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HomeMy Public PortalAbout08-24-1999, COMP PLAN P.H.PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING - AUGUST 24, 1999 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN PUBLIC HEARING PRESENT: LENNY LEUER, KATHY COOK, FRANK MIGNONE, BRUCE WORKMAN, ELIZABETH WEIR, CAROLYN SMITH, JERRY BROST AND SUSIE MACKAY. ALSO PRESENT: PLANNING AND ZONING ADMINISTRATOR LOREN KOHNEN, CITY CLERK PAUL ROBINSON, DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS JIM DILLMAN, MAYOR JOHN FERRIS, COUNCIL MEMBER JOHN HAMILTON, COUNCIL MEMBER JIM JOHNSON, COUNCIL MEMBER PHIL ZIETLOW, AND PLANNING AND ZONING ASSISTANT SANDIE LARSON. The public hearing was preceded by an open house from 5 - 8 p.m. Chairperson Lenny Leuer called the meeting to order at 8:00 p.m. Lenny Leuer welcomed everyone to the meeting and explained it's purpose was to hear comments from the residents on the draft plan after they had the opportunity to see the newsletter, etc. He stated that the planning commission had been working on the comprehensive plan for over 18 months and had held approximately 35 meetings; there had been neighborhood meetings and the dominant theme of what the residents want is: 1. Continue low density 2. Preserve the rural atmosphere of the City of Medina 3. Protect the natural resources in the city. The land use guide plan is very similar to the current guide plan. Some of the changes include: land immediately west of Loretto, from rural commercial to rural residential; the parcel south of St. Annes' Church are considering multi -residential, public parcels that are not currently designated as public service parcels. He stated that there are 4 new zoning classifications being discussed: 1. Uptown Hamel - a mix of residential and commercial 2. Urban Commercial 1 Zone - commercial along Hwy 55 - campus style development - commercial sites with substantial acreage 3. Residential PUD's - Elwell and Holasek properties 4. RCH - Rural Commercial Holding zone by the intersection of Hwy 55 and Co. Rd. 19 - if and when the development can fund the extension of sewer to the area Lenny stated that the potential arrival of the Elm Creek Interceptor is 2002. He asked if Tom Caswell was in attendance. Tom Caswell introduced himself: Said he worked in the Community Development Division of the Metropolitan Council, was on staff there, job is Sector representative and is the liaison for all the cities in Hennepin County except for Minneapolis. He said the 1 2002 date is valid for the Elm Creek Interceptor based on his conversations with Met Council staff. L. Leuer said that the interceptor is needed for a couple of reasons: remaining capacity is not enough for the sewered or the area available for sewer service area outlined in the '92 comp plan; Plymouth may need the capacity. He mentioned the `flexible' MUSA, allocating on a 1st come, 1st served basis and when the capacity reaches 240,000 gallons per day criteria for staged development kicks in. If we reach capacity and the interceptor is not in, the sewered development will cease until there is more available. The draft plan reflects what we think the majority wants, now is the time for the public to tell us what they think of our draft plan. We will be taking comments first from those that signed the sign up sheet, then we will move to the comment box and after that we will open it up for comments from the floor. He asked that comments be limited to three minutes and to please state name and address. He then stated the process; after tonight's public hearing the planning commission would either continue the public hearing or approve the comp plan and move it on to the city council for their approval, then to the Metropolitan council and lastly conduct any re -zoning that needs to be done. Bruce Workman said that this has been an extremely long process and there is a lot that goes into this. Feels that it is real essential that the public speaks tonight and has their input. Tom Manning, 282 Hamel Road, said that there are 6 houses west of St. Anne's Church that are slated to be rezoned from urban commercial to urban residential. He said that they would like to be part of "Uptown Hamel'. They have a cemetery behind them, across from them is St. Anne's property and next to them is the church and they are like an island. Being a part of Uptown Hamel would give us a range between residential and commercial uses. L. Leuer said there are 6 residential lots and the majority are interested in being part of uptown Hamel. Tom said that is correct. Kathy Cook asked if all the 6 were here. Those present were: LaVerne Theis, John Mengelkoch and Tom Manning. Tom said he was also speaking for Bruce Luxford. B. Workman asked if this was because they felt it would give them more flexibility for their land in the future. T. Manning said that the property would be more valuable as part of Uptown Hamel. B. Workman said that this area is quite small and could be bigger. Carolyn Smith said this was being encouraged because of the mix of residential and commercial and Susie Mackay said this would give those in the area the option of being residential or commercial. 