HomeMy Public PortalAbout06-13-2000PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES - JUNE 13, 2000
PRESENT: BRUCE WORKMAN, TOM SUPEL, LENNY LEUER, JERRY BROST AND
JIM LANE. ALSO PRESENT PLANNING AND ZONING
ADMINISTRATOR LOREN KOHNEN AND PLANNING AND ZONING
ASSISTANT SANDIE LARSON.
ABSENT: ELIZABETH WEIR AND SUSIE MACKAY
Chairperson Lenny Leuer called the meeting to order at 7:39 p.m.
1. DAVID AND MARJORIE KEARIN & RICHARD AND SHANE RUDD -
TOWNLINE ROAD SOUTH OF HWY 12 - RE -ZONING FROM URBAN
COMMERCIAL TO SUBURBAN RESIDENTIAL AND SUBDIVISION OF 19+
ACRES INTO 24 LOTS - PUBLIC HEARING
Loren Kohnen read his memo to the planning commission. He also read Jim Dillman's
memo. He then explained the reasoning for this re -zoning and subdivision, explaining
that the City was driving this preliminary plat because of the cooperative funding
agreement that the City was working on with MnDOT for the frontage road that would be
part of this subdivision. Before the City can apply for this cooperative funding, there has
to be a preliminary plat showing the location of the road and the deadline for applying is
September. The city council will be asked to extend the time frame for final plat
approval until 2003.
Tom Supel asked that the frontage road be pointed out and Loren did so on the
overhead of the area.
Jane Slaughter, 4575 Highway 12, said that 3 out of 4 of the Orono residents were
present tonight that are affected by this new road. She said this will solve the problem
of the Orono residents having landlocked property, due to the fact that the railroad
crossing is not a legal access for their properties (The railroad access is the access that
the Orono residents are currently using).
Lenny Leuer asked about the cul de sac on Townline Road.
L. Kohnen explained where it would be and pointed it out on the overhead. It was noted
that it looked like the cul de sac would take property away from the lot in the NW corner
of the subdivision and Loren said that it would be adjusted so that it would not interfere
with any lots.
Marty Campion, engineer for applicants with Otto Associates, said that they were in
concurrence with all of the staff reports.
1
T. Supel asked about the park dedication fees and why on 23 lots when there are 24. It
was explained that there is an existing house on the property so credit is given for 1 lot.
L. Leuer asked about the sewer in Orono and the Orono zoning and also about our
sewer capacity.
L. Kohnen said that there were plenty of units available in this portion of Medina.
M. Campion said this will be gravity sewer into the existing sewer line that was in
Townline Road.
L. Leuer asked if this additional sewer would require any agreements with Orono or
Maple Plain or Long Lake and Loren said no - it is additional Medina sewer units.
T. Supel asked about the low land on the property.
L. Kohnen said that all lots meet the 30,000 square foot minimum.
M. Campion said there was only 1 small delineated wetland in the NW corner.
Bruce Workman asked if all lots were buildable and Loren said yes.
L. Leuer mentioned that our engineer said that a NURP pond would be needed.
M. Campion said that the grading plan shows the routing of the drainage and that if
eventually drains into the NURP pond. He said this could be changed if Medina's
engineer wants something different. He said that is seemed to him that Medina's
engineer Tom Kellogg's comments in his memo were for more information when the
final plat is reviewed.
L. Leuer said there are 2 items before the planning commission tonight, the rezoning
and the subdivision. Did the commission want all the questions for both and deal with
them together. The consensus was yes to do that. Lenny then asked if there was
currently an active well and septic on the property and how it would be handled - when it
is rezoned or when.
L. Kohnen said they can be used until the final plat or even wait until the lots are sold
that the septic and well are on now.
M. Campion pointed out the current house on one of their plans.
L. Kohnen explained how a septic tank is abandoned.
Dave Kearin said there is one lot that the drainfield goes over, Lot 7.
2
L. Kohnen said that they would not have to hook up to the city sewer and water until all
current well and septic is abandoned and when the lots are developed. He said this can
be worked out with the public works department.
