HomeMy Public PortalAboutExhibit MSD 116 - Transcript of May 16, 2015 Public Hearing PUBLIC HEARING 5/16/2015
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1 METROPOLITAN ST. LOUIS SEWER DISTRICT
2 PUBLIC HEARING
3 MAY 16, 2015
4
5 TESSON FERRY BRANCH LIBRARY
6 9920 LIN FERRY DRIVE
7 ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI
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10 (Hearing start time, 10:02 a.m.)
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1 I N D E X
2 PAGE
3 Introduction by Mr. Schneider 5
4 Presentation by Mr. Hoelscher 9
5 Public Hearing Session
6 Beverly Thomas Kapedy 41
7 Fran Ammel 41
8 Sharon Bertram 46
9 Joseph Haberstroh 50
10 John Judd 53, 60
11 D. McArthy 58
12 Conclusion 60
13
14
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16 (No exhibits marked.)
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19 PUBLIC HEARING FOR THE METROPOLITAN ST. LOUIS
20 SEWER DISTRICT, produced and examined on May 16,
21 2015, between the hours of 10:02 in the forenoon and
22 11:09 in the forenoon of that day, at the Tesson
23 Ferry Branch Library, 9920 Lin Ferry Drive, St.
24 Louis, Missouri, before Suzanne M. Zes, a Certified
25 Court Reporter of the State of Missouri.
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1 A P P E A R A N C E S
2 For the MSD Rate Commission:
3 Eric Schneider
4 St. Louis Regional Chamber
5
Nancy Bowser
6 League of Women Voters of St. Louis
7 Mark Schoedel
Lutheran Senior Services
8
Russell Hawes
9 St. Louis County Municipal League
10
11 Also Present:
12 Brian Hoelscher
Executive Director
13
Lance LeComb
14 Manager of Public Information &
Spokesperson
15
16
17
18 The Court Reporter:
19
20 Suzanne Zes
21 MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES
22 711 North Eleventh Street
23 St. Louis, MO 63101
24 314.644.2191
25 314.644.1334 Fax
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1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 MR. SCHNEIDER: We'll get started. Good
3 morning, my name is Eric Schneider. I am a member
4 of the Metropolitan Sewer District Rate Commission.
5 I'll be presiding over this public hearing this
6 morning.
7 With me today are the following MSD Rate
8 Commission members: Nancy Bowser, Russell Hawes, and
9 Mark Schoedel.
10 The Charter Plan of the District was amended
11 at a general election on November 7th, 2000, and
12 established the Rate Commission to review and make
13 recommendations to the District regarding changes in
14 wastewater rates, stormwater rates and tax rates
15 proposed by the District.
16 The Charter Plan requires the MSD Board of
17 Trustees to select organizations to ensure a fair
18 representation of all users of the District's
19 services on the Rate Commission. The Rate
20 Commission representative organizations are to
21 represent commercial-industrial users, residential
22 users and other organizations interested in the
23 operation of the District including organizations
24 focusing on environmental issues, labor issues,
25 socio-economic issues, community-neighborhood
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1 organizations and other nonprofit organizations.
2 The MSD Rate Commission currently consists of 15
3 members from organizations and institutions
4 throughout St. Louis City and County.
5 I'll take a break here, I didn't introduce my
6 organization. I'm with the St. Louis Regional
7 Chamber. Nancy, could you introduce the
8 organization you represent?
9 MS. BOWSER: I represent the League of
10 Women Voters.
11 MR. SCHNEIDER: Russell?
12 MR. HAWES: The League of
13 Municipalities.
14 MR. SCHOEDEL: I represent Lutheran
15 Senior Services advocating for seniors.
16 MR. SCHNEIDER: Thank you very much.
17 Again, there's 15 -- there's 15 total members from
18 organizations and institutions across St. Louis City
19 and St. Louis County.
20 On February 26th, 2015, the Rate Commission
21 received a Rate Change Notice proposing changes to
22 the District's wastewater rates and stormwater
23 revenues. The Rate Commission adopted Operational
24 Rules and a Procedural Schedule to govern the
25 proceedings on March 4th, 2015.
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1 Under the current Procedural Schedule adopted
2 by the Rate Commission, the MSD Rate Commission has
3 until June 26, 2015 to review and make a
4 recommendation to the MSD Board of Trustees as to
5 whether the proposed rates should be approved, not
6 approved or modified with suggested changes and then
7 approved. The Commission has, however, requested an
8 extension from the MSD Board of Trustees until
9 August 10th, 2015, which has not yet been acted
10 upon.
11 The MSD Rate Commission has engaged legal
12 counsel and a rate consultant independent of those
13 used by the MSD staff.
14 Under procedural rules adopted by the Rate
15 Commission, as amended, any person affected by the
16 Rate Change Proposal had an opportunity to submit an
17 application to intervene in these proceedings.
18 Applications to intervene have been filed by the
19 Home Builders Association of St. Louis and Missouri
20 Industrial Energy Consumers. These applications
21 have been granted.
22 Since February 26th, 2015, the MSD Rate
23 Commission has received testimony from MSD staff.
24 The parties have also engaged in discovery requests.
25 Additional testimony from the Intervenors and the
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1 Rate Consultant will be filed.
2 A Prehearing Conference for the purpose of
3 identifying any issues raised by the Rate Setting
4 Documents and the prepared testimony previously
5 submitted will be conducted on the record. All
6 persons submitting testimony may participate in the
7 Prehearing Conference and each participant in the
8 Prehearing Conference shall submit a Prehearing
9 Conference Report describing the issues raised by
10 the Rate Setting Documents and the prepared
11 testimony, together with a brief description of such
12 participant's position, if any, on any issue and the
13 rationale therefor.
14 Ratepayers who do not wish to intervene are
15 permitted to participate in these on-the-record
16 public hearings conducted in nine sessions beginning
17 on May 11, 2015 and concluding on June 9, 2015.
18 The Rate Commission published a Public Notice
19 regarding these proceedings in the St. Louis
20 Post-Dispatch and in the St. Louis American. These
21 Notices contained the time, dates and locations of
22 each of the conferences and hearings.
23 The Public Hearing Session today is for the
24 purpose of permitting the District to present its
25 Wastewater and Stormwater Rate Change Proposal and
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1 to permit any ratepayer an opportunity to comment.
2 We will begin with a presentation by the District,
3 followed by a public comment period.
4 Those wishing to speak should sign in on the
5 sheet provided and they will be called on in the
6 order of the names list thereon. Each of the
7 ratepayers should identify themselves and any
8 organizations represented by such ratepayer.
9 So, again, a couple housekeeping items:
10 If you wish to present testimony please sign
11 in on the clipboard on the back table back there.
12 Again, there's a clipboard right there. Speakers
13 will be recognized in the order of which they sign
14 up.
15 Each ratepayer may have a maximum of ten
16 minutes to speak regarding the proposed rate change.
17 As the presiding officer, I can limit or expand the
18 time should I deem it necessary. Restrooms are
19 located out the door and to the right.
20 Are there any other questions regarding the
21 procedures of this public hearing?
22 Okay. Seeing none, is the District ready to
23 proceed?
24 MR. HOELSCHER: Yes, we are.
25 MR. SCHNEIDER: I will turn it over to
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1 Brian Hoelscher, executive director of MSD.
2 MR. HOELSCHER: Thank you,
3 Mr. Schneider. Again, I'm Brian Hoelscher. I'm the
4 executive director of MSD. This morning we're going
5 to present to you the proposed Rate Proposal that
6 MSD has submitted to the Rate Commission for their
7 consideration.
8 After my presentation the Rate Commission
9 will open the floor for comments. The purpose --
10 one of the main purposes of this is to receive
11 public comments regarding our Rate Proposal. As
12 Mr. Schneider indicated, there will be an
13 opportunity for you to speak if you wish.
14 At the end of all the proceedings, after this
15 formal public hearing is closed, MSD staff is here,
16 if you have other questions for MSD outside of this
17 Rate Proposal or comments, we have staff here that
18 we can take your questions, either answer them or
19 research them and get back to you. So we'll be
20 available for that after this is done.
21 What you're going to see here is a summation
22 of MSD's Rate Proposal. This is not the entire Rate
23 Proposal. If you go on our website you will see a
24 pretty massive document that contains all of the
25 back-up information for everything I'm going to go
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1 over here.
2 If you have a copy of the presentation, on
3 occasion you will see references at the bottom of
4 the page with regard to appendices or page numbers
5 or tables. Those are references to information
6 that's actually in the Rate Proposal and if you went
7 on our website and looked at the Rate Proposal you'd
8 see all the back-up information for the numbers I'm
9 going to present and information I'll present to you
10 today.
11 To get started, there are two drivers to what
12 MSD is going to -- why they are requesting a change
13 in rates. One is on wastewater. MSD signed a
14 Consent Decree based on a lawsuit from the EPA and
15 the Department of Justice and there are wastewater
16 capital improvement projects, as well as operation
17 and maintenance activities, that we have to comply
18 with in order to meet the requirements of that
19 Consent Decree. That is the driver for the rates.
20 That document indicates activities we have to
21 perform, as well as time frames in which they have
22 to be completed.
23 On the stormwater side, the main purpose for
24 the proposed change, you will hear MSD recommending
25 an elimination of some taxes and the institution --
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1 the voters to consider a 10-cent-wide District storm
2 tax. The reason for that is approximately one half
3 of our public storm sewer system that MSD is
4 responsible for, inlets, manholes, storm sewers and
5 paved channels, do not have a funding source to
6 provide operation and maintenance. That's primarily
7 the area outside of 270.
8 Also, individuals out there are not paying
9 anything for the operation and maintenance of the
10 system that serves all the local streets here within
11 our municipal boundaries, within the District
12 boundaries. You will find that we're asking the
13 voters to consider to rectify that situation.
14 To start the presentation, you need to
15 remember MSD is two utilities. We provide a
16 wastewater service. We collect used water from
17 sinks, drains, toilets, washing machines. They go
18 down the pipes, go to our treatment plants, we treat
19 them in accordance with state and federal
20 regulations and then discharge them to the local
21 rivers, mostly the Mississippi River, the Missouri
22 River and the Meramec River.
23 MSD's customers pay for this service on a
24 monthly wastewater bill that you receive from MSD.
25 That bill pays for those particular services. The
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1 money collected there can only be used for those
2 services. They can't be used for anything else.
3 We are also a stormwater utility. Any of the
4 rain that does not naturally flow to creeks and
5 streams in the areas or doesn't soak into the
6 ground, MSD has facilities, storm sewer facilities
7 in order to capture that stormwater. Again, that's
8 the manholes, inlets, storm sewers. Mostly you see
9 those along streets as you drive the St. Louis
10 County and St. Louis City area. There's a big
11 portion of that. So we run that system.
12 Also, we are required to address the impacts
13 on local creeks and streams of pollutants that are
14 in stormwater runoff that impact the water quality
15 of those creeks and streams.
16 That stormwater service is a small fee on the
17 monthly bill but a majority, a huge majority of the
18 revenues for those services are on your annual
19 property tax bill. Everybody -- depending on where
20 you live everybody pays something different. We'll
21 review that as part of the proposal but property
22 taxes primarily are what pay for the stormwater
23 services. And, again, those taxes can be used for
24 stormwater. They cannot be used for any of our
25 wastewater issues.
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1 Quick review about MSD's Rate Commission
2 again. It was established in 2000 to provide public
3 input on how MSD sets its rates. As described,
4 there are 15 organizations on MSD's Rate Commission.
5 They review all the proposal changes that MSD staff
6 submits to them. Their recommendations will go
7 before our Board of Trustees. They will conduct a
8 similar review of the Rate Commission's
9 recommendations and then the Board of Trustees will
10 make a judgment, a decision as to how to move
11 forward.
