HomeMy Public PortalAbout05-13-21 Agenda Regular Meeting101 E. Orange St., PO Box 429, Hillsborough, NC 27278
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Mayor’s Task Force Agenda | 1 of 9
Agenda
Mayor’s Task Force on Re-imagining Public Safety
Remote regular meeting
7 p.m. May 13, 2021
Virtual meeting via YouTube Live
Town of Hillsborough YouTube channel
Due to current public health concerns, this meeting will be conduct remotely using Zoom. Public comment
instructions are available on the final page of this agenda.
1.Roll call
2.Audience comments not related to the printed agenda
3.Welcome
4.Items for decision
Minutes from meeting April 8, 2021
5.Presentations
Use of force policy and training in the Hillsborough Police Department
6.Items for discussion
A.Discussion and questions from the task force related to use of force
B.Community Police/Public Safety Advisory Board Models
C.Outline and plan for the remaining and additional task force meetings
7.Next meeting date
June 10, 2021
8.Adjournment
Compliance with the American with Disabilities Act interpreter services and/or special sound equipment is
available on request. If you are disabled and need assistance with reasonable accommodations, call the Town
Clerk’s Office at 919-296-9443 a minimum of one business day in advance of the meeting.
Public Comment Instructions
For agenda items and items not on the agenda
Public Comment ― Written
Members of the public may provide written public comment by submitting it via the police management analyst
contact form by noon the day of the meeting.
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When submitting the comment, include the following:
• Date of the meeting
• Agenda item you wish to comment on (Example: 5.C)
• Your name, address, email and phone number
Public Comment ― Verbal
Members of the public can indicate they wish to speak during the meeting by contacting the police management
analyst through the analyst’s contact form by noon the day of the meeting.
When submitting the request to speak, include the following:
• Date of the meeting
• Agenda item you wish to speak on (Example: 5.C)
• Your name, address, email and phone number (The phone number must be the number you plan to call in
from if participating by phone.)
Prior to the meeting, speakers will be emailed a Zoom participant link to be able to make comments during the
live meeting. Speakers may use a computer (with camera and/or microphone) or phone to make comments.
Speakers using a phone for comments must use the provided PIN/password number.
The public speaker’s audio and video will be muted until the task force gets to the respective agenda item.
Individuals who have pre-registered will then be brought into the public portion of the meeting one at a time.
For concerns prior to the meeting related to speaking, contact the police management analyst at 919-296-9540 or
through the contact form.
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Minutes
Mayor’s Task Force on Re-imagining Public Safety
Remote regular meeting
7 p.m. April 8, 2021
Virtual meeting via YouTube Live
Town of Hillsborough YouTube channel
Present: Mayor Jenn Weaver, Sujata Bijou, Keith Cook, Patricia Harrison, Chloe Johnson, Rod Jones, Jason
Knapp, Hathaway Pendergrass, David “Hooper” Schultz, Marc Xavier, and Allison Zirkel
Absent: Judit Alvarado, Shannon Blue, Tracey Little
Staff: Police Chief Duane Hampton, Police Management Analyst Eli Valsing
1. Roll call
Mayor Jenn Weaver called the meeting to order at 7:03 p.m. Police Management Analyst Eli Valsing called the
roll and confirmed the presence of a quorum.
2. There were no audience comments not related to the printed agenda
3. Welcome
4. Items for decision
A. Minutes from meeting March 11, 2021
Motion: Hathaway Pendergrass moved approval of the March 11,+ 2021, minutes as submitted. Chloe
Johnson seconded.
Valsing called the roll for voting.
Vote: 10-0. Ayes: 10. Nays: 0.
5. Items for discussion
A. Dr. Baumgartner’s March 11 traffic stop presentation and HPD traffic stops report
1. Dr. Baumgartner’s March 11 traffic stop presentation
Mayor Jenn Weaver introduced this discussion by mentioning the highest frequency of citizen interaction with
police is through traffic stops, making it a topic worth discussing, and that the racial differences and
disparities that are evident in traffic stop data are important to review. Weaver highlighted Dr. Baumgartner’s
main questions, to consider the difference between traffic safety stops and traffic investigatory stops and to
ask are the desirable results of investigatory stops? Are we gaining anything from them and if so, what is it we
are gaining? In addition, why are we seeing the racial disparities across these traffic stops? Weaver then
opened the conversation to the task force.
Jason Knapp mentioned Baumgartner’s comment that the level of privacy in cars is more like standing on the
street and not like being in your own home. He wondered if this privacy assumption leads to unlawful or
unreasonable searches and if we can do anything about that in our own community? Weaver suggests this
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privacy concern is related to Baumgartner’s suggestion that polices officers can easily justify traffic stops
because everyone is breaking the law somehow when they are driving.