2 The consensus was to change these six home from urban residential to uptown Hamel. Elizabeth Weir said it would be nice to know how the other 2 feel and Bruce said maybe we could get a letter with all 6 names on it. Kristin Johnson, 905 Foxberry Farms Road, said that the UCldistrict that has been created encourages campus style development, increase the setbacks and create a more compatible zone that abuts residential. She said she would ask that the parcel that is south of Foxberry Farms be changed from urban commercial to UC1 particularly because it is up against the Foxberry Farms property, there are significant concerns that the setbacks for UC are not sufficient to buffer the current proposal for the residential area. She said she would also like to ask that the commissioners consider talking to the city attorney for a moratorium to be placed on the city until this new comp plan is approved. She said they are happy with the plan with the caveat of the one change and we would ask that the moratorium be considered for the city until the comp plan is complete. John Ferris, mayor of the City of Medina, said that he had no comment other than studying the issue and that the planning commission will send this to the city council with any recommendations they may have. Phil Zietlow, council member, said that before even 1 house was built in Foxberry, commercial zoning for this property was talked about and the problems with residential and commercial. He said it sounded like a pretty good suggestion to him. Frank Mignone said this is a big issue and there is currently an application in front of us and we have to deal with the current zoning. He thought it was too late for a moratorium. Carolyn Smith said she proposes we get a determination from the city attorney. B. Workman said the planning commission could propose the moratorium and send it to the city council. K. Johnson said that the action so far has been only at the planning commission level and this seems to be grandfathering in something that does not seem to be a plan that fits the city's vision. K. Cook asked if the proposal was to consider a moratorium for the entire city as opposed to a moratorium on a particular parcel. It was said yes. Susie Mackay asked if it had to be on the entire city or if it could be on parcels that are potential buffers between residential and commercial. L. Leuer said we are getting too far afield for what we are here for. 3 Mary Verbick, 855 Foxberry Farms Road, said she would like to reiterate some of the things we have discussed from Foxberry Farms. We live right next to the undeveloped area and there are a lot of concerns that are not necessarily on how it will look. One thing that should be very clear is that no one is saying that this land cannot be used or built on, but we have some concerns about the zoning stipulations and I don't really think the issue is that everyone changed their mind. I keep getting the feeling that it is more a lack of clarity and lack of specific tools like the UCI designation that was not available there. I don't think it was ever the thought to have a huge commercial development next to residential. She said her concerns included wetland impact, traffic and the actual proximity of the buildings to residential areas and how they will be buffered and not only visually, but lights, etc. I also don't think anyone in Medina wants to set a precedent with a large commercial zone next to residential without a buffer zone. She said this was important to all of Medina and not just this one corner of the city. Mitch Shields, 4526 Fern Street, said he thought Medina should get a bigger meeting place. He said he has lived in the city for 3'/z years, is on the board of LICA. He said he is proud to live in Medina and thinks it is a job well done on the plan, there is a lot of information and graphics. He thought it was too aggressive changing the agriculture use to rural residential, there should be a policy on feed lots, talked about the parks, said it would be nice to have boat slips so those that did not live on the lake could have the opportunity for a boat on the lake, would like to see some improvements at Walnut Park, would like to see a better bike trail plan more consistent with the Northwest Trails plan, the comp plan should state that excessive speed on the streets is not acceptable and he is concerned with the chopping up the RR area. J. Ferris said that he is a horse owner and Medina does have an ordinance that deals with animal waste, manure is to be spread or hauled away. He said the issue of 5 acre lots means 5 acres of good soils and it is highly unlikely that lots will be 5 acres, more often they are 7-10 acres in size and there are not that many more lots available in the city. He said city boat slips are not without merit, the question is should the city do it. The city staff is small and we would like to see it stay that way. This seems like a suggestion that would require a larger staff - excessive road speed has been a problem, enforcement has doubled or more - the police department should be contacted if there is a problem on a particular street. M. Shields said it seems like the whole area is being opened up to 5 acre development, more should be done to preserve agriculture land. J. Ferris said we are not talking about 5 acre parcels, but 5 acres of good soils - it is tough for people with ag land not to think about doing something with it, with the prices the way they are - he said he is not advocating doing something - he wants to protect this way of life, but the problem is the value of land is so high. L. Leuer asked Loren Kohnen - about the amount of land required for septic systems - as of 7/1/99 the criteria got larger - before you needed 