12 What we're proposing. This will set the tax
13 rates and the wastewater rates for July 1, 2016 to
14 June 30th, 2020. With wastewater we want to start
15 with where we are currently. Previously the Rate
16 Commission met and our board has approved wastewater
17 rates through June 30th, 2016. Under that proposal
18 we have identified approximately $971 million worth
19 of capital work that needed to be started during
20 that four-year period. Right now it appears we will
21 appropriate $890 million of that work.
22 The capital program within that four years is
23 on time. We have completed all the work required by
24 the Consent Decree and we're also on budget or under
25 budget. Some of it has to do with us -- some
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1 optimization of some of the plans and that also has
2 to do with some of the prices we're getting and it
3 has driven some of the costs down.
4 On the operation and maintenance, again, same
5 message, we're on time and under budget. We
6 requested a revenue need of $716 million. It
7 appears we will be spending $700 million on the
8 operation and maintenance of the wastewater system
9 by June 30th, 2016.
10 Some of those wastewater accomplishments, in
11 addition to the operation and maintenance of the
12 large treatment plants, pump stations, good
13 inspection of 62,000 manholes, rehabilitation of
14 6600 wastewater manholes, inspection of 1900 miles
15 of sewers.
16 And based on an analysis of two very similar
17 storms that happened in the northern part of our
18 District, somewhere around the airport, it appears
19 that the activities over the past four to five years
20 has resulted in a 66 percent reduction in the amount
21 of overflows we have coming out of the system, as
22 well as a 66 percent reduction in the number of
23 basement backups we have in the system. So we are
24 seeing good results from the work we've been doing
25 so far.
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1 What MSD is proposing, through MSD Project
2 Clear to address the regulatory requirements in the
3 Consent Decree, one is to get the rain out. The
4 main focus of the Consent Decree for the wastewater
5 is the fact that our system overflows, be it to the
6 environment or to basements in the area.
7 The main reason for that problem is that
8 stormwater, either that's not supposed to be there
9 or too much is getting in the system, is using up
10 the capacity and causing overflows in the system
11 that cause overflows or basement backups.
12 The cheapest way to resolve this issue is to
13 get the rain out, don't let the stormwater go in the
14 system in the first place. The problem resolving is
15 a wet weather issue. If it is not raining, and
16 let's assume there's not problems in the system such
17 as somebody flushing grease down the system to block
18 it or a line collapses or something like that, if
19 it's not raining, all the wastewater you put down
20 the system goes through the pipes, gets treated by
21 the plants and gets properly discharged after
22 treatment.
23 There are no problems with our system under
24 dry weather. The problem is wet weather. And the
25 best solution is to get the rain out as much as we
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1 possibly can. It is four to five times cheaper to
2 do that than to make the system bigger.
3 Repair and maintenance. Start a regular
4 repair and maintenance schedule on the sewer systems
5 to make sure they continue operating for another
6 hundred and seventy years since that's the age of
7 the oldest sewers we have and make sure it continues
8 to rehab them, make sure it continues to function
9 and in some cases building system improvements where
10 needed in order to provide a little bit of
11 additional capacity.
12 We want to do this in a financially
13 responsible manner and maintain the stability of the
14 District. We've done this, you'll see in our
15 proposal, we have taken what the key parameters are
16 to maintain a AA bond rating. And for this four
17 years, as well as an 8-year potential projection,
18 we're proposing a Rate Proposal that will make sure
19 MSD maintain -- or that we believe will help MSD
20 maintain a AA bond rating. Currently MSD has a AAA
21 bond rating from S&P and AA1 and AA plus from
22 Moody's and Fitch.
23 Next page is what the main cost components
24 are within the next four-year proposal. We are
25 proposing the start of $1.5 billion worth of capital
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1 work in the next four years. It's broken out into
2 years as you see here. 2017 to 2020 culminating in
3 the start of approximately $1.5 billion worth of
4 work.
5 We're estimating an operation and maintenance
6 cost of $736 million during that four-year period
7 and we're also having to pay for $477 million of
8 debt service. Some of that debt service is from
9 past bond issues that were previously authorized by
10 the voters. You will find in here we will be asking
11 the voters to consider the authorization of an
12 additional $900 million worth of bonding authority.
13 We have put in the cost of that debt service into
14 our Rate Proposal also.
15 On the additional use of debt we're proposing
16 to fund those next four years at $1.5 billion
17 through two funding sources. One is $415 million of
18 cash financing. That's taking the rate you pay us
19 directly and taking that cash and spending it on the
20 capital program.
21 The rest is bond financing of $1.5 billion.
22 That consists of $200 million of bonding authority
23 that will be left after this four-year cycle, as
24 well as a request for the ratepayers to allow an
25 additional $900 million of bonding authority. That
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1 would bring the total debt authorized by the voters,
2 if they approve that, to $2.62 billion.
3 In all cases the revenues from bond sales and
4 borrowed monies is all spent on capital work. It is
5 not used on our operating budget to pay for
6 materials, equipment or personnel. It's just used
7 on projects.
8 What you will see and what you'll get out of
9 that proposal, there will be about 600 projects that
10 will be started of all kinds. 230 of those will be
11 construction projects. We anticipate it will remove
12 39 of the overflow points located in the sanitary
13 sewer system that have to be removed according to
14 the Consent Decree. We will start the design of 24
15 miles of storage and conveyance tunnels. There are
16 locations where getting the water out on the front
17 end, keeping stormwater from entering the system is
18 not the best answer.
19 Some cases, as the systems overflow, we will
20 intercept those flows, store them in large storage
21 facilities, such as underground tunnels, and then
22 when the storm has passed we will feed those flows
23 to the treatment plant and make sure they're treated
24 before they enter the environment.
25 Page 11 is a map of the projects. So every
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1 blue dot is one of the projects we plan on proposing
2 over the next four years. I know it's difficult to
3 read, especially with the documents you have in
4 front of you, but within that map, within that dot
5 is a number. That number references a project.
6 Each project has a description of what it's going to
7 do, what it's going to resolve, what the cost is and
8 when the work will be done.
9 In our Rate Proposal you can see that map,
10 you have the numbers and in the Rate Proposal there
11 is a spreadsheet of all those projects. What we've
12 provided here today, it's on the wastewater side if
13 you noticed, we have a copy of the map over here on
14 the board. We also have a copy of that spreadsheet.
15 So if you are interested today in looking at
16 one of those projects and seeing exactly when it
17 will get done and how much it costs, you can do
18 that. All that information is also in our Rate
19 Proposal that's on the website.
20 And, as I mentioned before, if you look at
21 the bottom, Appendix 7.2.2, that's at the bottom,
22 that's a reference to the appendix page that's in
23 our Rate Proposal. So if you want to go online and
24 look at our Rate Proposal you can see all the
25 details behind that information.
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1 We also have proposed wastewater operational
2 costs. Again, besides just the operation and
3 maintenance of all the treatment plants and pump
4 stations we plan on inspecting 60,000 manholes,
5 rehabilitating 6,000 manholes, inspecting 1600 miles
6 of sewer, cleaning 3800 miles of sewer and the
7 rehabilitation of approximately 360 miles of sewer.
8 So, bottom line, what is the cost impact,
9 proposed cost impact to our ratepayers? There are
10 two options and which option we move forward with
11 will be up to the voters in 2016 to tell us which
12 way to fund this program.
13 If you look on the left-hand column under
14 Option A, assuming funding by cash and debt, MSD
15 will ask the voters to consider an authorization of
16 an additional $900 million of bonding authority.
17 That will be used to start the $1.5 billion worth of
18 capital work over this next four-year period that's
19 required by our Consent Decree. And you'll see the
20 average single-family sewer bill. That's the impact
21 for the average family in St. Louis' -- in our
22 service area.
23 Fiscal 16, those costs are already set in the
24 previous cycle. The average customer will pay
25 $40.72 per month. Over the next three years we're
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1 proposing an increase of approximately 10 percent
2 per year to get to $62 per month in 2020.
3 Where does that put us with everybody else?
4 Sanitary sewer rates throughout the country are
5 between 15 and $135 a month depending on where you
6 live and the higher ones are obviously driven by
7 Consent Decrees in cities that entered into with the
8 federal government.
9 On the right-hand side is Option B, funded by
10 cash. The voters will have the option of deciding
11 not to authorize additional bonding authority. So a
12 zero use of additional bonds we still have to start
13 the $1.5 billion worth of capital work that is
14 required by the Consent Decree and the Department of
15 Justice and EPA.
16 You see what happens to the average
17 single-family sewer bill. Again, Fiscal 16 still
18 $40.72. 17 looks the same under both scenarios
19 because we're primarily using the $200 million of
20 remaining bonding authority, culminating in Fiscal
21 20 with an average monthly rate of $96 per month.
22 Stormwater service. There's two ways. Also,
23 one, I need to explain to you what the current
24 service looks like for stormwater in the area and
25 what we're proposing. So this chart is a
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1 description of what the current stormwater services
2 are.
3 I will start at the bottom on the pink area,
4 which is primarily outside 270, 255. If you live in
5 that area you pay MSD a 24 cent per month charge on
6 your wastewater bill, as well as a property tax of
7 approximately 2 percent per year on your annual
8 property tax bill.
9 With that, the area receives -- allows us to
10 comply with state and federal requirements regarding
11 stormwater in the area, it allows us to collect
12 stormwater issues and do some preplanning and make
13 sure we take those into consideration when there's
14 redevelopment, also allows us to do some emergency
15 response if necessary.
16 Those emergencies consist of the type where
17 erosion in a creek is ready to require -- permit a
18 home to fall into a creek because the erosion has
19 approached the home.
20 We do not maintain the public storm sewers in
21 the area. There are no revenues for that and we do
22 not do any stormwater projects. There are no
23 revenues for that either in that red area.
24 If you live in the yellow area shown on the
25 map you pay the 24 cent per month fee on your
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1 wastewater bill for stormwater, you pay a 2 cent
2 property tax on your property tax bill, you also pay
3 a 7 cent property tax on your property tax bill to
4 MSD.
5 For that we can do all the regulatory work
6 that's shown in the pink. In addition, we are able
7 to pretty well operate and maintain the public storm
8 sewer systems throughout the area: the inlets,
9 manholes, storm sewers, and paved channels that are
10 in those areas.
11 One thing there is no funding for is funding
12 for stormwater projects to solve issues such as
13 erosion or flooding. There is no funding for that
14 and no work is done in that way.
15 If you live in the green area that's shown
16 here you pay a 24 cent per month fee, 2 cent
17 property tax, 7 cent property tax and, depending on
18 where in that green area you live, up to another 10
19 cent property tax.
20 With that, you receive all the regulatory
21 work as I described in the pink area, we maintain
22 the public storm sewer system and there are funds to
23 do projects to resolve stormwater issues such as
24 flooding or erosion.
25 Yes, sir?
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1 MR. McARTHY: You're talking property
2 tax in those percentages? Those are percentages
3 based on the value of your home, so if your home
4 goes up your fee collection will actually go up?
5 MR. HOELSCHER: Correct, and if they go
6 down it goes down. Yeah, those are property taxes,
7 just like all your other property taxes on your
8 property tax bill.
9 So that's how things are set up. You can see
10 here, depending on where you live in the District,
11 you pay a different amount for stormwater service
12 and that's directly related to the amount of
13 stormwater service you receive.
14 What is the average cost per customer? We've
15 taken the average home throughout our District,
16 we've kind of put that into numbers. So if you live
17 in the pink area you're paying the 24 cent fee and 2
18 cent tax and just get the regulatory work done, no
19 operation and maintenance of the stormwater system,
20 no projects. The average customer on their property
21 tax bill pays an annual cost to MSD of $8 per year
22 for that service.
23 If you live in the yellow area and pay the 24
24 cent fee, the 2 cent property tax and the 7 cent
25 property tax, we're doing the regulatory work and
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1 operate and maintain the storm sewers themselves.
2 The average customer on their annual property tax
3 bill is paying us $26 per year for that service.
