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VILLAGE OF BAL HARBOUR
AT T ORNEY/CLIEN T SESSION
BAL HARBOUR VILLAGE HALL
655 96th STREET
BAL HARBOUR , FLORIDA 33 154
TUESDAY , MARCH 17, 2009
5:4 5 p .m. -6:25 p.m.
21 Taken before Mary G . S t ephenson , FPR, Notary
22 P ublic for th e State of Florida
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TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES, INC .
(305) 444-7331
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1 APPEARANCES:
2 COUNCILMEMBERS :
3 JEAN ROSENFI ELD, ASSISTANT MAYOR
MAR TIN PACKER
4 JOEL S . JACO BI
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6 VILLAGE MANAG E R :
7 ALFRED J . TREPPEDA
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9 VILLAGE ATTO RNE Y :
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WEISS SEROTA HELFMAN
PASTORIZA COLE & BON I SKE, P.A.
BY : RICH AR D WE ISS , ESQ .
MICHAEL POPOK, ES Q .
VILLAGE CL ERK :
ELLISA HORVATH , CMC
(PRESE NT ON LY DURING PU BLIC PORT I ON)
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES, I NC .
(305) 444-733 1
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1 Thereupon , the fol l owing proceedings were had:
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ASSISTANT MAYOR ROS E NFIELD : I am calling
t his public meeting to order.
ca l l the r oll.
Would you please
MS . HORVATH : Assistant Mayor Rosenfie l d.
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSE NFIE L D : Present .
MS . HORVAT H : Cou n cilman Jacobi .
COUNC I LMAN JACOB I : Here .
MS . HORVATH : Councilman Packer .
COUNC ILMA N PACKER : Here .
MS . HORVAT H: Mayo r Berlin and Councilman
Sanz are absent .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : The time is
now 5 :45 . We are about to have an attorney/c l ient
session in acco r dance with F lorida S t atute 286 .011
regard i ng t he litigation styled Babak Raheb versus
The Vi ll age of Bal Har b o u r , Dade C o unty Circui t
Court, case number 03-21932 CA 23 .
The sess ion is es t imated to last one hour ,
and t h e following peop l e wil l be in attendance at
this meeting , Mr . J oel J acobi , Mr. Mar t in Packer
and myself , J ean Rosenfield .
T he village attorneys that are present are
R ichard J . Weiss , Michael Popok , and the vi l lage
manager , Alfred J . Treppeda.
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES , INC .
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Th e proceedings will be recorded by a
certified co u rt reporter and, at the conc l usion of
t he litigation discussed , the transcript wi ll be
made part of the pub l ic record .
All those ind ivi duals who I have not named
should l eave the r oom at this time.
(Thereupon , Ms. Horvat h l eft the r oom .)
MR. POPOK: Good evening, counci l persons .
We are here to ta l k about the Raheb case . We have
a sett leme n t p ro posal, wh ich has been circula t ed
p rior to t his by the vil lage manage r. I don 't
know if you fol k s have your copies. I have extra
copies if you need it .
T h e d i f f e r ence between this proposal and
the one that was considered at one t i me by the
council is --le t me j u st give you the key
differences . One is the a mo u nt of money that the
village wou l d con tri b ute. Ori ginally , I thi nk the
proposal was 50,000 . It's now $10,000 f rom the
villag e, t he e xi sting $25 ,000 , which the insurer
Westport Coregis cont i nues to a gree to contribu t e
t o a sett l ement a l ong the terms that are o utl ine d
in t he set t lemen t agree me n t . So i t's a tot al of
35; 10 from the v il lage and 25 from t h e i nsu ra nce
compan y.
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In return for that, Mr . Raheb will agree
no t t o challe n ge the s ec u r i ty district in the
future , cooperate with any fu t ure challenges to
the security d is trict . He wil l r elease the
vi ll age . He w i l l pay the outstanding l iens that
he has related to the sec uri ty district a nd
otherwise, which are about $1 0 ,000 . So ,
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bas icall y , we wo uld pay it and we would ultimately
get it back into the treasur y of th e village .