Allison Zirkel said if only 10% of searches lead to arrests and those searches cause emotional stress for the
citizen who is pulled over, especially for people of color, is the benefit worth the stress? Weaver said negative
feelings and emotions are experienced by the person being stopped and related community alienation can
result, even when there is no actionable offense.
Sujata Bijou shared a personal story about her husband. He is black, he works for the military with top secret
clearance and while driving to work was pulled over and told he was speeding. Due to the location, the charge
was a criminal offense. He was using speed control and knew he wasn’t speeding, and so was able to
successfully contest the charges, but if he had not been successful, he could have lost his job. So, there are
consequences that might not be considered.
Rod Jones shared a story related the initial reason for a traffic stop leading to another line of inquiry. He was
pulled over because his license plate light was out and the officers noticed tools in his back seat, which they
questioned him about. They wanted to know why he had them, where he was coming from, and where he
was going because they could be used for breaking and entering. His resulting question is: At what point does
the good cop “line” get crossed? At what point is asking questions that are not related to what you are pulled
over not ok?
Weaver asked Jones how it felt to be in that interaction? Jones replied he always tries to have a positive
interaction when he is pulled over. He turns on his interior light, puts both hands on the top of the steering
wheel, and ask if it’s ok before reaching for something or moving. He tries to put the officer at ease. Jones
replied that at the time of this stop he was younger and less aware. He didn’t feel the questions were because
of who he was, rather than because of what he was doing. He was less aware of how these questions might
not be asked of a white man. He had illuminated the car and so he felt they might be fair questions.
Keith Cook commented, and due to difficulty with his microphone Weaver provided a recap, which Cook
confirmed was correct. Cook said he believes that police officers should be observant and thorough.
Chloe Johnson highlighted Baumgartner’s findings that the greatest disparities for black men were found in
the discretionary searches, and if only 10% are leading to arrests she wonders what benefit we’re getting out
of this type of policing? Johnson sees this as the primary question the task force is trying to answer and stated
when the searches are unnecessary it interferes with our perceived right to privacy. The data is helpful but
also leaves us with many questions and the answers are elusive.
Weaver reiterated Knapp’s earlier comment about privacy on the street versus privacy in your car and
suggested it is unlikely people who are stopped on the street as pedestrian would be questioned extensively.
If that was the case it would cause alarm, but in a car, it is more accepted.
Cook said officers should have a reason for stopping a car and be able to quickly identify the reason they are
making the stop. He asked Chief Hampton how we make sure officers can quickly state the reason for the
stop.
Chief Hampton said traffic stops are random for the most part because they are responsive to changing
situations and applying a methodology is difficult. The two main categories are random violations noticed by
an officer or targeted enforcement due to a complaint at a particular location, such as a drug house. A car
driving away from a location would need to be in violation of something to be pulled over. Hampton disputed
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Baumgartner’s assertion that everybody driving is in violation. Pulling someone over for 2 miles under or over
the speed limit is not something that happens, because the court system expects to see a reasonable reason
for pulling someone over.
Marc Xavier joined the meeting at 7:30 p.m. Xavier said Baumgartner’s had mentioned data he did not have
specifically for Hillsborough, but that the data is similar across most communities. Xavier would like to see this
specific data for Hillsborough. Weaver suggested reaching out to Baumgartner with follow up questions and if
he does provide more information to please share it with the task force.
Judge Hathaway Pendergrass commented on the issue of privacy in an automobile. Drivers are not typically
aware of there is less privacy protection in an automobile. In many cases the Supreme Court has confirmed
you are provided less privacy protection as soon as you get in a car because it is regulated by the rules of the
road. First year law students learn this, but otherwise an average driver is not likely to know about this law.
2. HPD Traffic stops report
Weaver shared a couple of highlights from the report: 1. African Americans are more likely to be searched and
more likely to be arrested in Hillsborough. 2. The disproportionality for African Americans in traffic stop
arrests mirrors all arrests. 3. Arrests from traffic stops is small percentage and mostly result from regulatory
or equipment violations. So, this data is in line with Baumgartner’s presentation.
Weaver also highlighted that driving with a revoked license (DWLR) charges disproportionally affect African
Americans. Weaver asked Judge Pendergrass if he sees this same disproportion the courts.
Pendergrass said the current law was revised around 10 years ago. DWLR while impaired is a class one
misdemeanor and can result in up to 120 days in jail. Most cases are DWLR not impaired, a class 3
misdemeanor, because of failure to pay court costs, fines, or failure to show up to court. In Orange County the
Criminal Justice Resource Department has a staff member, Emma Ferriola-Bruckenstein, who is specifically
assigned to help resolve the fines on people’s records in these kinds of cases. The court costs and fines from
various counties can be quite complicated. Not many counties have this resource. Zirkel confirmed this
resource (Ferrioloa-Bruckenstein) provides free legal services for these cases.