4 If you live in the green area you're paying
5 us the 24 cent fee, 2 cent tax, 7 cent tax and up to
6 another 10 cent tax. The cost for the average
7 person there is $53 per year on their annual
8 property tax bill and for that they get all the
9 services we provide: regulatory services,
10 maintaining the public storm sewer system, and we do
11 projects within the green area to resolve flooding
12 and erosion problems.
13 The next slide is kind of a description of
14 the main issue that MSD feels it wants to resolve in
15 this Rate Proposal. We have mentioned the 2 cent
16 property tax and you've seen in the pink area the
17 idea of doing all the regulatory work having to do
18 with stormwater quality and the other issues with
19 stormwater.
20 That 2 cent tax, as you saw, is collected
21 District-wide. Most of the costs that come out are
22 plan review and permitting. We review plans, we
23 make sure they're going to meet the regulatory
24 requirements that we have laid down, make sure that
25 new development doesn't cause flooding downstream,
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1 make sure we address water quality issues, the
2 sampling and tracking of all the water quality of
3 all the local creeks and streams throughout the area
4 and, again, some emergency response. That's paid
5 for out of the 2 cent tax and we're able to do that
6 District-wide.
7 What that looks like in that previous red
8 area, what we've done on this next slide is taken
9 the yellow and green area and we actually grayed it
10 out. So what you see is what was the red area.
11 This is kind of representation of what that 2 cent
12 tax takes care of.
13 If you take a look, all the little blue lines
14 are creeks located throughout that area. There's
15 1154 miles of creeks in that red area that MSD is
16 responsible for the impact of stormwater runoff on
17 those creeks and streams.
18 Also, each green dot, 2,638 of them,
19 represent a best management practice or rain garden.
20 These can be basins to resolve volume. These can be
21 rain gardens to take care of stormwater quality.
22 MSD permits these, polices that they're taken care
23 of properly by the property owners and make sure
24 that everything is functioning accordingly, as well
25 as pays for the checking of anybody who might need
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1 to add facilities. All that is paid for with the 2
2 cent tax, that we're able to do that service in the
3 outer part of the District.
4 The next slide is a representation of what
5 MSD feels it needs to get funding provided for.
6 Again, in that red area every one of those black
7 lines is a public storm sewer system owned by MSD:
8 inlets, manholes, stormwater sewers, paved concrete
9 channels. It represents 1,363 miles of storm sewer,
10 approximately one half of the storm sewer system
11 that MSD owns.
12 Operation and maintenance of that system is
13 not currently funded. If an inlet gets busted or
14 broken we cannot address it. If an inlet -- if a
15 storm sewer's joint fails and we have sinkholes in
16 somebody's backyard or the street, we cannot address
17 it by fixing the sewer. If the discharge of the
18 sewer causes some kind of erosion issue in a
19 backyard, creek or stream, we cannot address that.
20 There are no monies.
21 Again, only in the case of severe safety
22 issues would we go out and spend a few dollars in
23 order to resolve those. We're looking to resolve
24 the funding of that.
25 So two things happen with the proposed tax.
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1 One, we have a funding source for that and the other
2 piece is if there are individuals, as you saw
3 previously, who live in those areas, they're not
4 paying for the use District-wide of the public storm
5 sewer system. If you drive on a local street in
6 West County, North County, South County, Mid-County,
7 the City, MSD is providing a service by pulling the
8 stormwater off those streets and disposing it so the
9 streets can work properly. Folks who live in that
10 area and use that service are not paying for that
11 service currently.
12 What we propose to change. We are proposing
13 a 10 cent District-wide property tax to correct that
14 deficiency and I'll go down the details of what
15 happens to all those previous taxes. If that goes
16 through we'll have operation and maintenance costs
17 of approximately $91 million over the next four
18 years to operate and maintain the public storm sewer
19 system and allows us to do $100 million of capital
20 projects starting this year and going through 2020.
21 And, for the first time, capital projects to address
22 stormwater issues such as erosion and flooding can
23 occur District-wide.
24 Again, what are the changes? As I described
25 earlier, it's the maintenance of the public storm
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1 sewer system and also provides a start for something
2 we never had in the past, the ability to resolve
3 stormwater issues throughout the entire District.
4 Slide 23, what are we proposing? In Fiscal
5 Year 2016 right now we believe our operation and
6 maintenance costs for the public storm sewer system
7 will be about $16 million. By taking over and
8 actually operating and maintaining the system in the
9 area outside 270 we're anticipating that our costs
10 will go up to about $24 million per year or
11 $23 million per year as you see on the chart.
12 That's approximately a 50 percent increase and
13 that's to provide full operation and maintenance.
14 So we're increasing our prices. The cost
15 will increase 50 percent but we're doubling the
16 amount of resources, the amount of facilities that
17 we'll have to operate and maintain. There's a
18 benefit from taking over that size facility. It
19 doesn't come at a one to one cost.
20 We'll also be able to do stormwater projects
21 District-wide for the first time. I'm going to kind
22 of go through these and help describe what they are
23 and what they look like.
24 This is the same map that you saw on the
25 wastewater side kind of with the circles, the same
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1 thing, there's a number inside those circles. It
2 describes a problem -- on the spreadsheet it
3 describes the problems, what the solutions are, what
4 the costs are and when it's going to get done. We
5 have a copy of that map over here.
6 There's also a spreadsheet. If you look up
7 that number you'll be able to see where is this
8 project, what it's resolving, what the cost is. We
9 do have a copy of that spreadsheet here. You can
10 look at that today or, if afterwards, if you like,
11 you can take a look at those issues online through
12 the Rate Proposal.
13 Yes, ma'am?
14 MS. BERTRAM: Is there someplace where
15 there's like a street overlay? Because I see myself
16 as either being a green or a yellow down there by
17 270. I want to know what color I am, so I know what
18 to...
19 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah, I think if you
20 would ask us that afterwards you will find that
21 these boundaries follow watersheds. They don't
22 follow municipal boundaries. For that reason, for
23 us to look at that, we can take your information
24 afterwards and either get you the question
25 immediately or get right back to you to let you know
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1 which area you're in.
2 MS. BERTRAM: Okay. Because I would
3 like that. Thank you.
4 MR. HOELSCHER: Sure. We can do that.
5 So what do these projects consist of? If
6 you're in the green area we will complete over
7 that -- through 2020, 64 projects valued at
8 approximately $25 million. Most of these projects
9 would be done anyway.
10 Folks who live in that green area are
11 currently paying that extra tax. Now, there are 21
12 separate taxing areas within that green area.
13 Whatever we collect in a taxing area we can only
14 spend in that taxing area.
15 These projects are a little bit more than
16 what we do otherwise because some of that green
17 revenue -- revenue from the 10 cent property tax was
18 going towards O&M of the public storm sewer system.
19 But kind of either way, under either proposal, we
20 will do pretty much those projects throughout the
21 green area.
22 In the yellow area we're anticipating 47
23 projects at a cost of seventeen and a half million
24 dollars. We have never been able to do projects
25 there. This 10 cent property tax resolves an
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1 accounting issue with the various funds we have in
2 taxing districts and what the use of those funds
3 are. This 10 cent tax will clear that up.
4 Of those 47 projects, dollar-wise, about half
5 of them are done in the city. The other half are
6 done in near northwest and South County and they
7 will resolve, again, stormwater flooding issues and
8 stormwater erosion issues.
9 In the red area there are 60 projects for
10 $7.5 million. Again, we've never done projects in
11 the area primarily outside of 270. This new revenue
12 would allow us to do that. Those monies come from
13 the difference between the tax we're asking for and
14 what the first year of operation and maintenance for
15 the public system. We will be proposing a
16 10-cent-wide District property tax. Right now we
17 anticipate about 8.8 cents of that having to be used
18 for operation and maintenance of the public storm
19 sewer system.
20 That will eventually erode over time with
21 inflation but we want to use those extra dollars to
22 try and solve stormwater problems in an area, the
23 red area you see here, where we haven't been able to
24 address any stormwater issues and allow us to do
25 some stormwater projects to at least start to
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1 resolve some of those issues.
2 So here is summation of what would happen to
3 all the various revenue sources. If you live in the
4 green area you're paying between a 5 and 10 cent
5 tax, again, depending on which one of those 21
6 taxing Districts within that green area. MSD will
7 propose to set those taxes to zero and stop
8 collecting them.
9 I mentioned the 7 cent property tax being
10 paid by the those folks in the yellow and green
11 area. This 10 cent -- proposed 10 cent property tax
12 would replace that 7 cent property tax and it would
13 go away. It would no longer exist.
14 District-wide we are collecting a 2 cent
15 property tax for regulatory issues to MSD. We will
16 be leaving that in place and we will -- that
17 currently funds almost exactly our current
18 requirements for District-wide stormwater regulatory
19 services, so we're not proposing -- not recommending
20 or not presenting any changes to that tax.
21 And then proposing a 10 cent District-wide
22 property tax in order to resolve and provide the
23 program you saw that I just presented. Also, the 24
24 cent per month charge on our wastewater customer's
25 bills for stormwater, that also will be replaced by
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1 the 10 cent tax.
2 So what does that mean to the individual
3 property owner? Again, getting down to dollars,
4 we've broken it down by the three colored areas we
5 have.
6 If you live in the green area, right now the
7 average property value is $184,500. Right now you
8 are paying us an average of $62 per year on your
9 property tax bill for all the stormwater services.
10 If this proposal goes in place the average property
11 tax bill will reduce by $20 per year resulting in an
12 average property tax bill to MSD on your property
13 tax of approximately $42 per year.
14 For your overall property tax bill in that
15 area that's approximately a decrease of one half of
16 one percent of your overall property tax bill. MSD
17 is a very small portion of the property taxes that
18 are paid on an annual basis, so it doesn't have a
19 whole lot of impact on your overall bill.
20 If you live in the yellow area, currently the
21 property values in that area are approximately --
22 are averaging $70,800 per property. The average
23 person in that area is paying MSD $12.50 per year on
24 your property tax bill for the stormwater services
25 in the yellow area. This proposal would result in
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1 an increase for the average person of $3.60,
2 resulting in an average annual property tax bill to
3 MSD of $16.10 per year on your property tax.
4 For the average property tax bill, again,
5 we're a small portion of it, that would be an
6 increase of approximately .3 percent to your
7 property tax bill or for every thousand dollars of
8 property tax an additional three dollars.
9 Finally, if you live in the red area, and as
10 I discussed before this is where we're proposing to
11 now start providing services if we get a revenue
12 source, the average property value in that red area
13 is $266,700. Currently the average person in that
14 area is paying MSD $10.50 per year on their property
15 tax bill for stormwater services. This proposal
16 would raise that approximately $50 per year
17 resulting in the average annual property tax bill of
18 $60.60 per year for stormwater.
19 Change in the overall property tax bill for
20 those in the red area is an increase of 1.2 percent
21 or approximately $10 for every thousand dollars of
22 current taxes paid.
23 What is the overall impact to the customer?
24 You go on to Slide 30, two columns, the left-hand
25 side is assuming that the voters authorize
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1 additional bonding authority. The right-hand column
2 is if they do not. On the left-hand side, again,
3 under the current rates and these will be in place
4 in Fiscal 16, the average single-family customer
5 right now pays MSD $522 per year for all the
6 services we provide, that's wastewater and
7 stormwater.
8 With the increases we're proposing that would
9 go up to $771 per year for all the wastewater and
10 stormwater services that MSD provides.
11 The right-hand column is assuming the
12 residents do not authorize additional bonding
13 authority for MSD. If they do, again, Fiscal 16
14 there's the average annual cost for the customer is
15 $522 per year, that would then go up to about $1200
16 per year, per customer, for all the services we
17 provide in 2020.
18 The next page, MSD does offer a low income
19 program, customer assistance program. If you
20 qualify for that program your cost for MSD services
21 is approximately half of other individuals. If you
22 compare this chart to the one I previously showed
23 you, therefore, see the average annual costs are
24 about half of what the costs are for somebody who
25 does not qualify for the customer assistance
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1 program.