T h e other things that are missing is at one
time he wanted the secu ri ty contrac t reevalua ted
and terminated and rebid . He has dropped that as
a co nd i tio n .
I t 's reall y a straigh t forward sett le ment
agreement now ot her th an releases a nd exchange of
the 1 0 ,000 from the vil lage in return for
r e l eases . Tha t i s r ea lly the e ntir e sum --
MR . WEISS : T hat i s the i ssue we ha d
discussed at one point. That is out.
MR. POPOK : That i s out.
COUNCI LMAN PACKER :
COUNCI LMA N JACOBI :
community to t he vil l age?
That is out comp l etely?
That is from the gated
MR. WE IS S: It is up to the council as to
where it com es f r om . You ca n direc t the manager .
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES, INC .
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Lis t en, first of al l , the mo ney is going
out , and then assuming you approve i t, the money
is coming back becaus e he owes us about $10 ,000 .
He owes the security dist ri ct abo u t $10 ,000 , but
you can direct the manager that it's no t to come
from village f unds , but it's supposed to come from
t he sec u r it y d i strict.
COUNC ILMA N PACKER : Can I ask a question?
MR . POPOK : Sure.
COUNC I L MA N PACKER : What is t o prevent i f
we go a l o n g w i th this, what is to prevent another
par t y in the security district from pu ll ing the
same schtick?
MR. POPOK : Nothing.
MR . WE I SS: Absolute l y nothing.
COU NCIL MAN PACK E R : Okay.
MR . POPOK : Now , the only thing that we
commented o n before, t he case is an '03.
has been s i tting around f or six yea r s.
The case
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e l se has jo ined . Other people cou l d have sued in
that six yea r period .
MR. WEISS : But to be fair , I have had an
e-mail from Reese Stobuck and she is going t o get
a lawyer , but she e-mails me everyday, a nd she
says she i s going to ge t --but , listen, Mart i n ,
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIAT ES, INC .
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you asked a proper question. The answe r is t hat
you have to make a judgment as to whether you
think it's likely t hat somebody else would file
it .
That is a judgment you have to make. There
is no guarantees here . There is no precedentia l
e ff ec t o f t his. I t e liminates t he act i ve
p l ain t iff that we have now, and it's up to you
whethe r you --
MR. POPOK : T h ere is one o t her factor I
j u st wan t t o throw out to the discussion. He
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hasn 't done i t yet, but Raheb has sa i d tha t i f he
goes forward and the case isn 't sett l ed a l ong
t h ese terms , t h at he would drop his damage claim,
which would rea l ly make coverage for the insurance
company fa ll away .
So I think the counc i l has to be prepared
if he impleme n ts that stratagem and drops
damages --
COUNCILMAN JACOBI: He i s p r obab l y doing
tha t .
MR . POPOK : Right . T hat we would then have
to pay --the attorney's fees wo ul d th e n fal l on
us . We wo ul dn 't have a n insura n ce company paying
for t he at t orney 's fees.
TAY LOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES, INC.
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MR. WE I SS : Remember th ere was t ha t issue
out there that we talked abou t in p r io r executive
sessions, wh i ch i s the i nsurance company h as hir e d
separate co unsel dea l ing with what is cal led a
reser vatio n of ri g h ts, whic h t he y are saying, we
wi l l de fen d the t hi ng, b ut we ar e no t conv i nced
that i t 's r ea l ly covered by your insu ra n c e p o licy ,
and they ha ve h i red a separate la wy er who has
int er vened in the case t o bas ica ll y say, li sten,
if th i s thing comes out , and there is no damages,
the n we reserve the r ig h t to come agains t th e
villag e f o r the money that the insurance company
has paid ou t in de fending t h e case .
COU NC ILMA N PACKER: T he th i n g is if we
don 't go with this se ttl e me n t
MR . WE I SS : Right .
COUNCILMAN PACKER : --don't yo u think it 's
necessary th at t he l egal iss ue o f whether th is --
MR. POPOK: Security dis trict .
COUNCILMA N PACKER : --security district is
le g al or n ot once a nd f o r a l l?