L. Leuer mentioned the NURP pond on the east, on the Rudd property - where will it
discharge.
M. Campion said there is an existing swale on the southerly portion of the pond and it
will discharge there.
L. Leuer said that it looks like along with the subdivision, the majority of the lots will be
graded - where will the dirt go and will dirt be brought in.
M. Campion said that the site balances - the dirt will be moved around on site.
L. Leuer asked if there were any plans for coverage.
M. Campion said there will be the typical restoration for cover, but there are no
landscape plans developed yet.
B. Workman asked if our tree ordinance would come into play here.
L. Kohnen said that it would be required that trees be planted in the front yards.
M. Campion said that the grading is based on the existing topography.
L. Leuer asked how the grading of the site will work out with MnDOT funding the road.
M. Campion said that it has not been worked out yet. He said they were here tonight so
we could get going on the cooperative agreement with MnDOT.
L. Leuer said that the city was working on new ordinance and how will that affect this
proposal.
Sandie Larson explained that a condition can be placed on this application stating that
any changes that might occur in the Suburban Residential zoning will have to be
adhered to.
B. Workman said he felt it would be better to go all the way thru this process and not
wait for the final approval.
M. Campion said that the general configuration can be o.k'd - other things may change -
he said he would hope that the lot size would be approved and not subject to change.
J. Slaughter wanted to know when she would be guaranteed access to her property and
she was told that there would be no guarantee until final approval.
3
M. Campion said that the easements from the cul de sac would be in place prior to final
recording. He said the surest thing is city council approval of the preliminary plat, then 3
years off for the final plat.
There was continued discussion on the railroad access, etc.
T. Supel wanted to clarify something - he said are you suggesting that unlike the PUD
property, that this land is in the comprehensive plan as suburban residential.
L. Leuer explained his views - he said that our suburban residential ordinance does not
address some of the issues that has been brought up in the PUD ordinance such as
landscaping, lighting, etc.
There was discussion that if the preliminary plat is approved and the suburban
residential ordinance changes, what rules will apply to the final plat.
B. Workman said he does not like approving something 3 years out.
L. Kohnen said that we can only deal with what we have now. We cannot work with
something based on what may happen.
Kristen Rudd, said that Orono had put together a list in their resolution on what is
needed for the final plat approval.
Jim Lane said he is concerned with MnDOT driving this and the short time the planning
commission has been aware of it.
L. Kohnen said that MnDOT is not really driving this, we are.
J. Slaughter said there is no other way to go, but west for access.
J. Lane said that re -zoning is not the only solution - what if the funding does not come
thru from MnDOT - what happens to the road and the subdivision then.
B. Workman asked if in that case, the City would be obligated to build the road.
L. Kohnen said there is only the preliminary plat until the funding is in place - the city or
the applicant can pull the plat - the property would have been re -zoned, but no
subdivision.
J. Lane asked if anyone else was interested in rural residential zoning or PUD2 zoning
for this property - no one was. He also asked if Highway 12 design is fixed for this area
- the answer was no.
4
L. Leuer said that the PUD's were put into place to keep natural amenities and there are
no natural amenities on these 2 properties.
M. Campion said that any zoning other than this is not economically feasible. He said
he knows that economics is not the City's problem, but this development is in the best
interests of the City.
There was further discussion of the road, lot sizes, price of homes, etc.
T. Supel asked Jim lane why we would consider changing the zoning to something
other than suburban residential.
J. Lane said he thinks this is a quick decision for the zoning. He wondered if we had
considered rural residential zoning like it is in Orono adjacent to this property.
B. Workman said he thinks that suburban residential zoning makes sense even if
MnDOT doesn't fund a road. He did not feel that we had to zone this property like
Orono. He felt that this zoning made the most sense - it is right off Highway 12.
J. Lane said how about chewing up sewer units and where does the sewer come from
for this property.
B. Workman said there were plenty of sewer units for this area.
M. Campion said that the sewer is in Townline right now - this development would hook
up to the line right on Townline Road on the gravity portion.
The public hearing was closed at 8:37 p.m.