2 What we would be expecting in the future.
3 Again, MSD's staff submitted a Rate Proposal to the
4 Rate Commission on February 26, 2015 to consider.
5 There will be a wastewater increase under the past
6 decision that will occur on July 1, 2015, bringing
7 rates up to that final number I showed for Fiscal
8 16.
9 The Rate Commission's recommendations are due
10 to our Board of Trustees on August 10, 2015. Our
11 Board of Trustees will then spend October through
12 December considering the recommendations from the
13 Rate Commission and then they will decide how to
14 move forward.
15 Before I talk about what those votes look
16 like, again, the Rate Commission is here to accept
17 formal comments today. There are other ways to
18 submit formal comments to the Commission. You can
19 email Janice Fenton at stlmsd.com, as we have shown
20 here, or if you want to mail comments we'll make
21 sure those comments get to the Rate Commission as
22 well.
23 So what will we be asking the ratepayers to
24 consider because both of these proposals require a
25 vote? For the wastewater side MSD will be asking
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1 the public whether or not they want to authorize an
2 additional $900 million of additional bonding
3 authority to pay for the capital program.
4 If you say yes, MSD will issue an additional
5 $900 million of bonds and you end up with rates
6 going up to $60 per month in 2020. If the public
7 decides not to authorize additional bonding
8 authority, costs will go up per month for the
9 average person to about $96 per month in 2020.
10 It's the same decision as if you buy a car or
11 buy a house. If you do authorize additional bonding
12 it will keep rates lower now but for every dollar
13 you borrow you will have to pay three dollars back
14 later.
15 If you don't authorize bonding, rates will go
16 up much faster now but you will have paid for
17 everything and as the program peaks in 2023 or 2024,
18 the costs start going down. Those costs, your
19 annual costs, can go down much quicker if you don't
20 borrow the monies. It's a decision for the voters
21 to decide and we will proceed whichever way the
22 voters tell us to move forward.
23 Yes, sir?
24 MR. McARTHY: How long are the bonds
25 issued for?
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1 MR. HOELSCHER: Right now our policy
2 requires an average of 30-year bonds.
3 Traditionally, what we've been looking at, we will
4 issue up to 30-year, 35-year bonds on the open
5 market. We also have the option of borrowing money
6 through the sale of bonds from the State of Missouri
7 through the state revolving fund. Those have
8 20-year maturities but they have much reduced
9 interest rates. And so we will do whatever is more
10 cost-effective for the District to move forward.
11 The second thing we'll ask folks to vote on
12 is stormwater. The proposal in front of the voters
13 will be whether or not to implement a 10 cent
14 District-wide property tax. If you vote yes, you
15 will have the scenario I presented before, thus
16 being able to do O&M work on the storm system
17 District-wide, the changes in stormwater costs
18 between the green, yellow and red area and we would
19 then move forward with those services.
20 If the voters vote no, we will maintain the
21 current stormwater service levels that we're
22 currently providing. Those votes, again, will occur
23 in 2016. Exactly when they will occur has yet to be
24 determined. Whether we would vote on them on the
25 same day is yet to be determined. But when they do
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1 come around and the vote is up, MSD will go out and
2 we will not advocate but we will provide the same
3 information to everybody to let them know what the
4 results are of a yes vote and what the result is of
5 a no vote, so they can make as educated of a vote as
6 possible.
7 That ends MSD's presentation. As the Rate
8 Commission previously mentioned, they will open the
9 floor for any public comment that you wish to make
10 to the Rate Commission and I'll turn the meeting
11 back over to Mr. Schneider.
12 MR. SCHNEIDER: Okay. So now we're open
13 up for public comment. I will -- we have the
14 sign-in sheet here, so we'll take the public comment
15 in order of people who signed in. I apologize if I
16 mispronounce any names here but I'll just read them
17 off to see if you have a comment. You can come
18 forward or just stand I guess. I don't think you
19 need to come forward as long as we can hear you.
20 Beverly Thomas Kapedy? Do you have a
21 comment?
22 MS. KAPEDY: No.
23 MR. SCHNEIDER: Fran Jammel?
24 MS. AMMEL: Ammel.
25 MR. SCHNEIDER: Could you stand? Do you
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1 mind standing?
2 MS. AMMEL: I live along Sappington
3 Creek where the erosion is awful. I think unless
4 you live in an area where you have stormwater
5 erosion people don't understand the impact on the
6 personal property of the residents. We have to buy
7 flood insurance because of it.
8 And I'm just wondering how you're going to
9 get people who don't have that kind of impact on
10 their personal property to understand why this
11 personal property tax is important for everybody
12 because if my property goes down in value so is
13 everybody else's property.
14 I think if I had to sell my house right now
15 it would be hard to do to get a good price because,
16 one, you can see the erosion in my yard. Two, they
17 know nobody is doing anything about it. Thirty
18 years ago I was told that in the next 20 years that
19 problem would be fixed and it's worse than ever.
20 And I'm still being told by MSD, because
21 they're doing sewer through my backyard now, that
22 there's still no money for that, the plans are there
23 but nothing is going to be done about it in the very
24 near future.
25 How are you going to tell the general public
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1 how important this is for everybody? Because, you
2 know, my property value I'm sure is not what it
3 should be. You know, if I had to sell my house and
4 people know I have to pay flood insurance of upwards
5 a hundred dollars a month because of this problem,
6 it's going to impact more than just me. It's going
7 to impact my neighbors and the general area that I
8 live in.
9 MR. HOELSCHER: Mr. Schneider, if you'd
10 like, I can go over the past communication MSD has
11 done and will do specifically around this Rate
12 Commission if that would be worthwhile.
13 MR. SCHNEIDER: Yeah, sure.
14 MR. HOELSCHER: And I think it had to do
15 with informing people what this issue is.
16 MS. AMMEL: Well, the people that it
17 doesn't directly impact.
18 MR. HOELSCHER: Yes, correct. The issue
19 does impact everybody, I will tell you that. We
20 started with communications with the local municipal
21 governments about two years ago. While not
22 everybody's problem is the same, one of the biggest
23 issues in that red area you saw, which do they have
24 stormwater problems, inlets are not being fixed,
25 sinkholes are still remaining, erosion is happening
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1 at the end of storm sewers, so while it looks
2 different there is a problem everywhere but it is an
3 issue of who really feels the impact.
4 So we started communications with the
5 government officials about a year and a half ago.
6 MSD did that. Prior to the start, right after we
7 submitted the Rate Proposal, we had a series of
8 meetings like this throughout the entire District to
9 help people understand what it was we were
10 proposing.
11 MS. AMMEL: But look how many people are
12 here.
13 MR. HOELSCHER: Yes. Yeah, that is
14 difficult. You have these Rate Commission hearings.
15 Our board meetings are public. We will go out --
16 and in the vein of what you asked, people start
17 actually having interest as a whole when something
18 is going to show up on a ballot. MSD will provide
19 communications at that time as well to help explain
20 to everybody what's going on.
21 Probably a lot more than we have in the past
22 you will find us on TV. You will find us on the
23 radio, written press, social media. I think some of
24 you may have seen the billboards that we've taken
25 out for these meetings. And, I agree, you can see
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1 by the attendance sometimes it's hard to reach
2 people. We're doing everything we can under every
3 possible source to try and get to people and help
4 them understand what this issue is.
5 MS. AMMEL: Well, I'm here because it
6 directly affects me but, typical of most people, if
7 it doesn't directly affect them, why bother? So
8 that's why maybe all of us are here but there aren't
9 very many people that think it's an issue at this
10 point.
11 And I guess another question is I've read
12 where there are grants for things along the
13 stormwater creeks to work in conjunction with
14 Missouri Botanical Gardens. What can I do? And
15 I've asked someone from MSD from the creek
16 maintenance to come out and talk to me. I had that
17 phone call a week or so ago and he was supposed to
18 get back to me last week to set up a time. I want
19 to know what I can do, myself, to prevent further
20 erosion until you guys can do something.
21 He never called me back, so I've yet to meet
22 with anybody but I would very much like for someone
23 to come out and look at my problem and tell me can I
24 do anything as a property owner. I've been told
25 it's going to take approval of the Army Corps of
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1 Engineers and two other entities to get approval to
2 do anything but I need to know what I can do until
3 you guys can do something.
4 MR. HOELSCHER: I apologize it has taken
5 so long to get back. After the meeting if John --
6 is Mr. Sprague here -- he's our director of
7 operations, give him your name and number. We'll
8 make sure we get back with you. That is one of the
9 things we want to do, is while there isn't funding,
10 under that 2 cent fund we are able to go out and
11 tell folks here's some of the things you can do on
12 your own and we'll make sure we get back to you for
13 that.
14 MR. SCHNEIDER: Thank you for your
15 comments. Next on the list is Sharon Bertram. Any
16 comments?
17 MS. BERTRAM: Well, thank you for having
18 this meeting and I'm glad that all of us are here
19 that are here. It is truly sad that there aren't
20 more people to attend these meetings. And, you
21 know, just by chance I found this in the local South
22 County paper and, you know, it's like where is the
23 publicity about this? It needs to be out in
24 newspaper and I know people don't read whatever but,
25 I mean, this is important stuff.
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1 Okay. And so my eyes perked up when I saw,
2 oh, as of 2015 July 1, single-family homepayer will
3 pay $40.72. Yikes. That's a big increase. So now
4 I understand that that's part of the previous
5 increase. Okay. But that really isn't stated quite
6 effectively enough in this. It's really not, to me,
7 it's not. It kind of all got lumped together.
8 And then I read that in two more years my
9 rate is going to go up $20. Five dollars a year.
10 Okay, that's a big increase. Laclede Gas is getting
11 $7 more each month from me. Ameren asked for 10.
12 They're only getting $7 more a month. You know, and
13 granted it's all good stuff, we need the work, but,
14 you know, can't you get together and talk about
15 this? I mean, if I was just on social security I
16 would be apoplectic and be having anxiety attacks.
17 You can't do this to people. It just seems
18 suddenly. You know, like $5 a year is not bad but
19 now I find out I'm going to be paying $13 more each
20 month next month right away.
21 I just think something has got to be -- can't
22 you -- can't those Ameren, you, Laclede Gas, get
23 together and talk about it? I mean, good grief,
24 that's 12, 19, almost a $30 increase each month that
25 is either present or coming, you know, next month.
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1 I mean that's a lot of money for people on fixed
2 incomes and I don't -- you know, I think a lot of
3 this board-people stuff, I don't think you realize
4 what that does to people in the trenches. You know,
5 that's a couple cans of soup each month. That might
6 be a meal that people would divide in half.
7 Perhaps you might want to go to church
8 meetings, civic meetings, you know, to try to get
9 this word out because I think this is really
10 important stuff. And, you know, I'm understanding a
11 lot more now than I did previously. So I think what
12 I'm understanding is like I'm paying something each
13 month for stormwater and wastewater, also, I'm
14 paying on my property tax bill that I get each year.
15 Okay, so I got that new understanding today. Thank
16 you.
17 Also, when is this bond issue going to be put
18 on the ballot?
19 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah, I think I
20 indicated there will be an election sometime in
21 Calendar 2016. We have to wait for the whole entire
22 process to end. Exactly what date it will be, we
23 don't know now, but there will be a lot of community
24 education on the part of MSD and lot of advertising
25 as to when that's put on the ballot.
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1 MR. SCHNEIDER: Mr. Hoelscher, wouldn't
2 it be fair to say it would be probably more in the
3 April/June time frame?
4 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah, true. Probably
5 April is the first time, April 2016.
6 MS. BERTRAM: Please don't put it on in
7 August when, you know, maybe 11 percent of people
8 vote. I think it has to be much more of a fair
9 representation.
10 MR. SCHNEIDER: Right now this is the
11 Rate Commission process, we review the Rate Proposal
12 and then it goes to the Board of Trustees. As
13 Mr. Hoelscher said, that's kind of a January/March
14 time frame for the Board of Trustees.