2 acres of good soils and now 4 you need 5 acres - this makes subdivisions more restrictive - Loren said that most of the people he has talked to tonight want to subdivide into smaller lots and not larger. L. Leuer said it is safe to say that the way the SE corner of the city is in the rural residential zoning cannot be replicated in the NW rural residential area. M. Shields asked about ag preserve. L. Kohnen explained to him that is was a contract with the state and requires keeping land in ag preserve for at least 8 years. Mitch then asked about speeders and what could be done to slow them down. Jim Dillman, Director of Public Works, said he does not know anything that works - he said the majority of the speeders live in the neighborhood they are speeding in. Roger Georges said he owns property west of Loretto and wants to know how his property is being affected. L. Leuer said that the property is currently zoned rural commercial and in the comp plan it is guided to be zoned rural residential - Lenny told him he could put his property in ag preserve. R. Georges said there is no money in farming and he would like to develop it. David LaPorte, the Rockler Company, 4365 Willow Drive, said that he supports the transportation part of the plan and supports a stop light at Willow and 55 - he said recently two of his employees were nearly rear ended at that intersection - he said it is proposed for 2002 and he asks that the city be proactive to get it sooner. J. Dillman said that the city is working on it - it is MnDOT's decision - he said the city has completed a signal justification report and applied for funding. Elizabeth Weir asked if it was possible for the police to be at the intersection during the busiest times. Jerry Brost said rear end accidents are different than crossing accidents. John Hamilton, Medina council member, said that the busy times are 7 - 8:30 a.m. and 3-5 p.m. - it is busy throughout the city at these times and unless there are over time shifts, it would be hard to have patrolmen there - unless the businesses want to contribute for the overtime - - J. Brost asked if we had statistics on accidents at the intersection and if it is high here, we can request to MnDOT that the sign be put in sooner. B. Workman said there had been a lot of activity with the city and owners in the area and they are trying to get it solved as soon as possible. 5 C. Smith said she suggests that the businesses get together with the city - maybe the businesses could do something with work shifts, times, etc. Jeff Pederson , 710 Shawnee Woods Road, said that his neighborhood is north of Rolling Green golf course, west of Foxberry Farms and east of the Elwell property and they have been excluded from the sewer expansion. He said there are 5-6 homeowners in the area and all are interested in sewer. He wanted to know what the process would be to get included for sewer. He also said that the planning commission had done a tremendous job and the good showing at this meeting shows that. L. Kohnen said that the area is in trouble already - there is a high water table - he said it might even be beneficial for a looped water line. Paul Robinson said that the planning commission and city council did not want to add a lot of residential to the sewered area - if the septic systems are a problem in that neighborhood, it could be designated as a bail out area. B. Workman said that problem areas should come before new areas. J. Dillman said it could be done by gravity in that area - it depends on what happens at the Elwell property. He said it would be very expensive for such a few homes - possibly $30,000+ per lot for sewer. Bail out areas were discussed - the planning commission added this area to be monitored for failing septic systems. L. Leuer said that the city does not just go out to do this, people pay for it. Jeff was told to get a petition from his neighbors regarding the sewer. Elizabeth Sedgwick and Ken Bechler, 4182 Arrowhead Drive, own 2 parcels in the NE corner of Arrowhead and Highway 55 - the southern 1/2 is slated for urban commercial and the north '/2 for rural residential. She said that the southern 1/2 is too small and would like to add the 2 parcels together for urban commercial. Ken Bechler said that there are about 4-5 acres buildable on the 2 lots. There was discussion concerning the size of the parcels, how it would be buffered from the residential area, etc. B. Workman said this cannot be changed without a lot of discussion. E. Sedgwick said it would make the most sense to combine the parcels - there is quite a lot of wetlands on the lots. K. Cook asked if they were comfortable with both parcels being rural residential and K. Bechler said they are torn on that - yes in a way, residential would be o.k. except that the Cavanaugh property is to the west is guided for commercial development. 