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HomeMy Public PortalAboutExhibit MSD 113 - Transcript of May 13, 2015 Public Hearing PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 1 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 METROPOLITAN ST. LOUIS SEWER DISTRICT 9 PUBLIC HEARING 10 MAY 13, 2015 11 12 NORMANDY CITY HALL 13 7700 NATURAL BRIDGE ROAD 14 ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI 15 16 17 (Hearing start time, 6:10 p.m.) 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 2 1 I N D E X 2 PAGE 3 Introduction by Mr. Schoedel 5 4 Presentation by Mr. Hoelscher 9 5 Public Hearing Session 6 Ralph Roberts 35 7 Herman Nebel 36 8 Conclusion 36 9 10 11 12 (No exhibits marked.) 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 3 1 PUBLIC HEARING FOR THE METROPOLITAN ST. LOUIS 2 SEWER DISTRICT, produced and examined on May 13, 3 2015, between the hours of 6:10 in the evening and 4 6:49 in the evening of that day, at the Normandy 5 City Hall, 7700 Natural Bridge Road, St. Louis, 6 Missouri, before Suzanne M. Zes, a Certified Court 7 Reporter of the State of Missouri. 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 4 1 A P P E A R A N C E S 2 For the MSD Rate Commission: 3 Mark Schoedel Lutheran Senior Services 4 George Tomazi 5 The Engineers' Club of St. Louis 6 7 8 9 10 Also Present: 11 Brian Hoelscher Executive Director 12 Lance LeComb 13 Manager of Public Information & Spokesperson 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 The Court Reporter: 23 Suzanne Zes MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES 24 711 North Eleventh Street St. Louis, MO 63101 25 314.644.2191 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 5 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 MR. SCHOEDEL: Good evening, my name is 3 Mark Schoedel, a member of the Metropolitan St. 4 Louis Sewer District and I will be presiding over 5 the Public Hearing this evening. 6 With me to my right is a fellow MSD Rate 7 Commission member, Mr. George Tomazi. 8 The Charter Plan of the District was amended 9 at a general election on November 7th, 2000, and 10 established the Rate Commission to review and make 11 recommendations to the District regarding changes in 12 wastewater rates, stormwater rates and tax rates 13 proposed by the District. 14 The Charter Plan requires the MSD Board of 15 Trustees to select organizations to ensure a fair 16 representation of all users of the District's 17 services on the Rate Commission. The Rate 18 Commission representative organizations are to 19 represent commercial-industrial users, residential 20 users and other organizations interested in the 21 operation of the District, including organizations 22 focusing on environmental issues, labor issues, 23 socio-economic issues, community-neighborhood 24 organizations and other non-profit organizations. 25 The MSD Rate Commission currently consists of 15 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 6 1 members from organizations and institutions 2 throughout St. Louis City and County. 3 On February 26, 2015, the Rate Commission 4 received a Rate Change Notice proposing changes to 5 the District's wastewater rates and stormwater 6 revenues. The Rate Commission adopted Operational 7 Rules and a Procedural Schedule to govern the 8 proceedings on March 4, 2015. 9 Under the current Procedural Schedule adopted 10 by the Rate Commission, the MSD Rate Commission has 11 until June 26, 2015 to review and make a 12 recommendation to the MSD Board of Trustees as to 13 whether the proposed rates should be approved, not 14 approved, or modified with suggested changes and 15 then approved. The Commission has, however, 16 requested an extension from the MSD Board of 17 Trustees until August 10, 2015, which has not yet 18 been acted upon. 19 The MSD Rate Commission has engaged legal 20 counsel and a rate consultant independent of those 21 used by the MSD staff. 22 Under procedural rules adopted by the Rate 23 Commission, as amended, any person affected by the 24 Rate Change Proposal had an opportunity to submit an 25 application to intervene in these proceedings. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 7 1 Applications to intervene have been filed by the 2 Home Builders Association of St. Louis and Missouri 3 Industrial Energy Consumers. These applications 4 have been granted. 5 Since February 26, 2015, the MSD Rate 6 Commission has received testimony from MSD staff. 7 The parties have also engaged in discovery requests. 8 Additional testimony from the Intervenors and the 9 Rate Consultant will be filed. 10 A Prehearing Conference for the purpose of 11 identifying any issues raised by the Rate Setting 12 Documents and the prepared testimony previously 13 submitted will be conducted on the record. All 14 persons submitting testimony may participate in the 15 Prehearing Conference and each participant in the 16 Prehearing Conference shall submit a Prehearing 17 Conference Report describing the issues raised by 18 the Rate Setting Documents and the prepared 19 testimony, together with a brief description of such 20 participant's position, if any, on each issue and 21 the rationale therefore. 22 Ratepayers who do not wish to intervene are 23 permitted to participate in these on-the-record 24 public hearings conducted in nine sessions beginning 25 on May 11, 2015, and concluding on June 9, 2015. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 8 1 The Rate Commission published a Public Notice 2 regarding these proceedings in the St. Louis 3 Post-Dispatch and in the St. Louis American. These 4 Notices contained the time, dates, and location of 5 each of the conferences and hearings. 6 The Public Hearing session tonight is for the 7 purpose of permitting the District to present its 8 Wastewater and Stormwater Rate Change Proposal and 9 to permit any ratepayer an opportunity to comment. 