15 MS. BERTRAM: That sounds sensible. And
16 I've been active in working -- well, either with or
17 against Ameren in the wastewater or the -- what they
18 put into the river from the Meramec plant and so
19 when you said the water is treated with chemicals
20 and put into the Mississippi, I certainly hope that
21 the chemicals you're using to treat the wastewater
22 are, you know, positive, good chemicals that aren't
23 destroying our river water as opposed to what Ameren
24 is doing with coal ash.
25 MR. HOELSCHER: I will let you know
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1 we're governed by EPA on what we can discharge.
2 What we discharge is cleaner than the Mississippi
3 River we discharge into.
4 MS. BERTRAM: Glad to hear that. Thank
5 you. I just urge -- you know, it's all good stuff,
6 we know we got to take cake of the water and that
7 but, you know, big increases just cause panic among
8 people. Luckily I have a pension in addition to my
9 social security but it's still a lot of money, still
10 a lot to think of.
11 And, you know, I think emphasizing that, you
12 know, the $15 increase or whatever is a result of
13 the previous -- you know, it's the end of the
14 previous year, couple years of upgrading, okay, so
15 it's not connected to the new proposal that you're
16 talking about. Thank you.
17 MR. SCHNEIDER: Thank you for your
18 comment. Thank you very much.
19 Joseph Haberstroh?
20 MR. HABERSTROH: Yeah, I would like to
21 know, you know, right to her, we're seeing all of
22 this for the residents, what about all the
23 businesses and stuff? We never hear, what are they
24 paying? These apartment complexes, the malls, the
25 runoff, the schools, everything, those pay a decent
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1 thing. Some of them with their taxing fund.
2 Churches, everybody, what are they paying? What
3 percentage are you getting from them? Why are we so
4 high?
5 You say it's going to go up, I got two of my
6 bills, mine is $48 right now. I have no stormwater
7 sewers around my home or anything. That's getting
8 expensive. Every month you come in, you know, you
9 go, "God, sewer, $48. Do I use that much?"
10 You see the water company, less than a penny
11 per gallon, you know, a cent for eight gallons or
12 so. I mean, you don't inform the people what are
13 the other places paying, what's all happening with
14 this money. Why are we proposed to do it all? You
15 know, they say there's a million people in St. Louis
16 County, what about the businesses?
17 MR. HOELSCHER: I think if you look on
18 our Rate Proposal -- for this presentation purposes,
19 since most of the folks attending are residents, we
20 have given you the residential number. Businesses,
21 factories, all of those folks have an equivalent
22 increase and in some cases more because of the type
23 of waste they discharge. So while we're referencing
24 individuals, if you look into the Rate Proposal we
25 give the average increases which will be identical
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1 for businesses as well.
2 And I think, just so you understand, we gave
3 average costs. If your current bill is $48 per
4 month for wastewater that's based on the amount of
5 potable water you use during the winter. So we're
6 basing that on how much water you're actually using
7 that then would go down the sewer.
8 MR. HABERSTROH: And I understand that
9 but then all of sudden they start saying you're
10 using GPS now to measure our roofs, our driveways
11 and everything. I want to tear my asphalt up and
12 put all gravel where it runs into the ground, tape
13 my roof up, you know, get rid of my gutters.
14 The City for years has been running water
15 into the sewer system, now they can't. You're
16 changing. No more. They have to put lift stations
17 from the basement to the sewage out in the street.
18 Why are we paying? You're saying it's the
19 wastewater, you know, potable. I'm being charged on
20 that then. What's the cost? Why do you rate
21 something on what they have? My house, each one, on
22 potable water, why do you measure at that time? Put
23 a meter on my house, is what you need to do, and
24 charge me by the meter like the water company does
25 then.
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1 MR. HOELSCHER: And that's what we do
2 with your --
3 MR. HABERSTROH: But you're using their
4 meter.
5 MR. HOELSCHER: We're using their winter
6 water --
7 MR. HABERSTROH: And their winter water
8 and everything.
9 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah, and for the
10 average residential customer whatever potable water
11 goes in, goes down the sewer system. And we use the
12 winter quarter so that we're not picking up things
13 such as washing cars, filling swimming pools,
14 watering the grass during the summer. We pick a
15 time period that's accepted throughout the country,
16 that you use the winter usage --
17 MR. HABERSTROH: So I got a lot of boys
18 and I'm flushing the toilet a lot and --
19 MR. HOELSCHER: And that is just for
20 wastewater on that monthly bill.
21 MR. SCHNEIDER: Okay. Again, thank you
22 for your comment.
23 John Judd?
24 MR. JUDD: Yes. Hi. First, I would
25 like to ask a question, if you could shed any light
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1 on it. If you go right up here to Tesson Ferry,
2 take a left on Musick, there's a street called Meath
3 and I'm speaking on behalf of friends over there.
4 And in back of them must be some kind of
5 tributary that leads into Gravois Creek but -- and
6 maybe this lady in front of me can shed some light
7 on this too. So the question is all these folks are
8 coming to me and they're saying, "Why are we being
9 charged like we're in a floodplain?"
10 And I would like someone here to try to shed
11 some light on that subject if they can for me
12 because their houses are way up here on Meath and
13 the creek is way, way back there and these folks are
14 on limited income and they're being charged for
15 being in a floodplain when, I mean, a 500-year flood
16 isn't going to cause them any problems but I know
17 that their homeowner insurance is charging them.
18 But I would like to ask if anybody here can
19 shed any light on how something like that --
20 MS. AMMEL: It never used to be. I've
21 been there 30 some-odd years. It was never a
22 floodplain and all of a sudden it is if you finance
23 your house you have to have flood insurance. I'm
24 paying my house down as fast as I can so I don't
25 have to pay it. I'm never going to flood. I'm
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1 confident, the way that creek flows. It's never
2 come into my yard. Never. Ever. And it flows like
3 a small river down there.
4 But I think it's all political and it's a
5 good way for the government to say, okay, all you
6 guys are in a flood zone now and you have to pay
7 this money to FEMA. I'd really love for somebody to
8 come out and do an independent evaluation on that
9 creek for everybody that lives along there because
10 we all have the same complaint about that.
11 MR. HOELSCHER: I think two things.
12 One, and this is difficult, MSD does not own or
13 maintain creeks to start. Except for a major part
14 of River Des Peres, they are owned by either the
15 property owners or the subdivisions or something
16 like that.
17 With regard to the floodplain area, that
18 is -- that whole issue is managed by the floodplain
19 managers, which are the individual municipalities or
20 the counties. So the issues you're addressing are
21 issues that are managed and addressed by them. It
22 is not managed by MSD.
23 So after the meeting, if you want, we can
24 even take information and try to get you to the
25 right person, depending on where you live, in the
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1 county or in the individual municipality, whoever
2 has taken over floodplain management and we can get
3 to you the individuals to talk to in those
4 government entities.
5 MR. JUDD: Okay. Thank you.
6 MR. HOELSCHER: Rich -- and the
7 gentleman to talk to is the gentleman here in the
8 green jacket.
9 MR. JUDD: Okay. The second question is
10 Mattese Creek crosses Theiss, goes under Theiss and
11 runs along Theiss and goes back under Theiss and it
12 looks like somebody is going to be working on
13 something over there. So I guess I'll have to get
14 with someone and ask specifically if MSD is going to
15 be doing work on that. And, again, you said you
16 don't have anything to do with creeks?
17 MR. HOELSCHER: Well, we mentioned we
18 can go -- we don't necessarily own creeks but we
19 can, if allowed, collect funds to help resolve some
20 of the stormwater issues even though they're not
21 ours. The issue you're just mentioning about what's
22 going on there, the same gentleman in the green
23 jacket, Mr. Unverferth, he can take your information
24 and whether it's MSD or somebody else, we probably
25 at least have some permitting authority and we can
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1 probably shed light on who's doing the work.
2 MR. JUDD: Okay. And I also wanted to
3 ask, a couple years ago you were shedding some light
4 on how you could get one of these barrels to collect
5 your stormwater, are you still in that communication
6 process of how you can get one of these barrels?
7 MR. HOELSCHER: We're not selling rain
8 barrels now but I would ask that you talk to the
9 gentleman in the green jacket again -- or I'm sorry,
10 Rich. Where are we talking about? Are you in
11 the -- well, you've told me along Sappington Creek.
12 MR. JUDD: Well, I don't know. I might
13 be red but I'll get with you after.
14 MR. HOELSCHER: Mention to us what your
15 issue is because there's potentially a lot of other
16 things going on with downspouts from the roofs and
17 I'll even ask you to get with me or Rich and we'll
18 just kind of look to see what your situation is.
19 We're not selling rain barrels anymore right
20 now. They are, in fact, commercially available for
21 almost less than --
22 MR. LeCOMB: Yeah, we couldn't beat the
23 cost anymore. We sold them at our cost and we
24 couldn't beat the big box stores anymore.
25 MR. HOELSCHER: So they actually are
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1 able to sell them for cheaper than what we were able
2 to sell them for. So they're still available
3 commercially but I think with regard to the whole
4 issue of your downspouts we would want to talk to
5 you in case there's other parts of the program that
6 might impact you in the future.
7 MR. JUDD: Okay. Thank you.
8 MR. SCHNEIDER: Thank you for your
9 comments.
10 D. McArthy?
11 MR. McARTHY: I think you already
12 answered it. They're based on -- our bills are
13 based on water usage?
14 MR. HOELSCHER: Right, the monthly
15 wastewater bill is, yes.
16 MR. McARTHY: Is there a calculation
17 that you use based on that to figure the bill? Like
18 if I go to St. Louis County for my tax bill they can
19 give me a formula that they use, using their
20 assessment. Do you have that and, if so, is it
21 available on the website --
22 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah, and I think --
23 MR. McARTHY: -- so a person could
24 actually kind of figure out because I own rental
25 property in addition to my own home.
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1 MR. HOELSCHER: I think the person to
2 talk to on that -- Theresa, raise your hand if you
3 would -- Theresa Bellville, she's our assistant
4 director of finance. She's right here. If you talk
5 to her afterwards she can show you where you go and
6 how we do the calculations. They all derive from
7 your usage and the rates per usage that come out of
8 this Rate Commission process and she can describe
9 that to you.
10 MR. McARTHY: Okay. The other thing is
11 I own rental property in Arnold, which is connected
12 to you guys now. They proposed a rate freeze.
13 MR. HOELSCHER: I think our relationship
14 with the City of Arnold, who is outside of our
15 District, we do have an agreement with them to treat
16 their wastewater and that is solely our -- that's
17 solely our interaction with the City of Arnold.
18 They are an independent entity so we are contracted
19 to treat their wastewater and they pay us a cost to
20 do that. But as far as the operation of the system
21 itself --
22 MR. McARTHY: Is it a contracted price?
23 MR. HOELSCHER: That we have with
24 Arnold?
25 MR. McARTHY: Yes, sir.
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1 MR. HOELSCHER: Yeah, it's our cost plus
2 10 percent for management costs and they are billed
3 that monthly.
4 MS. MYERS: It's based on flow.
5 MR. McARTHY: I was going to say I know
6 what the City of Arnold is charging for sewers.
7 MR. HOELSCHER: Well, so what we charge
8 them is we have a meter at their pipe that goes into
9 our plant at the -- near the Meramec and then we
10 meter that and we charge them our actual cost per --
11 MR. McARTHY: Do you have any other
12 situations like Arnold?
13 MR. HOELSCHER: Arnold is the only one.
14 MR. McARTHY: That's pretty much it.
15 MR. SCHNEIDER: Good. Thank you for
16 your comments. That is the people who signed-in to
17 the clipboard. Are there any others who have
18 comments?
19 MR. JUDD: Yeah, one more. When it
20 comes to a vote, do you just need a simple majority
21 District-wide?
22 MR. SCHNEIDER: I believe that's the
23 case, simple majority. Any other comments for
24 the -- do the Rate Commissioners have any comments?