6 L. Leuer asked if there were 5 acres of contiguous good soils and L. Kohnen said pretty close. Both C. Smith and K. Cook said lets consider it. Joe Reis, 400 Cheyenne Trail, said that he was representing the homeowners on Cheyenne Trail and they had questions about the concept minor collector road that is shown on the map to connect with Pinto Drive. He said they are concerned with safety, increased traffic, wetlands. He said the area is very wooded and they questioned the impact on their property values. They said they were not aware of this concept road until they received the mailing for tonight's meeting. They wanted to know what a concept road was and what does it mean of the comprehensive plan is approved. P. Robinson said that there are a number of concept roads in the 1992 plan and this was one of them - it has been in the plan for a long time - it may or may not happen depending on development. J. Dillman said that both Pinto Drive and Cheyenne Trail are maintained by the city, L. Leuer asked if there were advantages if they were connected and Jim said yes. P. Robinson said for the road to be continued, the adjacent property would have to be developed. Elizabeth Weir said the adjacent property owners are not interested in developing J. Reis said the concern is, if property does develop. There was more discussion of concept roads and what and how it happens. L. Leuer said that the city will react when a proposal comes in. C. Smith said the city policy is to avoid dead end roads. J. Dillman said that Cheyenne is one of the last public roads that dead end. J. Brost asked Jim about the feasibility of building this road and Jim said it could be done. Bonnie McGowan, 425 Cheyenne Trail, asked if the city had looked at any other options. She said there is a dirt road now off of Medina Road - she said there is running water between the properties. J. Reis said he wanted it noted that they (the neighborhood) wanted to go on record as wanting the pass thru for Cheyenne Trail eliminated from the plan. 7 Ryan Ness, 4565 Wichita Trail, said he would like the maps on the internet site. Paul said they will be. Ryan then spoke in favor of the traffic light at 55 and Willow - it is a dangerous area - he said he would like to see his area patrolled more. P. Robinson said if there were any web tekky kind of person who would like to help with getting the maps on the web, he would welcome the help. He said he has tried many different ways and it is difficult to show the entire map clearly. L. Leuer said before he opens up the discussion for general comments from the floor he would like to go to the Met council representative that is here tonight. Tom, you have had a chance to see some of the maps and hear the discussion tonight. What is your opinion of what is going to happen when this hits the Met Council, especially in the light of the article in the Star Tribune on what urban sprawl is and what we are trying to do here with our low density in Medina. Tom Caswell, Metropolitan Council representative, said that the Met Council sees in the rural areas 1 unit per 10 acres which Medina has actually done that by requiring the 5 acres of contiguous buildable soils. Our staff looked at it initially and said '5 acres?' But when you actually see the way it plays out, it comes out to essentially 11 acres per unit so that part of it meets our policy. Loren and Paul have been really good about keeping me and other Met council staff in the loop, having meetings with us , talking about the potential sewer capacity with the Elm Creek Interceptor - your flows are below the capacity that is actually the plan - I don't see any particular problems. There is a big push now for affordable and life cycle housing and affordable is $134,000 so it is not low income housing, these are real average, takes two average wage earners to be able to afford a $134,000 house. But they are looking for affordable housing with life style choices for people that are not interested in mowing their lawns and taking care of a large yard. I think with your uptown Hamel area you may well be able to accommodate that. I don't see any particular problems. We are forecasting a lot of growth, 330,000 households between 1995 and 2020. That is 330,000 new households in a 25 year period. What is interesting is the growth that will happen in 16 communities will account for'/z of that. The next 16 communities will account for 75% of it, and a few more - the top 50 communities out of 185 in the metropolitan area will account for 85% of that growth. Medina is about 54 - 56. The pressure is here and it seems to me it will not be as great as in communities that have the infrastructure already in place. So I think your plan looks completely reasonable, your forecasts and flows are consistent with ours. The densities may not be everything the council has asked for and wants, but you have a lot of time between now and 2020 to make adjustments. Since we look at the plans every 10 years, there will be all sorts of opportunities for the city as well as the Met council, to see how things are going, where they are going and how to make adjustments along the way. He said the maps in Medina's draft plan are outstanding, the best we (Met Council) have seen. Bill Cioria, 915 Sunset Court, asked if the Met Council had any thoughts on buffering urban commercial and urban residential. 