Hampton asked Pendergrass if students who are flunking out of school can have their license suspended.
Although Pendergrass has not seen this in his time on the bench, according to a March 17, 2021 WRAL article
shared in the chat box, this is still the law in North Carolina. https://www.wral.com/bad-grades-are-costing-
some-nc-teens-their-driver-s-licenses/19580852/
Weaver asked Zirkel and Pendergrass if they are aware of the funds Chapel Hill and/or Carrboro have
established to help residents pay for court costs. Zirkel responded that her understanding is the Town of
Chapel Hill manages this program and the funds are donations. Pendergrass adds that a town committee
receives the applications for these court cost funds.
Weaver reviewed the graphs in the report, sharing them on the screen, and asking individuals to comment
and ask questions as we go through.
Hampton said the data trends in Hillsborough is seen in other jurisdictions throughout the state and
throughout different government systems.
Weaver said the data shows equipment and regulatory stops are the most frequent initial reason for stop.
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Xavier asked if older, poorly maintained vehicles are more likely to be stopped. Hampton confirmed that new
and recently inspected cars are more likely to have everything working. Hampton also said it is not likely a car
will be targeted based on age when it’s dark. Window tint violations are more likely during the day and vehicle
light issues are more likely at night. Some reasons for higher numbers of regulatory and equipment violations
are they are more difficult for drivers to question and easier for officers to identify.
Hampton said the time of day aspect of traffic stops needs more research. If the driving population is different
at night, then the higher vehicle light violations at night would correlate with driver demographics. A primary
reason for officers to make stops at night is to try to find DWI offenders, who are more likely to be on the
road between 10 p.m. and 1 a.m.
Weaver asked if DWI offenders are found because of equipment violations? Hampton said that is not a
definitive cause and that erratic driving is a better indicator. However, in Hillsborough, due to the high
number of stop lights, it can be difficult to identify them due to erratic driving.
In reference to Chart 7, Traffic stop enforcement as percentage of 2019 traffic stops, Hampton said the HPD
focuses on education and counseling for enforcement, which is likely why we see more written and verbal
warnings than citations and arrests in this chart.
Hampton suggested another reason for more regulatory or equipment violations. If a driver is stopped for
speeding and has multiple violations, a non-moving violation won’t have the same impact on their record as a
moving violation. So, not charging for the moving violation can be a kinder way for an officer to cite a driver.
This is an anecdotal, not data driven observation, and it would be time consuming to gather this data.
Weaver reviews Chart 11, Hillsborough most common reasons for traffic stops resulting in citations & arrests,
2019. Again, a higher incidence of equipment and regulatory violations is the reason for stops resulting in
citations and arrests. Hampton said the resulting charge of the citation or arrest is not necessarily the same as
the reason for the stop. Also, it is unlikely for a custodial arrest to be the result of a regulatory or equipment
violation, although 20 years ago it was more common to see custodial arrests resulting from driving while
license revoked.
Johnson said that since the resulting arrests are for other reasons, the traffic stops may be uncovering
criminal charges we want to find. Hampton said the higher incidence of citations and arrests from equipment
and regulatory stops could be due to the higher volume of these stops. Hooper Schultz said DWI is a resulting
charge we want to catch, as mentioned previously. Hampton agreed and suggested we look at the most likely
charges in Chart 13, Hillsborough traffic stop arrest charges (top 10) by initial reason for stop (top 5), 2019.
Weaver reviewed Chart 12. Hillsborough arrest demographics, 2019, which shows that the demographics of
arrests resulting from traffic stops mirror the demographics of all arrests in Hillsborough in 2019.
Chart 13 shows the charges that came out of the vehicle equipment stops, which include warrants, drug
charges, alcohol related charges, DWLR, and resist, delay obstruct. Weaver suggested this chart is useful when
considering the question, what do we want to achieve from traffic stops? She compared the dangerous
situation a DWI charge will address vs. the less dangerous situation a drug paraphernalia charge addresses
and asked what goal do we have from traffic stops?
Weaver read aloud the five items included in the Going Forward section of the HPD Traffic Stop Report on
pages 14 and 15 and asked for task force members to offer feedback on these points. In addition, what are
the main points or questions the task force should think about related to traffic stops and potential
recommendations the group might make?
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Bijou asked about the implicit bias training and Baumgartner’s comment that he finds bias to be so
widespread that it is difficult to see differences between people who have had the training and those who
have not. Johnson mentioned that her personal experience with implicit bias training is they are useful, but in
addition to Baumgartner, she has read about other police research, such as Alex Vitale, that doesn’t have
much faith in this kind of training. Her view is that they are helpful but not a solution to the problem.