25 Okay. Well, seeing none, I would like to
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1 thank you all for coming out today and learning more
2 about the Rate Proposal and I thank Mr. Hoelscher
3 and the staff of MSD for this rate hearing.
4 The next public hearing will be conducted on
5 May 19, 2015 at 6 p.m. at the Carondelet Park Rec
6 Complex, so spread the word out. There's one, two,
7 three, there's four more public hearings that are
8 going on in the community all the way up June 9th,
9 so check the MSD website. Is it stlmsd.com?
10 MR. HOELSCHER: As well as there are
11 flyers we're handing out that have those dates on it
12 as well, if you pick one of those up on the back
13 table.
14 MR. SCHNEIDER: Again, thank you very
15 much for your time. Thank you very much Rate
16 Commissioners for being here. We're adjourned.
17 - - - - -
18 (Hearing concluded at 11:09 a.m.)
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1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
2 I, Suzanne Zes, within and for the State
3 of Missouri, do hereby certify that the witness
4 whose testimony appears in the foregoing deposition
5 was duly sworn by me; the testimony of said witness
6 was taken by me to the best of my ability and
7 thereafter reduced to typewriting under my
8 direction; that I am neither counsel for, related
9 to, nor employed by any of the parties to the action
10 in which this deposition was taken, and further that
11 I am not a relative or employee of any attorney or
12 counsel employed by the parties thereto, nor
13 financially or otherwise interested in the outcome
14 of the action.
15
16 ______________________________
17 Certified Court Reporter
18
19
20
21
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25
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A
AA 16:16,20,21
AAA 16:20
AA1 16:21
ability 29:2 61:6
able 23:6 26:5
27:2 29:20 30:7
31:24 32:23
39:16 45:10
57:1,1
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accomplishme...
14:10
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action 61:9,14
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10:20 14:19
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23:6 49:8 57:25
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36:1,12 38:2,2
38:4,7,11
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15:2 26:1 27:14
27:16,19 28:21
32:24
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6:14
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47:24
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43:5 44:17 56:3
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32:12,24
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28:19
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6:15
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48:17,23
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40:24 41:2
42:16 43:11
44:5 53:20
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24:11,12 29:16
29:16 51:4
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22:7 24:21 25:2
25:7 34:18 35:2
35:17 36:14,23
38:19
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18:18
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32:17
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31:22
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56:23,24
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45:4
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19:22
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6:20
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22:19
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13:21
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45:1
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13:16
approximately
11:2 13:18 17:3
20:7 21:1 22:7
27:10 28:17
29:12 31:8
34:13,15,21
35:6,16,21
36:21
April 48:5,5
April/June 48:3
area 11:7 12:10
15:6 20:22
21:24 22:3,5,9
22:11,21,23,24
23:8,15,18,21
24:17,23 25:4
25:11,16 26:3,8
26:9,10,14,15
27:6 28:10 29:9
31:1,6,10,12,13
31:14,21,22
32:9,11,22,23
33:4,6,11 34:6
34:15,20,21,23
34:25 35:9,12
35:14,20 39:18
41:4 42:7,23
54:17
areas 12:5 23:10
28:3 31:12 34:4
Army 44:25
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58:17,24 59:6
59:12,13
ash 48:24
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44:15 46:11
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17:10 32:13
37:23,25
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36:25
assistant 58:3
Association 6:19
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35:25 36:11
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August 6:9 37:10
48:7
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17:22,25 20:16
21:11,20 36:1
36:13 38:3,8
55:25
authorization
17:11 20:15
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35:25 36:12
38:1,7,11,15
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18:1
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56:20 57:2,21
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20:24 21:16,21
24:14,15,20
25:2,6 34:7,8
34:10,12,22
35:1,2,4,12,13
35:17 36:4,14
36:23 38:9 39:2
50:25 51:3
52:10
averaging 34:22
awful 41:3
a.m 1:10 60:18
B
B 21:9
back 8:11,11
9:19 30:25
38:13 40:11
44:18,21 45:5,8
45:12 53:4,13
55:11 60:12
backups 14:23
15:11
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27:19 41:21
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10:8
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47:18,25
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56:19
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14:16 24:3 51:4
57:12,13,17
59:4
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15:11 51:17
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29:5 59:22
Bellville 58:3
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Bertram 2:8
30:14 31:2
45:15,17 48:6
48:15 49:4
best 15:25 18:18
26:19 61:6
Beverly 2:6
40:20
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big 12:10 46:3,10
49:7 56:24
bigger 16:2
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bill 11:24,25
12:17,19 20:20
21:17 22:6,8
23:1,2,3 24:8
24:21 25:3,8
34:9,11,12,14
34:16,19,24
35:2,4,7,15,17
35:19 47:14
51:3 52:20
57:15,17,18
billboards 43:24
billed 59:2
billion 16:25
17:3,16,21 18:2
20:17 21:13
bills 33:25 50:6
57:12
bit 16:10 31:15
black 27:6
block 15:17
blue 19:1 26:13
board 4:16 6:4,8
13:7,9,16 19:14
37:10,11 43:15
48:12,14
board-people
47:3
bond 16:16,20,21
17:9,21 18:3
47:17
bonding 17:12
17:22,25 20:16
21:11,20 36:1
36:12 38:2,7,11
38:15
bonds 21:12 38:5
38:24 39:2,4,6
borrow 38:13,20
borrowed 18:4
borrowing 39:5
Botanical 44:14
bother 44:7
bottom 10:3
19:21,21 20:8
22:3
boundaries
11:11,12 30:21
30:22
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5:9
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boys 52:17
Branch 1:5 2:23
break 5:5
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brief 7:11
bring 18:1
bringing 37:6
broken 17:1
27:14 34:4
budget 13:24,25
14:5 18:5
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building 16:9
businesses 49:23
50:16,20 51:1
busted 27:13
buy 38:10,11
41:6
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calculation 57:16
calculations 58:6
Calendar 47:21
call 44:17
called 8:5 44:21
53:2
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capacity 15:10
16:11
capital 10:16
13:19,22 16:25
17:20 18:4
20:18 21:13
28:19,21 38:3
capture 12:7
car 38:10
care 26:12,21,22
Carondelet 60:5
cars 52:13
case 27:21 57:5
59:23
cases 16:9 18:3
18:19 50:22
cash 17:18,19
20:14 21:10
cause 15:11
25:25 49:7
53:16
causes 27:18
causing 15:10
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23:3,16,16,17
23:19 24:17,18
24:24,24,24
25:5,5,5,6,15
25:20 26:5,11
27:2 28:13
31:17,25 32:3
33:4,9,11,11,12
33:14,21,24
34:1 39:13
45:10 50:11
cents 32:17
certainly 48:20
CERTIFICATE
61:1
Certified 2:24
61:17
certify 61:3
Chamber 3:4 5:7
chance 45:21
change 5:21 6:16
7:25 8:16 10:12
10:24 28:12
35:19
changes 4:13
5:21 6:6 13:5
28:24 33:20
39:17
changing 51:16
channels 11:5
23:9 27:9
charge 22:5
33:24 51:24
59:7,10
charged 51:19
53:9,14
charging 53:17
59:6
chart 21:25
29:11 36:22
Charter 4:10,16
cheaper 16:1
57:1
cheapest 15:12
check 60:9
checking 26:25
chemicals 48:19
48:21,22
church 47:7
Churches 50:2
circles 29:25 30:1
cities 21:7
city 5:4,18 12:10
28:7 32:5 51:14
58:14,17 59:6
civic 47:8
cleaner 49:2
cleaning 20:6
clear 15:2 32:3
clipboard 8:11
8:12 59:17
closed 9:15
coal 48:24
collapses 15:18
collect 11:16
22:11 31:13
55:19 56:4
collected 12:1
25:20
collecting 33:8
33:14
collection 24:4
color 30:17
colored 34:4
column 20:13
36:1,11
columns 35:24
come 25:21 29:19
32:12 40:1,17
40:19 44:16,23
50:8 54:2,8
58:7
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coming 14:21
46:25 53:8 60:1
comment 8:1,3
40:9,13,14,17
40:21 49:18
52:22
comments 9:9,11
9:17 37:17,18
37:20,21 45:15
45:16 57:9
59:16,18,23,24
commercially
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4:21
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4:4,8,12,19,20
5:2,20,23 6:2,2
6:7,11,15,23
7:18 9:6,8 13:1
13:4,16 37:4,13
37:16,18,21
40:8,10 42:12
43:14 48:11
58:8
Commissioners
59:24 60:16
Commission's
13:8 37:9
communication
42:10 56:5
communications
42:20 43:4,19
community
47:23 60:8
community-nei...