10 We will begin with a presentation by the District 11 followed by a public comment period. Those wishing 12 to speak should sign in on the sheet provided and 13 will be called on in the order of the names listed 14 thereon. Each ratepayer should identify themselves 15 and any organizations represented by such ratepayer. 16 Several housekeeping rules before we begin 17 are: 18 If you wish to present testimony please sign 19 in on the clipboard which is located at the table 20 here next by the entry door. Speakers will be 21 recognized in the order in which they sign up. 22 Each ratepayer may have a maximum of ten 23 minutes to speak regarding the proposed rate change. 24 As the presiding officer, I can limit or expand the 25 time, should I deem it necessary. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 9 1 Restrooms, if needed, are located down the 2 hallway here to my left, to your right. 3 Are there any questions regarding the 4 procedure this evening? Is the District ready to 5 proceed? If so, please step forward. 6 MR. HOELSCHER: Thank you. My name is 7 Brian Hoelscher. I am the executive director of the 8 St. Louis Metropolitan Sewer District. What we're 9 going to show you tonight is a proposal that was 10 submitted to the District's Rate Commission. This 11 will be an overview of that Rate Proposal. The 12 actual Rate Proposal, itself, is located both on our 13 website and we do have some copies out here today if 14 you wish to look at them. Again, this is just an 15 overview. 16 As was stated before, at the end of my 17 presentation the Rate Commission will open up the 18 floor for any comments that those in attendance 19 have. After the entire proceedings are over and the 20 Rate Commission closes the meeting, we do have 21 District staff here if you have questions or 22 comments for MSD regarding something other than the 23 Rate Commission process. 24 As an introduction to what I'm going to be 25 presenting there are two things driving the PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 10 1 proposal. First, we will discuss a change in 2 wastewater rates. The work being done is being 3 driven by a Consent Decree or a court-approved 4 document that resulted from MSD being sued by the 5 Department of Justice and the EPA. That's what 6 drives the wastewater rates and the projects to have 7 to be done. 8 On the stormwater side you will see that MSD 9 is looking to address an issue specific to our area. 10 Half of our public storm sewer system has a revenue 11 source that allows operation and maintenance. The 12 other half does not. We are looking to correct that 13 situation with a District-wide property tax to 14 provide proper funding. 15 First, MSD is two utilities, two separate 16 sources of revenues and provides two services. 17 First, we're a wastewater utility. We collect 18 wastewater from sinks, toilets, floor drains, 19 showers, washing machines that travels through 20 pipes, goes to our treatment plants, we treat that 21 in accordance with our state and federal permits and 22 then we discharge those flows to either the 23 Missouri, Mississippi, or Meramec River. 24 The cost for those services are on your 25 monthly wastewater bill that you receive from MSD. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 11 1 Those are the revenues that go to that type of work, 2 that service. 3 Second, MSD is also a stormwater utility. 4 Any water that hits the ground that doesn't drain 5 directly to a creek or stream or doesn't soak in the 6 ground can be captured by our inlets, manholes, 7 storm sewers and concrete channels. We will then 8 convey that stormwater to another local creek or 9 stream for eventually discharge to the Mississippi 10 River. 11 We are also required to address the 12 pollutants that are in stormwater runoff and that 13 impact the water quality of the local creeks and 14 streams in the area. Stormwater is funded by a 15 small, flat fee that's in your monthly wastewater 16 bill but mostly stormwater is funded by a property 17 tax that is on your annual property tax bill. Those 18 are the revenues that primarily fund our stormwater 19 service. 20 Some things with the Rate Commission. You've 21 heard some of this. It was established in 2000 to 22 provide input on how MSD sets its rates. There are 23 15 organizations across a broad -- across the MSD 24 boundaries that serve on that Commission. Each one 25 of those organizations elect a representative to PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 12 1 represent them at those proceedings. 2 We will all propose changes under the Charter 3 to find parameters. They will take the rate -- the 4 proposal submitted by MSD staff. They will look at 5 it, recommend as it is or recommend changes. Those 6 recommendations will go to our Board of Trustees who 7 will go through the same process of reviewing the 8 Rate Commission's recommendations and then issue a 9 final ruling on how we should proceed. 10 The proposal you're looking at is for the 11 rates necessary between July 1, 2016 and June 30th, 12 2020. That's the period of the Rate Proposal. 13 First, I want to talk about wastewater, talk 14 about the current rates that are currently in place 15 under the funding that's previously approved for the 16 period of 2013 through 2016. MSD identified 17 $971 million worth of capital work that needed to be 18 started within that four-year period. MSD is 19 anticipating that it will appropriate $890 million 20 of that work. 21 All the work that needed to get done was done 22 and we are also within budget. So coming under 23 budget left some extra dollars available, a lot of 24 it having to do with many of the good prices we got 25 on the construction work we did. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 13 1 Any remaining monies not spent by MSD on 2 capital improvement work during this four-year 3 period are then available to pay for capital work in 4 the next four-year period and will result in a 5 slight decrease in the rates needed in order to do 6 that work. 7 On operation and maintenance, story is the 8 same. We're on time and under budget. We 9 anticipated -- we requested revenues of $716 million 10 during this current four-year period. We're 11 anticipating we'll spend a total of $700 million in 12 the four years ending June 30th, 2016 to perform 13 that work. 14 Some of the things you've seen that were 15 accomplished with the operation and maintenance 16 dollars, besides the operations of our treatment 17 plants and pump stations, we inspected 62,000 18 manholes, rehabilitated 6600 manholes, inspected 19 1900 miles of sewers and, probably more importantly, 20 based on two similar rains that occurred in the 21 northern part of our District at different times 22 we're anticipating we've reduced by 66 percent the 23 number of basement backups and the amount of 24 overflows that are coming out of the system since we 25 started this program. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 14 1 What MSD is proposing to do for the four-year 2 period starting July 1, 2016, it's the execution of 3 what we call Project Clear. There's three drivers 4 of Project Clear. One is get the rain out. The 5 main issue MSD is addressing in the Consent Decree 6 on the wastewater side is the pipes get too full and 7 they overflow, whether it's onto the ground or 8 whether in the local creeks and streams or into 9 basements. 10 When it is not raining MSD does not have a 11 problem unless grease or something is flushed down 12 the lines or if a line happens to collapse or fail. 13 When it's not raining wastewater goes into the 14 system, goes through the pipes, goes to the plant 15 and gets discharged to the creeks and rivers. 16 When it rains the problem we have is 17 stormwater, either because it's not supposed to get 18 in there or too much is getting in the system, uses 19 up the capacity and causes overflows in the system 20 as well as basement backups. 21 The easiest way to resolve this problem is to 22 get the rain out. The main focus of our program is 23 to stop the stormwater from getting in the system 24 originally or at least slow it down. It's the most 25 cost-effective way to address our issues. It is PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 15 1 approximately four to five times cheaper to do it 2 that way then to actually just build a bigger 3 system. 4 The other part is repair and maintenance. 5 Make sure we're repairing and maintaining the system 6 so it will continue working for many decades to come 7 and, finally, building some system improvements. It 8 will be more cost-effective in a few cases to 9 actually increase the size of the system slightly in 10 order to accommodate the overflows. 11 We're looking to do this in a financially 12 responsible manner, maintain District's financial 13 stabilities. One of the main ways we do this is 14 make sure that anything we propose meets what are 15 currently the parameters we understand that to 16 maintain a AA bond rating for any borrowed money. 17 Right now MSD has a AAA rating from S&P and 18 AA1 and AA plus from Fitch and Moody's. The idea is 19 to try and make sure we stay within the parameters 20 to maintain a AA bond rating so we get very good 21 interest rates whenever we borrow money. 22 The next slide is kind of a rundown of the 23 capital program. Over the next four years we're 24 looking to start $1.5 billion worth of capital work. 25 It's distributed and started within the four years, PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 16 1 as you see up there, totaling $1.5 billion. 2 Also within the proposal is a request for 3 $736 million in operation and maintenance costs and 4 $477 million for debt service. This is to pay off 5 loans that we've either made prior to this period or 6 the loans that we may make, the bonds we may sell 7 during the next four-year period depending on 8 whether or not the voters authorize us additional 9 bonding authority. 10 What will that debt look like? For the next 11 four years we're looking to fund the $1.5 billion 12 worth of capital work. We're going to use 13 $415 million of cash. That's directly using the 14 rates that you pay us on a monthly basis for 15 wastewater. 16 We're also proposing to bond finance 17 $1.1 billion worth of work. In order to do that it 18 will require the voters to decide whether or not 19 they want to authorize us an additional $900 million 20 worth of bonding authority. 21 If they do, that will bring MSD's total debt 22 authorization up to $2.62 billion. Any money 23 borrowed with bonds is spent only on capital 24 projects. None of it is used for the operating 25 budget. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 17 1 Some of the things that will come out of that 2 capital program, there will be about 600 projects 3 that get started -- capital projects that get 4 started. 230 of those will be construction 5 projects. We'll eliminate 39 of the overflows that 6 are in the system. We will also start the design of 7 about 24 miles of underground tunnels. 8 While the goal is to keep the water out to 9 prevent the overflows, in some cases we cannot get 10 there. It's not cost-effective. So in some cases 11 we will build large underground tunnels, which when 12 the system overflows we will store the water in 13 these tunnels and when the storm goes away and the 14 flows go down we will then route those flows that 15 are in the tunnels to the treatment plants so they 16 can be treated before they're discharged into the 17 environment. 18 Where are the projects? Every one of the 19 blue dots you see on this map is a project. And if 20 you're very close to the map you can see that 21 there's a little white number inside each one of 22 those circles. If you went to our Rate Proposal you 23 could see this map and see the spreadsheet. What we 24 do have are some maps up. This map up here is a 25 reproduction of that map with the circles and the PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 18 1 white numbers. 