8 T. Caswell said that their authority is quite limited - he said they deal mainly with surface transportation and sewer. L. Leuer asked Tom what he could do to help the situation at 55 and Willow. Tom said he would check on it. David Weetman, 2475 Morningside Road, asked if there were any thoughts to add the Hennepin County Biological survey to the comprehensive plan. He said the maps might be nice for planning purposes. P. Robinson said that the city has the survey and the city is currently working with Hennepin County on further identifying Medina's natural features. Robert Etem, 2705 Willow Drive, said thanks to the planning commission for the mailing preceding this meeting. He said the ag district is being cut in Y2 - he said people are looking for 5 acre hobby farms - people should be looking for more than strip development - he suggested cluster style development as one way to preserve the rural character and said things like that unite areas into neighborhoods. C. Smith said `conservation development" is something that many of the planning commissioners have been talking about. J. Brost asked if there was anyplace in the plan that referenced sharing septic systems. Marc Anderson, representing Lundgren Brothers, (developers of Foxberry Farms) acknowledged staff and the planning commission and the mailing. He said 1. - the trails seem vague and questioned their maintenance - he said that Foxberry dedicated land along 116 for a trail - they graded it and the city was to maintain it - still has not all been graveled. 2. He said that they encouraged transitional land use with UC1 next to Foxberry - it would have less of an impact and would be more of a transitional zoning. He said that Lundgrens had an option on all of the land, including the area planned for UC and they had a plan for a transitional area and the city turned it down. (The proposal did not come before the city). C. Smith said if trails are prepared by the developer, the city should complete them in a required amount of time. F. Miqnone said that he agreed that the trail was in terrible shape. J. Dillman said the park commission is looking at it now - the park commission works thru the city council. M. Anderson said they are just asking that it be completed and maintained. J. Dillman said the money comes from the park fund and this is handled by the park commission and then to the city council 9 The comments cards were gone thru ( cards are in the record ); copies and attached. There was discussion on the rerouting of County Road 19 - a letter was received from Roger Adams, 2725 County Road 19 concerning this - Paul said the county has a plan for going behind Sycamore Trail - Carolyn said it should also be in our plan - Kathy said all points need further discussion. L. Leuer said there has been serious discussion of the closing of Townline Road south of Highway 12 and when that is done, a signal light there - it is in the plan to rezone the property south of Highway 12 from urban commercial to suburban residential. John Ferris explained the problem in the area - he said the railroad trestle is at an angle and would need to be straightened out for a signal to be put in, at a cost of close to $5 million dollars - a light could go in if the intersection is closed. It is a dangerous intersection and Maple Plain is interested in having Townline closed with a light there K. Cook said that speed and traffic is an issue - she talked about monitoring speed in the hot spots. Susie Mackay asked about something that would track license plates and speed. K. Johnson said that besides speed in residential areas, there are trucks, construction traffic, visitors, etc. - people do not slow down. P. Robinson suggested that the planning commission send a letter to the city council with recommended changes and move the comprehensive plan to the city council so this process can move forward with the planning commission still having some say. C. Smith said we should discuss the issues. Bill Cavanaugh, 2015 Aquila Ave., landowner in Medina, said he would like to see his property on 55 left residential -he would like it left residential to match the Bechlers - There was discussion of the current zoning of the Cavanaugh property. MOVED BY CAROLYN SMITH AND SECONDED BY FRANK MIGNONE TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. MOTION PASSED. Public hearing closed at 10:28 p.m. 10 MOVED BY FRANK MIGNONE AND SECONDED BY ELIZABETH WEIR TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE DRAFT COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO THE CITY COUNCIL ALONG WITH A LETTER OF TRANSMITTAL WITH THEIR RECOMMENDED CHANGES AND/OR CONCERNS. MOTION PASSED WITH BRUCE WORKMAN OPPOSED. Bruce felt that the issues raised tonight should be worked out before giving the plan to the city council. LIST OF CONCERNS AND/OR CHANGES: 1. Six lots near St. Anne's Church to be included in the "Uptown Hamel" zoning. The residents were asked for a letter. 2. Issue of zoning south of Foxberry Farms and issue of a moratorium - need legal opinion on a moratorium for the city until comprehensive plan is approved. 3. List of concerns by Mitch Shields - trails, etc. 4. Willow and Highway 55 traffic light 5. Residents of Shawnee Woods Road requesting being added to the sewered area - add this area to the monitoring zone 6. Bechler parcels on Arrowhead Drive - both parcels to Ul - need letter from the landowners - they will be notified when this will be discussed. 7. Extension of Cheyenne Trail - residents opposed to the concept road - need to know of easements in area (Medina Road) 8. Add Hennepin County Biological survey to plan 9. Support of need for definition of agriculture preserve - support of conservation developments 10. Need city's commitment for maintaining trails - should be a policy statement or something in plan on maintenance of trails 11. Consider 2040 MUSA line south on Brockton 12.Cavanaugh request for parcels to be both residential and commercial 13.Straightening of County Road 19 by Sycamore Trail. MOVED BY KATHY COOK AND SECONDED BY JERRY BROST TO ADJOURN. MOTION PASSED. Meeting adjourned at 11:03 p.m. Planning and Zoning Assistant Date 11