened is staff will receive a complaint
regarding an a-frame sign in a shopping center and in pursuing that complaint
staff cannot ignore other businesses in the same shopping center who are also
violating the regulations because then staff is being selective.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 13
Council Member Wright stated he looks forward to continuing conversations
on how to address certain areas; however, we need to not go so far as to
damage our character as a Town. He commented on the Villages at Leesburg
businesses stating that they have very wide sidewalks and there is no reason
why they should not be allowed to have a-frame signs. Further, stated if it is a
matter of allowing these signs nowhere or everywhere then he would favor
everywhere.
Mayor Umstattd concurred with Council Member Wright's comments stating
Council should initiate a text amendment allowing these signs throughout the
Town.
Council Member Dunn concurred that Council needs to review the sign issues.
Council Member Reid asked Council if the Planning Commission should review
regulations regarding the sign materials.
Mr. Wells stated there are a number of issues regarding signs that need to be
reviewed. He stated the immediate issue is the allowance of a-frame signs
outside the Historic District, He asked that staff be allowed to bring back
language to initiate that ordinance change for just the a-frame signs to include
materials.
e. Downtown Management Group Update
Mr. Wells stated a core group has been following up for the last several
months on the establishment of a new, central downtown management type of
association. He stated for over a decade various associations have worked to
improve the overall operations of downtown businesses. He stated there has
been a thought that a stronger association is needed and based on Council
direction the group has been working to identify roles, legal framework and
funding for such an organization. Further, he stated there is no specific
recommendation at this point; however, there is consensus among the different
members that a group "with teeth is needed" and a report will be provided to
Council in November or December with a more specific recommendation.
Council Member Dunn stated it is time that we look at Leesburg having its
own Chamber of Commerce and that this be a division within the chamber to
look at Leesburg issues. He stated this initiative is great; however, it is
important to be mindful that there are businesses outside the downtown with
issues too.
Mr. Wells stated the issues relating to businesses outside the downtown were
also discussed and while this is referred to as a downtown organization it would
not have exclusive membership of the downtown. He stated there will be a
focus on the downtown, but not an exclusive focus.
Council Member Dunn stated there are a lot of models we can point to in
establishing a Leesburg Chamber of Commerce and from there we can create
various divisions within the chamber. He stated it is not too early to consider a
chamber for the Town of Leesburg.
Council Member Reid thanked the group for their efforts stating it is nice to
see some work between the government and private sector to help the
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 14
downtown. He stated he is looking forward to working with this group as a
downtown business owner. Further, he asked the status of the Loudoun Street
project.
Mr. Weiss stated he and Mr. Burnett will be following-up regarding financial
issues for that project.
Council Member Reid asked if there is a design that allows for a pocket park.
Mr. Wells stated that will come back to Council at a later stage.
Council Member Butler expressed support for this group. He stated while he
would like to help all of the businesses in Leesburg it is Important to have some
focus on the downtown. He stated other areas such as Villages at Leesburg
have proven business models that they are operating under while the downtown
is different and unique and the business model needs some refinement.
Council Member Wright stated as he understands this would be a single entity
to be that support for the downtown that overtime will migrate to a private
entity.
Mr. Wells stated the idea is that this group would have a level of autonomy
but also have potential appointment authority through Council.
Council Member Wright stated in his mind this group would allow us to free up
some economic development resources to not only support the downtown but
the overall picture.
Mr. Wells stated the goal he is working towards is the level of support the
Town would provide would be within the existing resources we have in the
budget so no additional dollars would need to be allocated by Council.
Council Member Wright stated when the ULI study was conducted there was
some discussion about a tourism zone or other tool that would give this
organization to operate as an overlay or HOA with some "teeth" to it.
Mr. Wells stated at the last meeting Liz Whiting was invited to attend to
discuss structure so that something would be encompassing, autonomous,
Inclusionary and has teeth. He stated there are no recommendations at this
time, but the discussion is taking place.
Vice Mayor Hammier stated she agrees with the central point of the ULI study
that we will lose focus if we do not remember we are competing with private
entities such as Villages at Leesburg. She stated the downtown needs to be able
to compete on that level. She stated she is looking forward to the report.