2 Within our Rate Proposal there's a 3 spreadsheet. If you look up that number you will 4 see the problem we're solving, the work we're going 5 to do, the amount it will cost and the year we plan 6 on starting that project. 7 After the meeting, if you're interested, we 8 do have that spreadsheet sitting next to that map, 9 so if there's a particular project you want to look 10 at you can pick that number up, go to the 11 spreadsheet and see exactly what work it is we're 12 planning on doing. 13 As we go through the presentation you will 14 notice there's a reference at the bottom. It says, 15 in this case, "Appendix 7 point" -- it's cut-off a 16 little bit but there's an appendix reference. 17 Whenever you see a reference at the bottom of any of 18 these slides it's referencing an exact page in the 19 Rate Proposal. Again, if you desire, you can go to 20 our website and you can access the entire Rate 21 Proposal we submitted to the Rate Commission. 22 Wastewater operation and maintenance, what 23 we're planning on accomplishing. Again, besides 24 running the wastewater treatment plants and pump 25 stations throughout our area, inspect 60,000 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 19 1 manholes, rehabilitate 6,000 manholes, inspect with 2 closed-circuit TV, these are cameras we run down the 3 sewers, 1600 miles of sewers, clean 3800 miles of 4 sewers and rehabilitate 360 miles of sewers. 5 Our ratepayers will be offered options to pay 6 for this work. The first one, if you see on the 7 left, is Option A. It assumes that the voters will 8 allow us -- will authorize us to raise our 9 authorization by $900 million in bonding authority. 10 If they do that, that will allow us to complete 1.5 11 billion -- start $1.5 billion worth of capital work 12 over the next four-year period. 13 What you see below is what will happen to the 14 average customer, the average monthly cost for 15 wastewater. The number says Fiscal Year 2016, 16 that's based on a rate that has already been 17 approved and the average customer will be paying MSD 18 $40.72 a month for that service that they're 19 receiving. 20 The next four years we're proposing that the 21 rate go up approximately 10 percent per year 22 culminating in Fiscal Year 2020 for the average 23 customer an annual monthly cost of about $61 a month 24 for wastewater service. 25 On the right-hand side is Option B. This is PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 20 1 assuming the voters don't authorize an additional 2 $900 million worth of bonds. As you see, it 3 anticipates zero use of additional bonds, however, 4 whether we get bonding or not, based on our 5 agreement with the EPA and the Department of 6 Justice, we will have to start $1.5 billion worth of 7 capital work. 8 Below you see what happens to the average 9 monthly cost to our wastewater customers. Again, in 10 Fiscal Year 16 it's $40.72. Fiscal Year 2017 we're 11 still using some remaining bonding authority so the 12 rate stays the same in both scenarios at $44.72. 13 After that we pay for things just with cash 14 resulting in Fiscal Year 2020 for the average 15 customer an average monthly cost of $96 a month for 16 wastewater service. 17 Now I'll talk about stormwater. First of 18 all, I want to touch on current stormwater services. 19 If you take a look at this map this is a map of the 20 District boundaries. To the north is the Missouri 21 River. To the right is the Mississippi River. And 22 in blue you can see the City of St. Louis outline. 23 To the south, wiggling in and out of the District, 24 is the Meramec River. And to the west, that line 25 where the pink ends, that's approximately Highway PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 21 1 109 in Wildwood. Those are the current District's 2 municipal boundaries. 3 In the red area, if you live there, you're 4 currently paying us 24 cents a month plus 5 approximately a 2 cent property tax to do 6 stormwater. Those funds are sufficient for us to do 7 local, state, and federal stormwater compliance 8 regulatory requirements, data collection and 9 tracking and, if necessary, emergency response. The 10 types of emergencies we're talking about is, for 11 instance, erosion that's so severe that a house is 12 ready to drop in a creek. Those are the kind of 13 emergencies we're talking about. We do not maintain 14 the public storm sewer system in that area and we do 15 no projects to address stormwater issues. There's 16 no funding for that. 17 If you live in the yellow area, which is the 18 City of St. Louis and the very near northwest and 19 South County primarily, there you pay a 24 cent 20 monthly fee, the 2 cent property tax and an 21 additional 7 cent property tax. That allows us to 22 do all the regulatory work, the same as the folks in 23 the red area, however, it also allows us to pretty 24 well operate and maintain the public storm sewer 25 system in that area. We cannot do any project to PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 22 1 solve other stormwater problems. There is no 2 funding for that. 3 If you live in the green area and that's kind 4 of just outside the City of St. Louis out to about 5 270, it kind of wiggles in and out there -- we are 6 in the green area where we are here today -- you 7 currently pay a 24 cent monthly fee to MSD, a 2 cent 8 property tax, a 7 cent property tax and up to 9 another 10 cent property tax to MSD. 10 If you do that you get all the regulatory 11 work done, you may operate and maintain the public 12 storm sewer system and we are able to do projects, 13 limited to that funding, to solve stormwater issues 14 such as flooding and creek erosion. 15 What does that mean in real dollars? Again, 16 the same map, if you look at the red area with the 17 24 cent fee and 2 cent tax, the average District 18 customer in the red area pays MSD $8 a year for 19 stormwater service. 