MOVED BY JERRY BROST AND SECONDED BY BRUCE WORKMAN TO
RECOMMEND THAT THE KEARIN AND RUDD PROPERTY ON TOWNLINE ROAD
SOUTH OF HIGHWAY 12 BE REZONED FROM URBAN COMMERCIAL TO
SUBURBAN RESIDENTIAL.
MOTION PASSED WITH 4 AYES AND 1 NAY. JIM LANE OPPOSED TO THE
INTENSITY OF DEVELOPMENT IN THE SUBURBAN RESIDENTIAL ZONING FOR
THIS AREA.
MOTION PASSED.
MOVED BY BRUCE WORKMAN AND SECONDED BY TOM SUPEL TO
RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR PARK RIDGE ACRES
WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS:
1. All conditions of the city engineer be met
2. All Plat to be reviewed by the Minnehaha Creek Watershed District
3. Park dedication fee will be due on 23 lots
5
4. The pole shed be removed before Lots 5 & 9, Block 1, are issued building permits.
5. The garage on Lot 8, Block 1 to be removed or moved at a time determined by the
city.
6. When Townline Road is closed, either Juniper Curve be constructed or a cul de sac
as determined by public works, to facilitate a turn around.
7. Dead End road signs be placed on Townline Road, locations to be determined by
public works.
8. Entrances and driveway locations at the end of Spruce Way to be determined by
Medina and Orono public works.
9. Location of driveway easement for access to Spruce Way to be resolved before
council action on final plat.
10. Provide easements over all ponds and wetlands.
11. The development to conform to all suburban residential zoning conditions at the time
of the final plat, with the exception of lot size. Lot size to remain at a minimum of
30,000 square feet.
12. Minimum of 4 trees, minimum of 2 1/2 ` diameter, 2 in front of the lot and 2 in the rear,
for each lot in the subdivision
13. In event of failure of MnDOT funding for the road, the owners/developers will provide
the necessary right-of-way for the road and bear the cost of the road, at a location to
be determined by them.
14. It is recognized that there is an existing well and septic system for the house
currently on the property. All to be properly abandoned at the time building permits
are issued for any lots that are affected by such systems.
15. It is recognized that there is an existing commercial business on the property at the
time of the preliminary plat.
MOTION PASSED.
2. JAMES FRIZZELL, 3880 CHIPPEWA ROAD AND KEVIN ENGE, 3882
CHIPPEWA ROAD - LOT LINE RE-ARRANGEMENT/RE-PLAT - PUBLIC
HEARING
Loren Kohnen read his memo to the planning commission and put up an overhead of
the area. He also explained that the city council would have to hold a public hearing to
vacate the drainage and utility easements on the line to be changed.
Jim Lane asked if the lot line that is being re -aligned affects any of the set backs for the
current buildings.
L. Kohnen pointed out on the overhead the buildings and said no, the setbacks were not
affected.
Jerry Brost asked if the septic systems needed an easement - answer - no
Tom Supel asked if there was adequate room for a stable/barn.
6
Jim Frizzell pointed out where one would be built and said there would be no problems
with the set backs for a barn except for maybe one.
L. Kohnen said that no variances would be granted - there would be no hardship.
MOVED BY JERRY BROST AND SECONDED BY JIM LANE TO RECOMMEND
APPROVAL OF THE LOT LINE RE-ARRANGEMENT/PRELIMINARY PLAT FOR 3880-
3882 CHIPPEWA ROAD WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS:
1. Drainage and utility easements to be vacated on the lot line that is changing.
2. 5' drainage and utility easements on each side of new line.
MOTION PASSED.
3. MARION AND CY DUCHARME - 2182 PINTO DRIVE - VARIANCE TO SOIL
REQUIREMENTS FOR LOT SIZE AND SUBDIVISION OF 11 ACRES INTO 2
LOTS - PUBLIC HEARING
Loren Kohnen read his memo to the planning commission and put up an overhead of
the area. He explained the road right-of-way that would have to be dedicated to the city
and explaining that this ROW takes away from the good soils for each of the lots.