Further, she commented on the need for an incubator downtown as part of the
future vision.
Mayor Umstattd stated there are a number of areas where this group will face
some challenges in getting all of the property owners on the same page to
compete with centrally controlled town centers. She stated the merchants that
come here tend to be independently minded. Further, she stated this is an
interesting idea and if all of the property owners are invested it could work.
Town Council Work Session of October 13, 2009 Page 15
Peter Burnett, Downtown Improvement Association, thanked Council for
bringing this process to where it is. He stated the consensus in the private
community, non-profit community and the government is remarkable. He
stated the group is still evaluating options, but there is a lot of excitement that
came from Council's actions to improve the downtown.
Cheryl Kilday, Loudoun Convention and Visitors Association, stated it is
exciting to hear the positive expressions of Council tonight in moving forward,
f. Street Sweeping Program
Tom Mason stated the current street sweeping program calls for sweeping the
downtown twice a week and other areas once a month; however, that is
dependent on weather. He stated in FY2009 staff collected 1,800 cubic yards of
material, which is over 100 dump truck loads. He stated the street sweeper was
used for 1,300 hours and consumed 300 gallons of fuel. He stated a value of
$80,000 was assigned the report identifying the value of our road maintenance
efforts to VDOT. He stated not only does our program keep the streets clean,
but it is also a best management practice in our MS-4 stormwater program to
keep pollutants out of the streams. Further, he provided information regarding
the street sweeping programs of other communities stating Leesburg is in the
middle range.
Council Member Dunn stated it seems according to the information provided it
seems we are on the higher end of the programs provided by other
communities, He stated he is supportive of saving money and reducing costs.
He suggested reevaluating the frequency of our sweeping and it seems our
streets are pretty clean, Further, he stated it seems to him that the streets in
his neighborhood are swept more than once a month.
Mr. Mason stated this program is based on citizen demand and town
management directive.
Council Member Dunn verified the Town has one sweeper that will need to be
replaced in 2012 based on current usage.
Council Member Reid stated our program is on the upper end. He stated he is
more concerned with the frequency of street sweeping in the neighborhoods. He
stated the County streets are swept twice a year at best and that is where more
debris is entering the streams.
Mr. Mason stated VDOT does not have to maintain an MS-4 permit. He stated
we have a state mandated permit where our street sweeping is one of our
activities that we are required to do to capture pollutants.
Council Member Reid stated during the budget discussions Mr. Mason stated
there were other things the public works staff could do given the time and
resources such as cleaning storm drains.
Mr. Mason stated there is a backlog of storm pond and outfall maintenance.
He stated our Inspection efforts show we are getting further behind and some of
these inspections are mandated by our state permits.
Town Council Work Session of October 13 2009 Page 16
Council Member Reid stated that is where our resources should go. He stated
another program that has to end is unscheduled branch pick up. He stated
branch pick up should be scheduled with residents required to break up the
branches and place them in bags. He stated the curbside leaf pick up should
continue. He stated in this upcoming budget we may be forced to look at
cutting back on some of these things because sweeping streets once a month is
a luxury; though there may be some priority streets that do require that.
Further, he stated we need to focus on storm drain cleaning and require
scheduling for brush pick up.
Council Member Wright expressed concern that if we cut back on the street
sweeping too much all of the debris will enter the drains and increase the storm
drain cleaning workload. He stated he is satisfied with the street sweeping
program as it seems staff has some latitude based on the requirements of the
MS-4 permit and the overall needs of the Town.
Mayor Umstattd concurred with Council Member Wright's comments. She
stated she had not realized how this system operated; however, it seems to
work very well.
Council Member Dunn stated he has looked at the information provided
regarding the street sweeping programs of other communities in more detail and
we are very much at the upper end versus the middle of the range in terms of
frequency. He stated if our justification for the frequency is our MS-4 permit,
then how these other communities rate with their permit requirements. Further,
he suggested the frequency could be reduced to allow these funds to be used for
other efforts and staff to be directed to other priorities.