20 If you live in the yellow area, paying a 24 21 cent fee, 2 cent tax and a 7 cent tax, the average 22 customer in that area is paying $26 a year for 23 stormwater services. 24 If you live in the green area you pay the 24 25 cent fee, 2 cent tax, 7 cent tax and up to a 10 cent PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 23 1 tax depending on where you live in the green area. 2 The average customer there pays us $53 a year for 3 stormwater. If you compare those services you can 4 see the more somebody pays the more services they're 5 receiving. 6 I'll touch real quickly on what the issue is 7 I mentioned earlier that MSD is trying to address 8 with stormwater. Stormwater regulatory activities, 9 and this has to do with making sure new development 10 does not flood downstream to people by putting 11 basins in, make sure that any new development or 12 anybody else -- the pollutants that are carried from 13 stormwater, try to mitigate their impact on the 14 water quality of local creeks and streams. 15 We do that through plan review and 16 permitting, complaint investigation and, again, 17 emergency response. We're able to provide that 18 service throughout the District. 19 What does that look like? And I'm going to 20 talk about what you saw earlier as the red area. So 21 on this next slide the gray area is where you saw 22 the yellow and green previously. So everything 23 outside of that is the red area and that's what I 24 want to talk about. 25 The blue lines you see are all creeks that PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 24 1 are located out in the red area. They represent 2 1,154 miles of creeks and also on this map are 3 little green dots. There's 2,638 of those. Those 4 are either basins to hold back stormwater or some 5 kind of green infrastructure in order to address 6 water quality and take pollutants out of stormwater 7 runoff. MSD has the responsibility of permitting 8 those and then policing to make sure they are 9 maintained by the property owners. 10 We also have the responsibility of sampling 11 the creeks to make sure we understand the impact of 12 stormwater on the water quality in those creeks. 13 All of that work is currently paid for. The 2 cent 14 tax provides sufficient funds to do that work. 15 The next slide is a representation of what is 16 not being funded. The black lines you see there are 17 the public storm sewer system owned by MSD that's in 18 the red area. It represents 1,363 miles of sewer. 19 It's approximately the same amount of storm sewer 20 system that's in the green area -- that's in the 21 gray area that you see right there. 22 There's no funding to operate and maintain 23 that system. If an inlet gets busted up, if there's 24 a leak in a storm sewer causing a sinkhole, if 25 there's erosion caused by the discharge of the storm PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 25 1 sewer we cannot address those issues. There is no 2 money to do that. 3 Two issues we're looking to address. One, we 4 want to put a funding source in so we can operate 5 and maintain the public storm sewer system located 6 in what is the red area. The second part is right 7 now folks who live in that area are not pay anything 8 for the service of MSD of having a municipal 9 District-wide storm sewer system, primarily whose 10 primary function is to make sure that stormwater 11 comes off the streets so you can use the streets and 12 roads and also to take flows out from people's 13 backyards. So we're also proposing to address the 14 folks in that area help pay for the cost of 15 maintaining the District-wide public storm sewer 16 system. 17 What we're proposing. We're proposing an 18 operation and maintenance budget of $90.8 million 19 over that four-year period. We're also proposing to 20 do $100 million worth of capital work District-wide. 21 That's the two remaining years in the current cycle, 22 2015, 2016, plus the four years in the current rate 23 cycle. 24 Again, what are those drivers? What we feel 25 is the necessary maintenance of the public storm PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 26 1 system, especially that part that has never been 2 funded, and also it does initiate for the first time 3 the ability to do District-wide projects to address 4 stormwater issues throughout the entire District. 5 The next slide is what the operating costs 6 look like. In Fiscal 16, which is the current cycle 7 at $16 million, if a 10 cent District-wide tax is 8 approved our operating costs go up just around 50 9 percent, up to about $23 million a year. What 10 happens is the system we have to maintain doubles 11 and the cost to do that is about a 50 percent 12 increase in our operation and maintenance needs. 13 We will also be doing stormwater projects 14 District-wide for the first time and I'm going to 15 talk about each of these areas because they're a 16 little different. Starting at the top of the chart, 17 in the green area we have identified 64 projects at 18 a cost of $25 million. Whether or not a 10 cent tax 19 is approved most of those would be done anyway. 20 They're paid for for a special -- that up to 10 cent 21 property tax that exists just in the green area. 22 However, there are a few more that are able 23 to do be done because the current taxes in that 24 green area, some of those are actually going to the 25 operation and maintenance of the public storm sewer PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 27 1 system. 2 In the yellow area, which has never had any 3 kind of stormwater projects, we have identified 47 4 projects worth about seventeen and a half million 5 dollars. Half of those are located within the City 6 of St. Louis, the other half to the north, south and 7 west, immediate west of the City of St. Louis. 