I t hi nk we should fac e the music an d f ind
out if it i s l ega l , which I b e li eve it is le ga l ,
the n we have no t h ing to wor ry about , and i t will
be set t le d once and for al l , and we can proceed.
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES, I NC.
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MR . WE I SS : That i s absolutely up to the
counc il whether they --
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : Tha t is a
separate i ss u e .
MR. WEISS: No. It 's really t he iss ue.
COUNCILMAN PACKER : It's this i ssue.
MR. WEISS : He 's asking the right question.
He and I have discussed th i s at length. He feels
this issue has been out there long enough, and it
shou l d b e lef t to the courts and as I th ink you
have said to me , Martin , l e t the c hi ps fal l where
t hey may . That is an issue. I don't l ive the r e .
The risk of losing this suit does not af fe c t me.
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I 'll t e l l yo u I think the o th er side of it
is that if you fee l like the chance of somebody
else challeng in g i t are fairl y remote because they
wou ld have to come up wit h mon ey and stuff like
that.
CO UNCILMAN JACOB I: How much did he pay?
MR . TREPPEDA: We don 't know.
COUNCILMAN PACKER : He claimed that tim e he
said he spen t $10 0 ,000 , b u t he never showed
anyth ing .
MR . POPOK: He cou l d have.
MR . WEISS: He cou l d have spent that .
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOC I ATES , INC.
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Whethe r he has actua l ly pa id t h e lawyer, I 'm not
s u re, b u t I think t h e amount of work that his
lawyer has done could be between 50 or a hundred
t h ousand .
But I t hi nk t he issu e is and has a l ways
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been her e that if the distr ict goes away, there is
not really a good alternative for those peop le to
protect themselves. I think that is --for those
who feel like the th ing should be sett l ed, it
p ro bab l y is not going to get challenged aga in .
But, certainly, you are in no worse position than
you are now.
You are ask in g the right questions . It 's
just a matter of whether you feel like you want to
resolve th is and hope that nobody sues in the
fu tu re or you want to let the ch i ps fall where
they may , and tha t is th e i ssue.
ASSIS TANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: This has been
going on fo r six years. We now have an insurance
company that will pay th e $25,000 . We can insis t
that the 10 ,000 come from what t he homeowners pay,
not what the taxpayers pay . It 's not an issue
that the people on the other side of th e street
are paying for this.
MR . WEISS: Correct.
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ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIE LD: P erhaps it
might be best to get this out of our ha i r. T ha t
doesn 't mean that we are not going t o deal wi th
the i ssue.
COU NC ILMAN PA CKER : You may h ave to deal
wi th i t again.
Let me ask anot h e r question then. If th e
council right now , if we recommend t o th e council
tha t we settle, it is goi ng t o come up before the
council meeting, correct?
MR . WEIS S : Not toda y , bu t it would come
u p .
COUNCILMAN PACK ER: I t wi ll come up at the
next me e ting?
MR. WEISS: Yes .
COUNCILMAN PACKER : And the n if there is an
uproar from our constituents , can we back out or
no?
MR . WE I SS : I have to tell you th is . We
ha ve been through t his once before . I a m not
making any judgments about Raheb or not , but
basically we had an execut ive --yo u know , we h ad
an agreement. We had an executive session. The
co u nci l voted at that time to set tle the thing.
t h in k th at if
TAYLOR REESE AND ASSOCIATES , INC.
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COUNCILMAN PACKER : We voted to settle?
MR . WEISS: Yes , in executive session .
MR. POPOK: Th en it was tabled a t th e
public meeti ng .
MR . WEISS: Somebody correct me I am --
COUNCILMAN PACKER : I didn't th ink we --
no , no , we didn 't reco mmend we settle.
ASS I STANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: Yes , we did .
MR . WEISS : We did . Marti n , what ha ppened
i n the execu ti ve session, we came out of it --
COUNC ILMAN PACKER: But we did not ag r ee.
MR . WEISS :
that did.
But there were three people
COUNCILMAN PACKER: No. At the executive
sess i on? The executi ve session , yes but , at t h e
council mee tin g, no.
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MR . WE I SS: My recollection is at the
executive session we had directions to settle the
case .