Zirkel mentioned the relationship between equipment and regulatory violations and people living in poverty.
She offered the example of funds the housing office has started providing for people to use towards
transportation, including repairing vehicles. What about providing funding for people who are consistently
pulled over for equipment and regulatory violations because they are struggling financially?
Hampton mentioned he can document at least a dozen instances when officers fix someone’s car after they
have been pulled over, and that many equipment and regulatory stops do not result in a bad, or negative,
situations.
Xavier recommended communicating with the community, a reminder about fixing vehicles. Use the data to
help communicate how important it is to keep your vehicle in good repair and the issues that come up
because of not doing so. How can we help contribute to safety through the messages we share?
Weaver suggested that in addition to helping prevent the equipment and regulatory violations, we also need
to focus on the racial disparity seen in the searches and arrests and the recommendations we might make
regarding that. What should be tried differently?
Johnson said it would be good to see what happens to cases as they go through the judicial system. Data
related to the types of drug charges resulting from equipment and regulatory violations would also be useful.
What charges are associated with the outstanding warrants? How many of them are for “technical
violations”? This kind of data would help inform how efficient these types of traffic stops are in relation to the
ultimate charges.
Weaver said the time needed to gather data needs to be balanced against whether anything is learned
because of that effort, and if what is learned can be acted upon.
Pendergrass asked if Hillsborough does regulatory checkpoints. Hampton said HPD assists the highway patrol
occasionally, but not anything that’s initiated by the department. We occasionally initiate DWI check points.
Hampton looked up the department checkpoint data and saw the frequency tapered off in 2018. HPD doesn’t
have the capacity to run a checkpoint and continue to cover regular duties.
B. What is next for the task force: A review of what we’ve accomplished, what is left to do, and what
information is needed.
Weaver summarized the progress so far, with a review of each meeting. She reminded everyone the original
commitment was 4 – 6 meetings, and we need to finish up in the next two months to hold to that schedule.
Are members interested and able to extend this process to at least 8 meetings?
A couple of must-dos for the task force are to assess policing and racial disparity in Hillsborough and make
recommendations to the board and town manger related to this assessment. In addition, a recommendation
as to what type of police advisory board would be appropriate for Hillsborough and what it’s purpose might
be is expected.
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Additional questions posed by Weaver are: What other types of information and assessment are still needed?
Do we want do tackle these questions in this task force or recommend they be addressed by an advisory
board? Do we want to dedicate a meeting to the HPD’s use of force policy? Or would a use of force report
from Chief Hampton suffice?
Bijou suggested a discussion of recommendations could begin and based on that discussion identify other
questions that need answering.
Patricia Harrison said everyone should have a good understanding of use of force. Her experience working in
law enforcement for 20 years was that use of force is reviewed annually. Including a use of force discussion in
this group would ensure everyone has a basic understanding when making recommendations.
Knapp suggested beginning to explore recommendations makes sense, but to not to rush the process. Knapp
said he is willing to commit more time to the task force and feels it is important to take the time to get the
information needed.
Schultz would like to know more about what neighboring jurisdictions are doing so we could potentially take
advantage of what others have recommended or decisions they may have made.
Xavier suggested the task force is just at the beginning of this process.
Cook mentioned that a couple of years ago a Hispanic community was complaining, with the support of
Justice United, that they were targeted by law enforcement in traffic stops. The main reason Cook mentioned
this specific instance is to make sure task force members are aware that this kind of thing is going on. HPD
communicated with Devon Ross, the leader of Justice United, at the time and reminded everyone this did not
take place in the HPD’s jurisdiction. Weaver said, that although we need to consider our larger community,
the task force can only make recommendations for things that happen in the HPD’s jurisdiction.
Johnson supported expanding to additional meetings and does not want to make recommendations just for
the sake of doing so. She would like to see recommendations be specific to things we see might change
because of the recommendations.
Bijou clarified her point of view by saying that finding a way to organize and summarize the information we
have already received before adding on more information would be valuable. She agreed we should not rush
the process.
Weaver reviewed Marc Xavier’s questions sent by email regarding economic and other equity issues that are
relevant to the criminal justice system. Weaver’s initial response this group should remain focused on our
specific charge. She can get answers to the questions so that the group will have the information. Also, some
of these questions might be better addressed by the Orange County Racial Equity Plan that is in the initial
phases of development.
Weaver will sketch out a plan for the next several meetings and will send out this plan to the group. In
addition, she will give individuals the opportunity to share their ability to continue, or not.
6. Next meeting date
May 13, 2021.
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7. Adjournment
Weaver adjourned the meeting at 9:03 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Eli Valsing
Police Management Analyst
Staff support to the Mayor’s Task Force on Re-imagining Public Safety
Approved: Month X, 202X