8 That money comes from a change in the way we 9 have to account for our funds. With a District-wide 10 10 cent property tax it releases some accounting 11 restrictions we have and allows us to use some 12 monies that are available in those areas to build 13 projects, which we weren't previously able to do. 14 Finally, in the red area there's 59 projects 15 identified for $7.5 million. These monies come from 16 the difference between the tax we're asking for and 17 what our current anticipated O & M costs are. If we 18 ask for a 10 cent property tax approximately 8.8 19 cents of that goes to operation and maintenance of 20 the system. 21 We are proposing that anything that's left 22 over be used to resolve District-wide stormwater 23 projects. For those four years it generates 24 approximately seven and a half million dollars of 25 extra money. That is just for now. What will PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 28 1 happen is we anticipate that as inflation happens 2 that cost of 8.8 cents will slowly rise and 3 eventually we will not be able to do any capital 4 work. But for now it's available and we anticipate 5 it being available for the next 10 plus years. 6 Just like with the wastewater map we have a 7 stormwater map over here. Same circles, same 8 numbers. Again, it's in our Rate Proposal. Also, 9 we have the map here along with the spreadsheet. So 10 if you're interested in looking it up you can find 11 the number, we'll tell you the problem solved, what 12 we're going to do to solve it, how much it costs, 13 and what year we plan on doing it. 14 So a summation of what happens to all the 15 stormwater taxes. If you live in the green area -- 16 and there are 21 separate little taxing districts in 17 that large green area you saw. We will plan on 18 setting all those tax rates to zero. We will make 19 them go away. 20 The stormwater tax, the 7 cent property tax 21 that's paid for in the green and yellow area with an 22 approval of a 10 cent District-wide tax that 10 cent 23 tax will replace the 7 cent tax and we'll no longer 24 charge the 7 cent property tax. 25 The 2 cent property tax that's District-wide PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 29 1 is currently sufficient to meet our regulatory 2 needs. Our plan is to leave that 2 cent property 3 tax in place District-wide. 4 The fourth line you see there is the 5 implementation of a District-wide 10 cent property 6 tax and the monthly 24 cent per month charge that 7 goes to wastewater customers right now to pay for 8 stormwater will also be replaced by the 10 cent 9 property tax. 10 So for stormwater what's the impact on the 11 individuals who live in the various areas? So in 12 the green area the average property value in the 13 green area is $184,500. Based on that, the average 14 person living in the green area pays an annual 15 property tax bill to MSD of about $62 per year. 16 If this proposal goes in place that amount 17 would reduce by about $20 per year. It would go 18 down resulting in an average annual cost to MSD on 19 your annual property tax bill of approximately $42 20 per year. The impact on your overall property tax 21 bill for the average person would be a reduction of 22 one half of one percent on their overall property 23 tax bill. 24 MSD is a very small part of the property tax 25 bill, therefore, the impact -- this one-third PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 30 1 reduction has a very small impact on the overall 2 value of your property tax bill. 3 If you live in the yellow area the average 4 property value of the yellow area is $70,800, so the 5 average person there is paying us $12.50 a year for 6 stormwater services. The proposed 10 cent rate and 7 all the other changes would result in an increase 8 for the average person of $3.60 resulting in an 9 average annual cost for stormwater on the property 10 tax bill of just over $16 per year. 11 That would result in an average change in the 12 property tax bill for folks in that area of an 13 increase of three-tenths of 1 percent or $3 for 14 every thousand dollars of taxes paid. 15 Finally, in the red area, if you recall 16 there's very little services and very little funds 17 currently being collected from that area. The 18 average property value in that area right now is 19 $266,700. With the 2 cent tax the average person in 20 that area pays us approximately $10.50 per year on 21 their annual property tax bill. A 10-cent-wide tax 22 would increase that by about $50 per year. It would 23 result in the individuals in those areas paying MSD 24 $60 per year on their annual property tax bill for 25 stormwater services. Change in their overall PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 31 1 property tax bill would be an increase of 2 1.2 percent. 3 Finally, as far as information, I just want 4 to kind of give a sense of what this overall cost 5 means to the average person. So if you take a look 6 at the next slide, on the left-hand side we're 7 assuming that the voters grant MSD an additional 8 $900 million of bonding authority. 9 If they do, the average customer right now in 10 the District -- you see the number on Graph FY16 -- 11 they pay MSD $522 per year for all of the services 12 that MSD provides. If bonds are authorized and all 13 these proposals move forward, by Fiscal Year 2020 14 the average customer will pay MSD $770 per year for 15 all the services that MSD provides. 16 The right-hand column is assuming the 17 ratepayers decide not to grant additional bond 18 authorization to MSD. If you recall, we have to do 19 the wastewater capital work as required by the 20 Department of Justice and EPA. Again, you start at 21 $522.54 per year. That would eventually go up for 22 all the services MSD pays -- for the average 23 customer paying $1,193 per year for all the services 24 that MSD proposes -- that provides. 