MR . POPOK : I agree with Richard.
MR. WEISS : We drew up the agreement . We
got Raheb to sig n it . I t was on t he agenda and at
that time it was tabled .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSE NFIE LD : I was the one
tha t was sitting h ere
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MR . WEISS: I 'm trying to respond
fac t ually, Martin, what you said, which is , if you
tell us --I t hink you have to have some
conviction wit h what you are doing. I f you give
i t to us, you do whateve r you want . We don 't care
whether you settle the case or don't settle the
case, bu t if you tell us to go sett l e the case ,
then you have to basically say , you know what,
when this th i ng comes up before the council, I 'm
voting f or the settlement . You can expect that a
whole bunch of people are go i ng to co me up a n d say
it 's a bad settlement, don 't waste the money , all
that kind of stuff . I think as , let 's say, as
diff icult as Raheb has been , I don't think it 's
fair to sort of jerk the guy around and go through
a whole se tt lement t h i ng and t hen come back.
COUNCILMAN PACKER : I have one mor e
question. How much are we exposed to t he lawyer
fe e? Let 's just say that they can come back at
us . How much would we be exposed on that?
MR . POPOK : Let me see if I unders ta nd it
correctly. If we lose t he insurance company ,
wh ich we will if we don't settle this case.
COUNCILMAN PACKER : Right .
MR. POPOK: And there is also another
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exposure that we have always talked abo u t , whic h
we do ge t rid o f he r e , which i s in t he r e servation
of rights they have t h e ability , wi n or l ose ; to
challe nge cover ag e and say they shou l dn 't have
even paid a l l of the money t ha t t h ey pa i d Co nr o y
Simberg to defen d t h e vil l a g e to date .
MR . WE ISS : Mi chael , l e t's g o t hrough so me
o f the scenario .
COU NCIL MAN JACOBI: What is you r fe e t o
date right now?
MR . WEISS : We are not handli n g the case .
MR . POPOK: We have been mi n i ma ll y
monitor i ng th e se t tleme n t.
COUNC I LMAN JACO B I : How much?
MR . WE I SS : Very , ve r y li tt l e .
COU NC I LM AN J ACOB I : Wh at is very little?
MR. POPOK : S i nce th e beginning ?
MR. WE I SS: The t hing has been go i n g on six
years .
MR . POPOK : Maybe 20 ,000 i n six years .
CO UN C I LMAN JACO B I : If we l ose t h e
insura nc e cove r age , then you guys wi l l have to
step in .
MR. POPOK : And t r y the case.
COUNCILMAN JACOB I: That i s going to be
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abo u t a hund r ed grand .
MR . WEISS : Let me go through the scena ri o .
If you don 't take the settlemen t , and you
say l et the chips fall where they may, and we go
through the thing , and t h e v i llage wins , you have
establ i shed that the thing is l egal .
But under tho se circumstances , wha t Michael
was saying i s even if we win , th e i n surance
company could come back to us and say the cla i m
fo r damag e s , t here was never re a ll y a va l id claim
f o r damages here , and even if we win , the
i nsu r ance company cou l d come bac k and say , I want
fees r eimb ur sed .
COUNCI L MAN PACKER : How much woul d th at be?
MR . POPOK :
MR . WEISS :
dollars.
MR . POPOK :
It 's over a hundred thousand .
Wel l over a hundred thousand
That i s cor r ect.
COUNCILMAN JACOBI : Are th ey en t i t led to
fees even though the damage relief was reques t ed .
Up to that point they did the work regarding t he
damage fee request and af t erwards --
MR . POPOK: But even under a reservat i on of
ri ghts --there wi ll be a coverage lawsuit .. There
could be a coverage lawsuit versus the vi ll age .
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MR. WEISS: By t he way , in addit i on to the
issue of t he fact t ha t we cou l d owe them a hu n dred
thousand dol l ars, what they will do is they wil l
sue us fo r the fees. So we h ave to then defend
tha t l awsu i t. I t gets very comp l icated .
COUNCILMAN JACOBI: What is our budget for
l ega l de f ense again?