Ms. Irby stated she would like to have the opportunity to review the MS-4
permit requirements with Mr, Mason and Bill Ackman before any decisions are
made by Council. She stated she does not know which, if any, of the
communities on the list provided fall under the MS-4 permitting requirements.
Mr. Mason stated there were some new regulations approved by the
Stormwater Conservation Board recently that will be finalized in December. He
stated the key is there may be a total maximum dally load effluent limitation for
stormwater going into Tuscarora Creek.
Council Member Dunn stated there should be a valid reason for why we are at
the upper end of all of these communities.
Council Member Reid stated the need to evaluate the effect on storm drains
as he has seen drains in his neighborhood clogged with leaves. He stated this is
abetter use of resources than the unscheduled brush pick up. Further, he
stated the Town would see no savings just by cutting sweeping unless Council
had the gumption to cut staff, which it does not want to do.
Mr. Wells stated the brush pick up program will be discussed on an upcoming
agenda.
There was further Council discussion regarding funding and frequency of
street sweeping.
Town Council Work Session of October 13 2009 Paae 17
Council Member Butler verified the streets in the downtown are swept twice a
week because that is what staff experience has found to be the frequency
needed to keep the downtown clean.
g. Parking Program Follow-up/Holiday Parking
Mr. Wells stated staff is recommending that the holiday parking program
continue this year as it was done last year. He stated the downtown businesses
provided positive feedback on last year's program. He stated staff will provide a
follow-up report on the holiday parking and the overall holiday activities in the
new year.
Mr. Wells stated at the downtown summit there was a desire to have a
discussion of the overall parking program this evening. He stated in the short
term staff is following upon improved directional signage both outside and
inside the parking garage. He stated staff is currently interviewing design firms
to help us to improve on our overall signage effort. Further, he provided
information regarding parking revenue by meter and the locations of the parking
meters.
It was the consensus of Council to move forward with the holiday parking
program.
Council Member Dunn stated he had brought forward the Idea of relocating
some of the parking meters to make them more profitable, He stated it seems
the block on Harrison Street are often unused. He stated there are a number of
streets near the court house were meters could generate more revenue.
Mr. Wells stated there was discussion in the past regarding the Harrison
Street meters; however, it was decided to keep the meters there as they would
become profitable once the Mitchell and Best property was developed, which
didn't happen.
There was discussion regarding the possibility of relocating meters to streets
near the courthouse and providing a permit to the residents to park there free.
Council Member Dunn stated there was some discussion regarding
opportunities for adding parking spaces or removing them and asked the status
of that review.
Mr. Wells stated he would have to follow up at a later time with that
information.
Council Member Reid stated he had a plan to add more street based parking,
in areas where church goers can park on Sundays. He stated he would like to
add this parking during the holiday period on weekends and holidays.
Mr. Wells stated he will follow up with staff; however, there is concern with
implementing this during the winter months if there are measurement issues
because of the potential need for snow plowing.
Council Member Reid asked for staff to follow up on this request.
Town Council Work Session of October 13 2009 Page 18
2. Additions to Future Council Meetings
a. Electoral Board Discussion
Jeanette Irby stated this discussion was initiated by a letter from the Electoral
Board Secretary Dianna Price regarding some budget cuts at the state level and
costs that will be deferred to the Town to keep it's elections in May. She stated
Ms. Price stated she will not have the final cost until after the November
elections. She stated if Council wishes to move the elections to November, the
Town must receive preclearance from the Justice Department which requires 90
days. She stated Ms. Price indicated she would prefer to wait on this move until
after the redistricting is over. Further, she stated if Council would like to pursue
this change for the upcoming election a vote would be required tomorrow night
authorizing a public hearing to occur on October 27.
Council Member Reid verified the change is permanent and cannot be moved
back.
Council Member Wright stated we are already paying election costs and asked
what the additional cost would be. He stated it is not a good idea to do this in a
"fire drill" and insert a lot of confusion. He stated we should talk about this,
plan for it and look at it for a future period.
Ms. Irby stated the redistricting will occur as a result of the 2010 census and
could create confusion for voters who's polling districts may change. She stated
there are also logistical items to work out such as software, ballots and training
the electoral staff. Further, she stated Town residents would receive an
additional separate ballot.