25 The last page, MSD does have a low income PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 32 1 customer assistance program. Essentially your costs 2 are cut in half. So if there are any low-income 3 individuals, if you compare this chart to the 4 previous chart all of those costs are cut in half. 5 So if you were going to pay 500, you'll pay 6 something around $250 for those costs. So we do 7 have a low-income customer assistance program in 8 those instances. 9 What will happen in the future? As mentioned 10 previously, MSD has submitted this Rate Proposal to 11 the Rate Commission on February 26th, 2015. There 12 will be a final wastewater increase from the current 13 rate cycle that will go into effect July 1, 2015 14 resulting in those costs you saw under the FY2016 15 column. 16 The Rate Commission's recommendations of 17 staff's recommendations are due to our board by 18 August 10th, 2015. Our Board of Trustees will 19 consider their recommendations between August and 20 December of 2015 and after that the voters will be 21 asked to vote. There will be two things that you 22 will be asked to vote on in Calendar 2016. Don't 23 know the exact time but they will be in 2016. 24 One on the wastewater side. You will be 25 asked to do this work do the customers wish to PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 33 1 authorize an additional $900 million in bonding 2 authority. If you do, the average cost will go up 3 to that one chart that went from about $40 per month 4 to $60 per month. 5 If the voters decide not to authorize 6 additional bonding authority the cost will go from 7 $40 a month up to that $96 per month in a four-year 8 period as was seen on the other option chart. 9 It will be up to the ratepayers. It's kind 10 of like buying a house or buying a car. If you 11 borrow money now for that it costs less now but for 12 every dollar you borrow you got to pay $3 back in 13 the future because you have to pay for the interest 14 of the loan. If you're willing to allow the rates 15 to go up higher now you pay more now but when the 16 program peaks in around 2023 and costs go down, 17 that cost will go down quicker and you won't have to 18 pay interest costs. That's a decision the 19 ratepayers will have to make. 20 The second ballot will have to do with 21 stormwater. We will be asking you whether or not 22 you are willing to approve a 10 cent District-wide 23 property tax for stormwater. If they do approve the 24 10 cent tax you'll see the program I just last 25 presented, which is District-wide maintenance of the PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 34 1 public storm sewer system, as well as District-wide 2 projects to solve stormwater issues. 3 If the voters decide not to approve the 10 4 cent tax the situation will remain the same as I 5 originally described, if you remember the yellow, 6 red and green map with the cost -- with the services 7 you are provided depending on how much you have to 8 be paying and where you live. 9 If you do have any questions for the Rate 10 Commission you can submit -- two ways, one, you can 11 speak today and I'll open that up in a minute for 12 public comment, if you have any public comments you 13 want to give to the Rate Commission. If you desire 14 to submit some comments, other than in this forum, 15 there is an email address that you can use or you 16 can mail any comments to us at MSD and we will make 17 sure all comments are forwarded to the Rate 18 Commission. 19 With that, the Rate Commission is ready to 20 open the floor to any public comments that anyone 21 has with regard to MSD's Rate Proposal. 22 MR. SCHOEDEL: Thank you, Mr. Hoelscher. 23 Could I have the clipboard with the names of people 24 that signed in? For the people who signed in who 25 wish to provide testimony, again, I will take them PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 35 1 in order of the way they signed in and then we're 2 asking you to limit your comments to 10 minutes. 3 So the first gentleman we have on the list is 4 Ralph Roberts. 5 MR. ROBERTS: You'll have to excuse my 6 English because what I know about what's going on 7 with this is zilch. At the end of 2020, the rate 8 increase that you collect, do that go back, does 9 that go back or it stays there and continues to 10 rise? 11 MR. HOELSCHER: Can I go ahead and 12 respond? I think it's worthwhile. 13 MR. SCHOEDEL: Please. 14 MR. HOELSCHER: In our Rate Proposal we 15 show about the same amount of work needs to be done 16 for the four years after that as well, with a 17 subsequent increase. The cost of our capital 18 program for the wastewater starts going down after 19 2023. 20 MR. ROBERTS: After 2023. 21 MR. HOELSCHER: So we're anticipating -- 22 what it actually looks like will depend on whether 23 or not the voters want to use bonds to help pay for 24 this or not, but somewhere around '23 or '24 rates 25 will then start going back down. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 36 1 MR. ROBERTS: Yeah. Okay. I have got 2 one more question I'm not sure about. 3 Does MSD, do they have -- 4 MSD STAFF: Low income? 5 MR. ROBERTS: No, not low income. That 6 stops me right there. I'm on a fixed income right 7 now but I'm single, so I'm just above that. So it 8 don't help me at all. Do they have stockholders? 9 MR. HOELSCHER: No, sir. MSD is 10 actually a municipal corporation formed under the 11 constitution, so we're just like a city. 12 MR. ROBERTS: That's all I needed to 13 know. 14 MR. SCHOEDEL: Thank you. Then Herman 15 Nebel? 16 MR. NEBEL: I don't have anything. I 17 thought we were just signing into be here. 18 MR. SCHOEDEL: Is there anybody else 19 that came in later that would like to speak or have 20 any testimony? Any comments from the Rate 21 Commissioners here? 22 MR. TOMAZI: None. Thank you. 23 MR. SCHOEDEL: Seeing or hearing none, 24 thank you all for your participation tonight and 25 spending the time to listen to this presentation. PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 37 1 The next public hearing will be conducted on May 2 16th, this Saturday, at 10 a.m. at the Tesson Ferry 3 Library Branch. 