MR. TREPPEDA: We always have a $600,000
cushion, so you don 't have to wor r y .
COUNCILMAN PACKER : To me i t 's an abject
surrender. I personally wou l d li k e the cou rt t o
rule on it. Then if there is something that is
going t o come up tha t these lawyers are going to
turn agains t t he v il lage
MR . WE ISS: So you know, this is not
theoretical . T he insu r ance company has two
l awyers involved. One lawyer t h at i s defend i ng
the vi ll age . T hey h ave h ired a sepa r ate lawyer
a n d law f i rm to protect their rig h ts of coming
back against th e vi l lage for the fees.
MR. POPOK : T hey have intervened in t h e
case al r eady.
MR. WEISS: I t's a separate l aw firm. I t 's
cal l ed a reservation of ri g hts . We are not
talking abou t some t heoretical thing up there .
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They have actually filed papers in the court
saying we reserve the right , even if the village
wins this case , to come back against the village
for fees. They have already done that .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: So even if we
vote on i t tonight and vote to accept it, they
still could --
MR. WEISS: No. Par t of the sett l ement i s
the insurance co mpany is waiv i ng th e ir right to
fe es against us.
MR. POPOK: Correct , and paying $25,000.
MR. WEISS: If the case i s settled , the
insurance company i s waiving their right to come
back against us for fees.
ASS I STANT MAYOR ROSE N F IELD : So no ma tter
how repugnant this is to us --
COUNCILMAN JACOB I : T his is a $200,000 --
MR. WEI SS : Le t me put this a littl e bit
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differently . This is an econo mic decision. Okay?
Economically, if the case is n ot set tl ed , the re is
a lot of ways that this could cost the village a
lot of money.
Fir st of all, he could win, and tha t is a
huge mess, but the issue is whether you be li eve
what Martin does that the issu e should b e reso lved
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once and for all .
COUNCIL MAN JACOB I : Le t me bring this up .
There 's people wait in g in the wings waiting fo r
the res u lt of my case to fin d ou t whethe r o r no t
they should fi l e an appeal. An appeal i t self is
go ing to r u n quite expens i ve also .
ASS I STANT MAYOR RO S ENFIELD : Tha t i s in
your case .
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COUNC I LMAN JACOBI : Ri g h t , I k now , bu t it 's
addi ng up as our legal bi ll s a re going to be
astro n om i ca l for both . Do we ni p i t now and we
save some mo ne y f .o r wha t happe n s or do we --I
don 't know .
ASS I STANT MAYO R ROSENF I E L D : You know , as
r epu gn ant a s I do find this , $1 0 ,000 coming o u t
t h eir pocket, the homeowne r s ' pocke t , we are no t
voting t o tax al l the people i n the village on
t h is . I would b e dr a st i ca l ly opposed if tha t
money ha d t o co me from the entire village .
COUNC ILM AN PACK ER : Let me say --
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: Can I finish?
CO UNCILMAN PAC KER : Yes, finish .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROS EN F IE LD : I wou l d no t
fi nd t h at amenab l e in any way whatsoever.
Aga i n , I have to g i ve serious cons i dera tion
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to the fa c t t hat th e $10 ,000 comes from the homes.
My other consideration i s that I hon estly believe
tha t --or I would li ke to hon est l y believe that
the vast majority of people do want tha t securi ty
gate and would not challenge it in the manner tha t
Raheb c ha llenged it .
COUNC ILMA N JACOBI : I do n 't u nderstand why
he would stab h i mse lf in the foot .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: I h ave no idea
wha t his intent was or what his basic mot iva tion
was. It was anger I think.
MR. WEISS: He was insulte d.
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROS E N FIELD : I t was that
kind of a th ing, and as much as I said I find this
repugnant, I find it far more repugnant to be in a
legal situation which might cost us hundreds ,
$200,000. I could never justify that in any way
what soever. I can't even th ink about it .
COUNCILMAN PACKER : The thing i s if I can
speak?