Council Member Wright stressed the need to talk about this change on a
broader scale and to consider it for an off year versus a year with an election
pending. He expressed concern that there would be minimal returns associated
with a move that could create so much confusion if Leesburg's election were to
move to November while all other Loudoun towns keep their elections in May.
Council Member Reid stated it is not the money; rather it is the potential for a
greater turnout. He stated redistricting will not affect us as Council is elected at
large. Further, he stated this provides the potential for getting more people
interested in the Town elections.
Mayor Umstattd asked if Council would want to wait until after redistricting or
to move forward tomorrow night,
Council Member Reid stated he would support moving forward tomorrow
night.
Council Member Dunn stated he would want the elections moved to
November; however, he would want the year of the elections kept the same. He
stated the turnout at the last Town election was around 1,900 people while the
last November election was between 5,000 and 7,000. He stated the
redistricting is a non-issue and the impact will be the same whether we make
this change either now or later. He stated the cost will be reduced, but even if it
were higher it would be worth It to get more citizens involved. Further, he
Town Council Work Session of October 13 2009 Page 19
recommended that Council make every effort to get this done by the January 1
deadline and if it is not done then we default to the May election anyway.
Council Member Wright stated he supports any way to increase participation
in the municipal election; however, if we move to a November election the Town
voters will receive two ballots. He expressed concern that while there may be
higher voter turnout, there still may not be greater participation in the Town
election because of the requirement to complete a separate ballot.
Council Member Reid suggesting moving forward with the public hearing to
receive public input.
Council Member Butler stated perhaps the turnout was low at the last election
because there were four candidates for three spots. He stated he is willing to go
along with the public hearing; however, he does have some concerns about
moving the election.
There was further Council discussion regarding the length of the campaign
season.
Ms. Irby expressed concern that there is no margin for the possibility of
corrections or additional Information that may be requested by the Justice
Department as they will not have to respond until December 31 and the
Electoral Board has to have everything ready for the May election candidates by
January 1.
Council Member Wright stated when the Town of Blacksburg moved their
elections to November they also moved to odd numbered years, possibly to be
separated from the federal elections.
Vice Mayor Hammier stated she would like information regarding Blacksburg's
process for moving their elections to November.
It was the consensus of Council to consider a vote authorizing the public
hearing advertisement tomorrow night for a change to November elections in
even numbered years.
Council Member Dunn recommended that the transition for the new Council
be the second Tuesday of December.
b. Tuesday night agenda
Council Member Reid asked that the VDOT resolution be removed from the
consent agenda for tomorrow night because he would like to bring forward an
amendment that a median break be installed at Linden Hill Drive.
Vice Mayor Hammier suggested the vote be delayed until the next
meeting.
c. Other Items for discussion
Council Member Dunn questioned why the work session and regular meetings
are moved to Tuesday and Wednesday respectively when there is a holiday.
Town Council Work Session of October 13 2009 Page 20
Mayor Umstattd stated Council votes to approve the meeting schedule every
year and these changes are included.
Council Member Dunn stated the Council by-laws state that Council meets the
second Tuesday of every month and therefore Council does not have to hold a
work sessions every month. He suggested when a holiday conflicts with a work
session that the work session be cancelled and that the Regular meeting be kept
on Tuesday.
Council Member Reid stated he would like a memo from staff regarding why
we cannot sell water to Raspberry Falis. Further, he asked the status of the
proposal by a cell phone company to rent space on our water towers.
Vice Mayor Hammier stated she continues to receive emails regarding
possible overcrowding issues that are not being resolved. She stated she would
like to have a discussion regarding this during a regular meeting.
Ms. Irby stated there is a memo going out tomorrow morning regarding this
issue.
Vice Mayor Hammier asked that it be brought up during a regular session
meeting in public.
Mr. Wells stated there is a bid opening on the agenda tomorrow night for the
rental of water tower space by cell phone companies.
4. Adjournment
On a motion by Council Member Wright seconded by Council Member Butler
the meeting was adjourned at 11:31 p.m.
Clerk of Co Rijn jl
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