4 This public hearing is adjourned. Thank you. 5 - - - - - 6 (Hearing concluded at 6:49 p.m.) 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES Page 38 1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 2 I, Suzanne Zes, within and for the State 3 of Missouri, do hereby certify that the witness 4 whose testimony appears in the foregoing deposition 5 was duly sworn by me; the testimony of said witness 6 was taken by me to the best of my ability and 7 thereafter reduced to typewriting under my 8 direction; that I am neither counsel for, related 9 to, nor employed by any of the parties to the action 10 in which this deposition was taken, and further that 11 I am not a relative or employee of any attorney or 12 counsel employed by the parties thereto, nor 13 financially or otherwise interested in the outcome 14 of the action. 15 16 ______________________________ 17 Certified Court Reporter 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES A AA 15:16,18,20 AAA 15:17 AA1 15:18 ability 26:3 38:6 able 22:12 23:17 26:22 27:13 28:3 access 18:20 accommodate 15:10 accomplished 13:15 accomplishing 18:23 account 27:9 accounting 27:10 acted 6:18 action 38:9,14 activities 23:8 actual 9:12 additional 7:8 16:8,19 20:1,3 21:21 31:7,17 33:1,6 address 10:9 11:11 14:25 21:15 23:7 24:5 25:1,3,13 26:3 34:15 addressing 14:5 adjourned 37:4 adopted 6:6,9,22 agreement 20:5 ahead 35:11 allow 19:8,10 33:14 allows 10:11 21:21,23 27:11 amended 5:8 6:23 American 8:3 amount 13:23 18:5 24:19 29:16 35:15 annual 11:17 19:23 29:14,18 29:19 30:9,21 30:24 anticipate 28:1,4 anticipated 13:9 27:17 anticipates 20:3 anticipating 12:19 13:11,22 35:21 anybody 23:12 36:18 anyway 26:19 appears 38:4 appendix 18:15 18:16 application 6:25 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including 5:21 income 31:25 36:4,5,6 increase 15:9 26:12 30:7,13 30:22 31:1 32:12 35:8,17 independent 6:20 individuals 29:11 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES 30:23 32:3 Industrial 7:3 inflation 28:1 information 4:13 31:3 infrastructure 24:5 initiate 26:2 inlet 24:23 inlets 11:6 input 11:22 inside 17:21 inspect 18:25 19:1 inspected 13:17 13:18 instance 21:11 instances 32:8 institutions 6:1 interest 15:21 33:13,18 interested 5:20 18:7 28:10 38:13 intervene 6:25 7:1,22 Intervenors 7:8 introduction 2:3 9:24 investigation 23:16 issue 7:20 10:9 12:8 14:5 23:6 issues 5:22,22,23 7:11,17 14:25 21:15 22:13 25:1,3 26:4 34:2 J July 12:11 14:2 32:13 June 6:11 7:25 12:11 13:12 Justice 10:5 20:6 31:20 K keep 17:8 kind 15:22 21:12 22:3,5 24:5 27:3 31:4 33:9 know 32:23 35:6 36:13 L labor 5:22 Lance 4:12 large 17:11 28:17 leak 24:24 leave 29:2 LeComb 4:12 left 9:2 12:23 19:7 27:21 left-hand 31:6 legal 6:19 Library 37:3 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3:5 near 21:18 Nebel 2:7 36:15 36:16 necessary 8:25 12:11 21:9 25:25 needed 9:1 12:17 12:21 13:5 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES 36:12 needs 26:12 29:2 35:15 neither 38:8 never 26:1 27:2 new 23:9,11 nine 7:24 non-profit 5:24 Normandy 1:12 3:4 north 4:24 20:20 27:6 northern 13:21 northwest 21:18 notice 6:4 8:1 18:14 Notices 8:4 November 5:9 number 13:23 17:21 18:3,10 19:15 28:11 31:10 numbers 18:1 28:8 O O 5:1 27:17 occurred 13:20 offered 19:5 officer 8:24 Okay 36:1 one-third 29:25 on-the-record 7:23 open 9:17 34:11 34:20 operate 21:24 22:11 24:22 25:4 operating 16:24 26:5,8 operation 5:21 10:11 13:7,15 16:3 18:22 25:18 26:12,25 27:19 Operational 6:6 operations 13:16 opportunity 6:24 8:9 option 19:7,25 33:8 options 19:5 order 8:13,21 13:5 15:10 16:17 24:5 35:1 organizations 5:15,18,20,21 5:24,24 6:1 8:15 11:23,25 originally 14:24 34:5 outcome 38:13 outline 20:22 outside 22:4 23:23 overall 29:20,22 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18:19,21 28:8 29:16 32:10 34:21 35:14 proposals 31:13 propose 12:2 15:14 proposed 5:13 6:13 8:23 30:6 proposes 31:24 proposing 6:4 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES 14:1 16:16 19:20 25:13,17 25:17,19 27:21 provide 10:14 11:22 23:17 34:25 provided 8:12 34:7 provides 10:16 24:14 31:12,15 31:24 public 1:9 2:5 3:1 4:13 5:5 7:24 8:1,6,11 10:10 21:14,24 22:11 24:17 25:5,15 25:25 26:25 34:1,12,12,20 37:1,4 published 8:1 pump 13:17 18:24 purpose 7:10 8:7 put 25:4 putting 23:10 p.m 1:17 37:6 Q quality 11:13 23:14 24:6,12 question 36:2 questions 9:3,21 34:9 quicker 33:17 quickly 23:6 R R 4:1 5:1 rain 14:4,22 raining 14:10,13 rains 13:20 14:16 raise 19:8 raised 7:11,17 Ralph 2:6 35:4 rate 4:2 5:6,10,17 5:17,25 6:3,4,6 6:10,10,19,20 6:22,24 7:5,9 7:11,18 8:1,8 8:23 9:10,11,12 9:17,20,23 11:20 12:3,8,12 17:22 18:2,19 18:20,21 19:16 19:21 20:12 25:22 28:8 30:6 32:10,11,13,16 34:9,13,17,19 34:21 35:7,14 36:20 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31:10 33:24 Seeing 36:23 seen 13:14 33:8 select 5:15 sell 16:6 Senior 4:3 sense 31:4 separate 10:15 28:16 serve 11:24 service 11:2,19 16:4 19:18,24 PUBLIC HEARING 5/13/2015 www.midwestlitigation.com Phone: 1.800.280.3376 Fax: 314.644.1334 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES 20:16 22:19 23:18 25:8 services 4:3,23 5:17 10:16,24 20:18 22:23 23:3,4 30:6,16 30:25 31:11,15 31:22,23 34:6 session 2:5 8:6 sessions 7:24 sets 11:22 setting 7:11,18 28:18 seven 27:24 seventeen 27:4 severe 21:11 sewer 1:8 3:2 5:4 9:8 10:10 21:14 21:24 22:12 24:17,18,19,24 25:1,5,9,15 26:25 34:1 sewers 11:7 13:19 19:3,3,4 19:4 sheet 8:12 show 9:9 35:15 showers 10:19 side 10:8 14:6 19:25 31:6 32:24 sign 8:12,18,21 signed 34:24,24 35:1 signing 36:17 similar 13:20 single 36:7 sinkhole 24:24 sinks 10:18 sir 36:9 sitting 18:8 situation 10:13 34:4 size 15:9 slide 15:22 23:21 24:15 26:5 31:6 slides 18:18 slight 13:5 slightly 15:9 slow 14:24 slowly 28:2 small 11:15 29:24 30:1 soak 11:5 socio-economic 5:23 solve 22:1,13 28:12 34:2 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