4:25
company 50:10
51:24
compare 36:22
complaint 54:10
complete 31:6
completed 10:22
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Complex 60:6
complexes 49:24
comply 10:17
22:10
components
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concluded 60:18
concluding 7:17
Conclusion 2:12
concrete 27:8
conduct 13:7
conducted 7:5,16
60:4
Conference 7:2,7
7:8,9
conferences 7:22
confident 54:1
conjunction
44:13
connected 49:15
58:11
Consent 10:14,19
13:24 15:3,4
18:14 20:19
21:7,14
consider 11:1,13
17:11 20:15
37:4,24
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considering
37:12
consist 22:16
31:5
consists 5:2
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construction
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consultant 6:12
7:1
Consumers 6:20
contained 7:21
contains 9:24
continue 16:5
continues 16:7,8
contracted 58:18
58:22
conveyance
18:15
copy 10:2 19:13
19:14 30:5,9
Corps 44:25
correct 24:5
28:13 42:18
cost 16:23 17:6
17:13 19:7 20:8
20:9 24:14,21
25:6 29:14,19
30:8 31:23
36:14,20 51:20
56:23,23 58:19
59:1,10
costs 14:3 19:17
20:2,23 25:21
28:16 29:6,9
30:4 36:23,24
38:8,18,18,19
39:17 51:3 59:2
cost-effective
39:10
counsel 6:12 61:8
61:12
counties 54:20
country 21:4
52:15
county 3:9 5:4,19
12:10 28:6,6,6
32:6 45:22
50:16 55:1
57:18
couple 8:9 47:5
49:14 56:3
Court 2:25 3:18
61:17
creek 22:17,18
27:19 41:3
44:15 53:5,13
54:1,9 55:10
56:11
creeks 12:4,13,15
26:3,14,15,17
44:13 54:13
55:16,18
crosses 55:10
culminating 17:2
21:20
current 6:1 21:23
22:1 33:17
35:22 36:3
39:21 51:3
currently 5:2
13:15 16:20
27:13 28:11
31:11 33:17
34:20 35:13
39:22
customer 20:24
24:14,20 25:2
35:23 36:4,14
36:16,19,25
52:10
customers 11:23
customer's 33:24
cycle 17:23 20:24
D
D 2:1,11 4:1
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date 47:22
dates 7:21 60:11
day 2:22 39:25
debt 17:8,8,13,15
18:1 20:14
December 37:12
decent 49:25
decide 37:13
38:21
decides 38:7
deciding 21:10
decision 13:10
37:6 38:10,20
decrease 34:15
Decree 10:14,19
13:24 15:3,4
18:14 20:19
21:14
Decrees 21:7
deem 8:18
deficiency 28:14
Department
10:15 21:14
depending 12:19
21:5 23:17
24:10 33:5
54:25
deposition 61:4
61:10
derive 58:6
Des 54:14
describe 29:22
58:8
described 13:3
23:21 28:24
describes 30:2,3
describing 7:9
description 7:11
19:6 22:1 25:13
design 18:14
destroying 48:23
details 19:25
28:14
determined
39:24,25
development
25:25
difference 32:13
different 12:20
24:11 43:2
difficult 19:2
43:14 54:12
direction 61:8
directly 17:19
24:12 42:17
44:6,7
director 3:12 9:1
9:4 45:6 58:4
discharge 11:20
27:17 49:1,2,3
50:23
discharged 15:21
discovery 6:24
discussed 35:10
disposing 28:8
District 1:1 2:20
4:4,10,13,15,23
7:24 8:2,22
11:1,11 14:18
16:14 24:10,15
27:3 29:3 32:16
39:10 43:8
58:15
districts 32:2
33:6
District's 4:18
5:22
District-wide
25:21 26:6 28:4
28:13,23 29:21
33:14,18,21
39:14,17 59:21
divide 47:6
document 9:24
10:20
documents 7:4
7:10 19:3
doing 14:24
24:25 25:17
41:17,21 44:2
48:24 55:15
56:1
dollar 38:12
dollars 27:22
31:24 32:21
34:3 35:7,8,21
38:13 42:5 46:9
dollar-wise 32:4
door 8:19
dot 19:1,4 26:18
doubling 29:15
downspouts
56:16 57:4
downstream
25:25
drains 11:17
drive 1:6 2:23
12:9 28:5
driven 14:3 21:6
driver 10:19
drivers 10:11
driveways 51:10
dry 15:24
due 37:9
duly 61:5
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E 2:1 3:1,1 4:1,1
earlier 28:25
educated 40:5
education 47:24
effectively 46:6
eight 50:11
either 9:18 15:8
22:23 30:16,24
31:19,19 46:25
48:16 54:14
election 4:11
47:20
Eleventh 3:22
elimination
10:25
else's 41:13
email 37:19
emergencies
22:16
emergency 22:14
26:4
emphasizing
49:11
employed 61:9
61:12
employee 61:11
ends 40:7
Energy 6:20
engaged 6:11,24
Engineers 45:1
ensure 4:17
enter 18:24
entered 21:7
entering 18:17
entire 9:22 29:3
43:8 47:21
entities 45:1 55:4
entity 58:18
environment
15:6 18:24
environmental
4:24
EPA 10:14 21:15
49:1
equipment 18:6
equivalent 50:21
Eric 3:3 4:3
erode 32:20
erosion 22:17,18
23:13,24 25:12
27:18 28:22
32:8 41:3,5,16
42:25 44:20
especially 19:3
established 4:12
13:2
estimating 17:5
evaluation 54:8
eventually 32:20
everybody 12:19
12:20 21:3 40:3
41:11,13 42:1
42:19 43:20
50:2 54:9
everybody's
42:22
exactly 19:16
33:17 39:23
47:22
examined 2:20
executive 3:12
9:1,4
exhibits 2:16
exist 33:13
expand 8:17
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expensive 50:8
explain 21:23
43:19
extension 6:8
extra 31:11 32:21
eyes 46:1
F
facilities 12:6,6
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29:16
facility 29:18
fact 15:5 56:20
factories 50:21
fails 27:15
fair 4:17 48:2,8
fall 22:18
family 20:21
far 14:25 58:20
fast 53:24
faster 38:16
Fax 3:25
February 5:20
6:22 37:4
federal 11:19
21:8 22:10
fee 12:16 22:25
23:16 24:4,17
24:24 25:5
feed 18:22
feels 25:14 27:5
43:3
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Fenton 37:19
Ferry 1:5,6 2:23
2:23 53:1
figure 57:17,24
filed 6:18 7:1
filling 52:13
final 37:7
Finally 35:9
finance 53:22
58:4
financially 16:12
61:13
financing 17:18
17:21
find 11:12 17:10
30:20 43:22,22
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first 15:14 28:21
29:21 32:14
48:5 52:24
Fiscal 20:23
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36:4,13 37:7
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five 14:19 16:1
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flood 41:7 42:4
53:15,23,25
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flooding 23:13
23:24 25:11,25
28:22 32:7
floodplain 53:9
53:15,22 54:17
54:18 55:2
floor 9:9 40:9
flow 12:4 59:4
flows 18:20,22
54:1,2
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52:18
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focus 15:4
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folks 28:9 31:10
33:10 39:11
45:11 50:19,21
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followed 8:3
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foregoing 61:4
forenoon 2:21,22
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37:17,18
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forward 13:11
20:10 37:14
38:22 39:10,19
40:18,19
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four 13:22 14:19
16:1,16 17:1,16
19:2 28:17 60:7
four-year 13:20
16:24 17:6,23
20:18
frame 48:3,14
frames 10:21
Fran 2:7 40:23
freeze 58:12
friends 53:3
front 18:16 19:4
39:12 53:6
full 29:13
function 16:8
functioning
26:24
fund 17:16 20:12
39:7 45:10 50:1
funded 21:9
27:13
funding 11:5
17:17 20:14
23:11,11,13
27:5,24 28:1
45:9
funds 23:22 32:1
32:2 33:17
55:19
further 44:19
61:10
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G
G 4:1
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gallons 50:11
garden 26:19
gardens 26:21
44:14
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general 4:11
41:25 42:7
gentleman 55:7,7
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getting 14:2 15:9
18:16 34:3
46:10,12 50:3,7
give 45:7 50:25
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go 9:23,25 11:17
11:18 13:6
15:13 19:23
24:4,5 27:22
28:14 29:10,22
33:13 35:24
36:9,15 38:8,15
38:19 40:1
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45:10 46:9 47:7
50:5,9 51:7
53:1 55:18
57:18 58:5
God 50:9
goes 15:20 24:4,6
28:15 34:10
41:12 48:12
52:11,11 55:10
55:11 59:8
going 9:4,21,25
10:9,12 19:6,7
25:23 28:20
29:21 30:4
31:18 38:6,18
41:8,23,25 42:6
42:6 43:18,20
44:25 46:9,19
47:17 50:5
53:16,25 55:12
55:14,22 56:16
59:5 60:8
good 4:2 14:12
14:24 41:15
46:13,23 48:22
49:5 54:5 59:15
govern 5:24
governed 49:1
government 21:8
43:5 54:5 55:4
governments
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GPS 51:10
granted 6:21
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grants 44:12
grass 52:14
gravel 51:12
Gravois 53:5
grayed 26:9
grease 15:17
green 23:15,18
25:4,11 26:9,18
30:16 31:6,10
31:12,16,21
33:4,6,10 34:6
39:18 55:8,22
56:9
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ground 12:6
51:12
guess 40:18
44:11 55:13
gutters 51:13
guys 44:20 45:3
54:6 58:12
H
Haberstroh 2:9
49:19,20 51:8
52:3,7,17
half 11:2 27:10
31:23 32:4,5
34:15 36:21,24
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hand 58:2
handing 60:11
happen 27:25
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happening 42:25
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28:15
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49:4,23
hearing 1:2,10
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8:21 9:15 60:3
60:4,18
hearings 7:16,22
43:14 60:7
help 16:19 29:22
43:9,19 44:3
55:19
Hi 52:24
high 50:4
higher 21:6
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3:12 8:24 9:1,2
9:3 24:5 30:19
31:4 39:1 42:9
42:14,18 43:13
45:4 47:19 48:1
48:4,13,25
50:17 52:1,5,9
52:19 54:11
55:6,17 56:7,14
56:25 57:14,22
58:1,13,23 59:1
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home 6:19 22:18
22:19 24:3,3,15
50:7 57:25
homeowner
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homepayer 46:2
hope 48:20
hours 2:21
house 38:11
41:14 42:3
51:21,23 53:23
53:24
housekeeping
8:9
houses 53:12
huge 12:17
hundred 16:6
42:5
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idea 25:17
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identify 8:7
identifying 7:3
immediately
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impact 12:14
20:8,9,20 26:16
34:19 35:23
41:5,9 42:6,7
42:17,19 43:3
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impacts 12:12
implement 39:13
important 41:11
42:1 45:25
47:10
improvement
10:16
improvements
16:9
including 4:23
income 36:18
53:14
incomes 47:2
increase 21:1
29:12,15 35:1,6
35:20 37:5 46:3
46:5,10,24
49:12 50:22
increases 36:8
49:7 50:25
increasing 29:14
independent
6:12 54:8 58:18
indicated 9:12
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indicates 10:20
individual 34:2
54:19 55:1
individuals 11:8
28:2 36:21
50:24 55:3
Industrial 6:20
inflation 32:21
inform 50:12
information 3:14
9:25 10:5,8,9
19:18,25 30:23
40:3 54:24
55:23
informing 42:15
inlet 27:13,14
inlets 11:4 12:8
23:8 27:8 42:24
input 13:3
inside 30:1
inspecting 20:4,5
inspection 14:13
14:14
institution 10:25
institutions 5:3
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insurance 41:7
42:4 53:17,23
interaction 58:17
intercept 18:20
interest 39:9
43:17
interested 4:22
19:15 61:13
intervene 6:17,18
7:14
Intervenors 6:25
introduce 5:5,7
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issue 7:12 15:12
15:15 25:14
27:18 32:1 38:4
39:4 42:15,18
43:3 44:4,9
47:17 54:18
55:21 56:15
57:4
issued 38:25
issues 4:24,24,25
7:3,9 12:25
17:9 22:12
23:12,23 25:18
26:1 27:22
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54:20,21 55:20
items 8:9
J
jacket 55:8,23
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Janice 37:19