Bruce Workman clarified for himself why the variance was required.
Jerry Brost asked about a drainage and utility easement between the two proposed lots
and Loren said yes, 5' on each side.
B. Workman asked if there were 2 septic sites on each lot and Loren said yes.
Julia Porter, 2205 Pinto Drive, said that she had the 30 acres just north of this property
that she bough over 30 years ago and has retained the driveway easement for the
Eisinger Farm that goes over her property. She wants to make sure that the driveway
for this new lot does not go over her easement.
Cy Ducharme said that he also had an easement
There was discussion of the easement, whether it goes over the Ducharme property,
the Porter property or where.
B. Workman assured Julia that she does not have the have anyone drive over her
property that she does no want to.
J. Porter asked that this application be tables until she has a chance to get all her legal
papers together, so she can check the easement.
7
B. Workman said that the private easement questions are not in the realm of this
planning commission.
Lenny Leuer said we are not taking any action outside of the Ducharme property.
J. Brost said that Julia is questioning whether the Ducharme property line is shown
correctly.
C. Ducharme said he had no problem moving the driveway farther to the south.
J. Brost said that if anything is found to be in error, this application could stop.
B. Workman said that the City could not take the right-of-way where it was pointed out if
the Porter easement is on the Ducharme property.
Bruce Eidenschink, 2232 Pinto Drive, wanted to know what this does to his house. He
said he has a permanent easement from the Ducharmes, Porter and Scherers.
There was further discussion of easements - where they were located, where the City
wants road ROW.
L. Leuer asked about where the Eidenschink driveway is now and where it would be
after the property division.
B. Workman said that he would like the land owners to work this out and then come
back to us.
It was suggested that the property owners get their papers together and then make an
appointment and meet with Loren Kohnen and Jim Dillman.
Bill Loe, 2105 Pinto Drive, asked where the current ROW was.
L. Kohnen pointed it out on the overhead where the ROW would be taken.
C. Ducharme said he would like a ruling on the variance.
L. Leuer said they could take a straw vote on it.
Tom Supel said that he is very nervous granting exceptions on soils. He said the only
thing that makes sense is that the City is taking the ROW, but he said the City makes
constraints on property owners all the time, so there is no hardship.
C. Ducharme said the taking of an acre of property is a hardship.
T. Supel said the issue is what is a hardship as far as the ordinance reads.
8
B. Workman said there is an exception here - this could be done if the City was not
taking the ROW since there are plenty of suitable soils.
T. Supel said he would like to see that if a variance is approved, that it is made very
clear to the city council why the planning commission recommended approval.
A straw vote was taken on the variance - all were in favor.
C. Ducharme said that Julia has to get her title work in order. He said they were willing
to table their application. Loren asked the Ducharmes to send a letter requesting the
table.
MOVED BY BRUCE WORKMAN AND SECONDED BY JERRY BROST TO TABLE
THE MARION AND CY DUCHARME APPLICATION UNTIL FURTHER INFORMATION
IS RECEIVED CONCERNING THE DRIVEWAY EASEMENT(S).
MOTION PASSED.
4. MINUTES OF MAY 9, 2000
MOVED BY TOM SUPEL AND SECONDED BY JIM LANE TO APPROVE THE
MINUTES AS PRESENTED.
MOTION PASSED.
5. PLANNING COMMISSION REPRESENTATIVES FOR CITY COUNCIL
MEETINGS
June 20, 2000 Tom Supel
July 5, 2000 Jim Lane
July 18, 2000 Tom Supel
Loren reported on a meeting that he had attended with Paul Robinson with our Met
Council representative. He also talked of the meeting he had attended with Jim
Dillman, hosted by the Met Council regarding the Elm Creek Interceptor.
Loren also mentioned that he had attended a meeting at the Wayzata School District
Administrative offices along with other cities, regarding the siting of property for a new
elementary school.
MOVED BY BRUCE WORKMAN AND SECONDED BY JERRY BROST TO ADJOURN.
MOTION PASSED. Meeting adjourned at 10:15 p.m.
Planning and Zoning Assistant Date
9