January/March
48:13
John 2:10 45:5
52:23
joint 27:15
Joseph 2:9 49:19
Judd 2:10 52:23
52:24 55:5,9
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judgment 13:10
July 13:13 37:6
46:2
June 6:3 7:17
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60:8
Justice 10:15
21:15
K
Kapedy 2:6
40:20,22
keep 38:12
keeping 18:17
key 16:15
kind 24:16 25:13
26:11 27:18
29:21,25 31:19
41:9 46:7 48:13
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57:24
kinds 18:10
know 19:2 30:17
30:17,25 40:3
41:17 42:2,3,4
44:19 45:2,21
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47:2,4,8,10,23
48:7,22,25 49:5
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50:11,15 51:13
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56:12 59:5
L
labor 4:24
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lady 53:6
laid 25:24
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large 14:12 18:20
lawsuit 10:14
leads 53:5
League 3:6,9 5:9
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learning 60:1
leaving 33:16
LeComb 3:13
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left 17:23 53:2
left-hand 20:13
35:24 36:2
legal 6:11
let's 15:16
levels 39:21
Library 1:5 2:23
lift 51:16
light 52:25 53:6
53:11,19 56:1,3
limit 8:17
limited 53:14
Lin 1:6 2:23
line 15:18 20:8
lines 26:13 27:7
list 8:6 45:15
LITIGATION
3:21
little 16:10 26:13
31:15
live 12:20 21:6
22:4,24 23:15
23:18 24:10,16
24:23 25:4 28:3
28:9 31:10 33:3
34:6,20 35:9
41:2,4 42:8
54:25
lives 54:9
local 11:10,20
12:13 26:3 28:5
42:20 45:21
located 8:19
18:12 26:14
locations 7:21
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long 38:24 40:19
45:5
longer 33:13
look 19:20,24
20:13 26:13
29:23 30:6,10
30:11,23 37:15
43:11 44:23
50:17,24 56:18
looked 10:7
looking 19:15
27:23 39:3
looks 21:18,24
26:7 43:1 55:12
lot 34:19 43:21
47:1,2,11,23,24
49:9,10 52:17
52:18 56:15
Louis 1:1,7 2:19
2:24 3:4,6,9,23
5:4,6,18,19
6:19 7:19,20
12:9,10 20:21
50:15 57:18
love 54:7
low 36:18
lower 38:12
Luckily 49:8
lumped 46:7
Lutheran 3:7
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M
M 2:24
machines 11:17
mail 37:20
main 9:10 10:23
15:4,7 16:23
25:14
maintain 16:13
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22:20 23:7,21
25:1 28:18
29:17 39:20
54:13
maintaining
25:10 29:8
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Mark 3:7 4:9
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MIDWEST 3:21
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20:5,6,7 26:15
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14:6,7 17:6,7
17:12,17,22,25
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48:20 49:2
Missouri 1:7
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11:21 39:6
44:14 61:3
MO 3:23
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money 12:1 39:5
41:22 47:1 49:9
50:14 54:7
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27:20 32:12
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people 40:15
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qualify 36:20,25
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25:18 26:1,2,21
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S 3:1 4:1
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sampling 26:2
sanitary 18:12
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25:1,10 27:7,9
27:10,15 28:4
28:18,25 29:6
31:18 32:18
39:16 43:1
storms 14:17
stormwater 4:14
5:22 7:25 10:23
12:3,7,14,16,22
12:24 15:8,13
18:17 21:22,24
22:1,11,12,22
23:1,12,23
24:11,13,19
25:18,19 26:16
26:21 27:8 28:8
28:22 29:3,20
32:7,8,22,24,25
33:18,25 34:9
PUBLIC HEARING 5/16/2015
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34:24 35:15,18
36:7,10 39:12
39:17,21 41:4
42:24 44:13
47:13 50:6
55:20 56:5
stream 27:19
streams 12:5,13
12:15 26:3,17
street 3:22 27:16
28:5 30:15
51:17 53:2
streets 11:10
12:9 28:8,9
stuff 45:25 46:13
47:3,10 49:5,23
subdivisions
54:15
subject 53:11
submit 6:16 7:8
37:18
submits 13:6
submitted 7:5
9:6 37:3 43:7
submitting 7:6
sudden 51:9
53:22
suddenly 46:18
suggested 6:6
summation 9:21
33:2
summer 52:14
supposed 15:8
44:17
sure 16:5,7,8,18
18:23 22:13
25:23,24 26:1
26:23 31:4
37:21 42:2,13
45:8,12
Suzanne 2:24
3:20 61:2
swimming 52:13
sworn 61:5
system 11:3,10
12:11 14:8,21
14:23 15:5,9,10
15:14,16,17,20
15:23 16:2,9
18:13,17 23:22
24:19 25:10
27:7,10,12 28:5
28:19 29:1,6,8
31:18 32:15,19
39:16 51:15
52:11 58:20
systems 16:4
18:19 23:8
S&P 16:21
T
table 8:11 60:13
tables 10:5
take 5:5 9:18
22:13 26:13,21
30:11,23 40:14
44:25 49:6 53:2
54:24 55:23
taken 16:15
24:15 26:8,22
43:24 45:4 55:2
61:6,10
takes 26:12
talk 37:15 44:16
46:14,23 55:3,7
56:8 57:4 58:2
58:4
talking 24:1
49:16 56:10
tape 51:12
tax 4:14 11:2
12:19 13:12
22:6,8 23:2,2,3
23:3,17,17,19
24:2,8,18,21,24
24:25 25:2,5,5
25:6,8,16,20
26:5,12 27:2,25
28:13 31:11,17
31:25 32:3,13
32:16 33:5,9,11
33:12,15,20,22
34:1,9,11,12,13
34:14,16,24
35:2,3,4,7,8,15
35:17,19 39:14
41:11 47:14
57:18
taxes 10:25 12:22
12:23 24:6,7
28:15 33:7
34:17 35:22
taxing 31:12,13
31:14 32:2 33:6
50:1
tear 51:11
tell 20:11 38:22
41:25 42:19
44:23 45:11
ten 8:15
Tesson 1:5 2:22
53:1
testimony 6:23
6:25 7:4,6,11
8:10 61:4,5
thank 5:16 9:2
31:3 45:14,17
47:15 49:4,16
49:17,18 52:21
55:5 57:7,8
59:15 60:1,2,14
60:15
Theiss 55:10,10
55:11,11
therefor 7:13
thereon 8:6
Theresa 58:2,3
thereto 61:12
thing 23:11 30:1
39:11 50:1
58:10
things 24:9 27:25
44:12 45:9,11
52:12 54:11
56:16
think 30:19
40:18 41:3,14
42:14 43:23
44:9 46:21 47:2
47:3,9,11,19
48:8 49:10,11
50:17 51:2 54:4
54:11 57:3,11
57:22 58:1,13
Thirty 41:17
Thomas 2:6
40:20
thousand 35:7,21
three 20:25 34:4
35:8 38:13 60:7
time 1:10 7:21
8:18 10:21
13:23 14:5
28:21 29:21
32:20 43:19
44:18 48:3,5,14
51:22 52:15
60:15
times 16:1
today 4:7 7:23
10:10 19:12,15
30:10 37:17
47:15 60:1
toilet 52:18
toilets 11:17
told 41:18,20
44:24 56:11
total 5:17 18:1
tracking 26:2
Traditionally
39:3
treat 11:18 48:21
58:15,19
treated 15:20
18:23 48:19
treatment 11:18
14:12 15:22
18:23 20:3
trenches 47:4
tributary 53:5
true 48:4
truly 45:19
Trustees 4:17 6:4
6:8 13:7,9
37:10,11 48:12
48:14
try 32:22 44:3
47:8 53:10
54:24
tunnels 18:15,21
turn 8:25 40:10
TV 43:22
two 10:11 11:15
14:16 17:17
20:10 21:22
27:25 35:24
41:16 42:21
45:1 46:8 50:5
54:11 60:6
type 22:16 50:22
typewriting 61:7
typical 44:6
U
underground
18:21
understand 41:5
41:10 43:9 44:4
46:4 51:2,8
understanding
47:10,12,15
Unverferth
55:23
upgrading 49:14
upwards 42:4
urge 49:5
usage 52:16
57:13 58:7,7
use 17:15 21:12
28:4,10 32:2,21
50:9 51:5 52:11
52:16 57:17,19
users 4:18,21,22
utilities 11:15
utility 12:3
V
value 24:3 34:7
35:12 41:12
42:2
valued 31:7
values 34:21
various 32:1 33:3
vein 43:16
volume 26:20
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MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES
vote 37:25 39:11
39:14,20,24
40:1,4,5,5 48:8
59:20
voters 3:6 5:10
11:1,13 17:10
17:11 18:1
20:11,15 21:10
35:25 38:20,22
39:12,20
votes 37:15 39:22
W
wait 47:21
want 13:14 16:12
19:23 30:17
32:21 37:20
38:1 44:18 45:9
47:7 51:11
54:23 57:4
wanted 56:2
wants 25:14
washing 11:17
52:13
waste 50:23
wastewater 4:14
5:22 7:25 10:13
10:15 11:16,24
12:25 13:13,14
13:16 14:8,10
14:14 15:4,19
19:12 20:1 22:6
23:1 29:25
33:24 36:6,9
37:5,25 47:13
48:17,21 51:4
51:19 52:20
57:15 58:16,19
water 11:16
12:14 18:16
26:1,2 48:19,23
49:6 50:10 51:5
51:6,14,22,24
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30:21
way 15:12 20:12
23:14 31:19
38:21 53:12,13
53:13 54:1,5
60:8
ways 21:22 37:17
weather 15:15,24
15:24
website 9:23 10:7
19:19 57:21
60:9
week 44:17,18
went 10:6
West 28:6
wet 15:15,24
we'll 4:2 9:19
12:20 28:16
29:17,20 37:20
39:11 40:14
45:7,12 56:17
we're 9:4 11:12
13:12,24 14:2,5
16:18 17:5,7,15
20:25 21:19,25
24:25 26:5 27:2
27:23 29:9,14
29:15 31:22
32:13 33:19
35:5,10 36:8
39:21 40:12
44:2 49:1,21
50:23 51:5 52:5
52:12 53:9 56:7
56:19 60:11,16
we've 14:24
16:14 19:11
24:14,16 26:8
32:10 34:4 39:3
43:24
whichever 38:21
winter 51:5 52:5
52:7,12,16
wish 7:14 8:10
9:13 40:9
wishing 8:4
witness 61:3,5
Women 3:6 5:10
wondering 41:8
word 47:9 60:6
work 13:19,21,23
14:24 17:1,4
18:4 19:8 20:18
21:13 23:5,14
23:21 24:18,25
25:17 28:9
39:16 44:13
46:13 55:15
56:1
working 48:16
55:12
worse 41:19
worth 13:18
16:25 17:3,12
20:17 21:13
worthwhile
42:12
wouldn't 48:1
written 43:23
X
X 2:1
Y
yard 41:16 54:2
Yeah 24:6 30:19
42:13 43:13
47:19 48:4
49:20 52:9
56:22 57:22
59:1,19
year 21:2 22:7
24:21 25:3,7
28:20 29:5,10
29:11 32:14
34:8,11,13,23
35:3,14,16,18
36:5,9,15,16
43:5 46:9,18
47:14 49:14
years 13:22
14:19 16:6,17
17:1,2,16 19:2
20:25 28:18
41:18,18 42:21
46:8 49:14
51:14 53:21
56:3
yellow 22:24
24:23 26:9
30:16 31:22
33:10 34:20,25
39:18
Yikes 46:3
Z
zero 21:12 33:7
Zes 2:24 3:20
61:2
zone 54:6
$
$1.5 16:25 17:3
17:16,21 20:17
21:13
$10 35:21
$10.50 35:14
$100 28:19
$12.50 34:23
$1200 36:15
$13 46:19
$135 21:5
$15 49:12
$16 29:7
$16.10 35:3
$184,500 34:7
$2.62 18:2
$20 34:11 46:9
$200 17:22 21:19
$23 29:11
$24 29:10
$25 31:8
$26 25:3
$266,700 35:13
$3.60 35:1
$30 46:24
$40.72 20:25
21:18 46:3
$415 17:17
$42 34:13
$477 17:7
$48 50:6,9 51:3
$5 46:18
$50 35:16
$522 36:5,15
$53 25:7
$60 38:6
$60.60 35:18
$62 21:2 34:8
$7 46:11,12
$7.5 32:10
$70,800 34:22
$700 14:7
$716 14:6
$736 17:6
$771 36:9
$8 24:21
$890 13:21
$900 17:12,25
20:16 38:2,5
$91 28:17
$96 21:21 38:9
$971 13:18
1
1 13:13 37:6 46:2
1,363 27:9
1.2 35:20
10 21:1 23:18
25:6 28:13
31:17,25 32:3
33:4,11,11,21
34:1 37:10
39:13 46:11
59:2
10th 6:9
10-cent-wide
11:1 32:16
10:02 1:10 2:21
11 7:17 18:25
48:7
11:09 2:22 60:18
1154 26:15
12 46:24
15 5:2,17,17 13:4
21:5
16 1:3 2:20 20:23
21:17 36:4,13
37:8
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MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES
1600 20:5
17 21:18
19 46:24 60:5
1900 14:14
2
2 22:7 23:1,16
24:17,24 25:5
25:15,20 26:5
26:11 27:1
33:14 45:10
2,638 26:18
20 21:21 41:18
20-year 39:8
2000 4:11 13:2
2015 1:3 2:21
5:20,25 6:3,9
6:22 7:17,17
37:4,6,10 46:2
60:5
2016 13:13,17
14:9 20:11 29:5
39:23 47:21
48:5
2017 17:2
2020 13:14 17:2
21:2 28:20 31:7
36:17 38:6,9
2023 38:17
2024 38:17
21 31:11 33:5
23 29:4
230 18:10
24 18:14 22:5,25
23:16 24:17,23
25:5 33:23
255 22:4
26 6:3 37:4
26th 5:20 6:22
270 11:7 22:4
29:9 30:17
32:11
3
3 35:6
30 35:24 53:21
30th 13:14,17
14:9
30-year 39:2,4
314.644.1334
3:25
314.644.2191
3:24
35-year 39:4
360 20:7
3800 20:6
39 18:12
4
4th 5:25
41 2:6,7
46 2:8
47 31:22 32:4
5
5 2:3 33:4
50 2:9 29:12,15
500-year 53:15
53 2:10
58 2:11
6
6 60:5
6,000 20:5
60 2:10,12 32:9
60,000 20:4
600 18:9
62,000 14:13
63101 3:23
64 31:7
66 14:20,22
6600 14:14
7
7 23:3,17 24:24
25:5 33:9,12
7th 4:11
7.2.2 19:21
711 3:22
8
8-year 16:17
8.8 32:17
9
9 2:4 7:17
9th 60:8
9920 1:6 2:23