T he thing is I don 't think that the
majority of t he residents in the security d is trict
know what is really going on , and when this comes
out , and it 's going to be published, you are going
to have a roar . I rea ll y mean it, and if you tell
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me , okay, suppose it 's adopted now , and when i t
comes be fo r e the counc i l , I 'm going to listen to
the peop l e .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENF I E L D : That d e pends
o n what peop l e; two peop l e, thr ee people .
COUNCI L MA N PAC KER : Not two or three
people . There may be a petition. The r e may be
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o t her things . You h ave 250 residen t s i n there who
I would say 200 don 't k now what i s going on .
ASS I S T ANT MAYOR ROSE NFIELD : And that is
the counci l's f au l t?
COUNC ILM AN PACKER: I t 's n o t t h e council's
fau l t. I t 's their own headache, b u t when they
hear they are going t o have t o pay for i t
ASSISTANT MAY OR ROSE NFIE L D : It 's no t ne w
money . Again , it's not any new money that is
going to be co ll ected . It 's a l ready money that is
in their accoun t , isn't it? Tha t money is
MR . TREPPEOA : Yes .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : How b i g is
their account?
MR . TR EPPE DA : I t 's n ot very la rg e , but
the y do have a fund ba l ance of some mo ney and they
cou ld pay t hi s .
ASSISTANT MAY OR ROSE NF I ELD : They wouldn 't
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be assessed any individual l y?
MR . TR EPPEDA : Wouldn't have to .
MR . WEISS: The other side of it, though,
is that I think depending on how you feel about
somebody else coming in to challenge this , and I
will j ust te ll you that I honestly --and I hope
you don 't think I'm push i ng this one way or the
other because I 'm not . You and I have talked
21
about t his enough to know, but I honestly feel
that it takes a ve ry , very unusual individual to
come in to challenge their own guard gate because
it's real l y --I mean, if Raheb wins , he's lowered
the value of all the property i n there by a l ot
because even though they investigat ed this for
years , there is no other way to pay for that guard
gate easily . So I th i nk that if the people inside
knew that for basical l y $500 a pe rson , they have a
pretty good chance of keeping their gua rd gate up
and they have a l ready paid in the money anyway,
it 's $500 a person. It 's 200 homes divided by
10 ,000 is what? $50 a person? $50 a house is
basically what it is because the thing is if I
li ved there, what I would be concerned about is
that i f we say, le t 's get this thing resolved, i f
the vi llage loses , they have no way t ha t I know of
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t o replace that guard gate. Some peop l e want the
whole th i ng opened up and t hat may be the agenda ,
b ut if yo u are ta lking about t he people i ns i de for
$50 a house --
COUNC I L MA N PACK E R : T h ey don't want i t
opened up for s u re .
MR. WEISS : For 50 bucks a house
COUNCILMAN PACKER : I t 's absurd .
MR . TREPPEDA : Could somebody fro m outside
challenge it or i s that not possible?
COUNCILMAN JACOB I: Absolute l y .
MR. WE ISS : Peo p le could challenge it, bu t
the th i ng is , you k now, r ea l l y, i t 's got to be
very un u sua l . T hese things are expensive . I t has
to be a very unus u a l person , very wealthy person ,
or somebody who feels awful s trongly about
destroying something to do this .
You know , I think that the peop l e on the
i ns i de if they knew about it I 'm trying to
respond to what you said --the people on t he
inside k new about it, and they knew t h e r i sk of
litigating th i s --
COUNCI L MAN PACKER : T hat is go in g to come
ou t at the council mee ti ng.
MR. WE I SS : Yes .
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ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: My ques tion t o
A l , you at ten de d the ir meetings?
MR. TREP PE DA : T he ci v ic association? A
few of th e meet ing s , yes, recent ly .
ASSIST ANT MAYOR ROSEN FIELD: Di d the y bring
t his u p a t the civic assoc iation?
MR . TREP P EDA : No .
ASSIST ANT MA YO R ROSE NF IE LD: Did they ever
tak e a survey of h ow people fee l ?
MR . TREPPEDA: I am not sure .
MR . WEISS : I think Marti n i s rig ht. I
t hin k mos t p eopl e don 't k now anything about it .
COUNCILMAN PA CKER: I do n't think they have
a clue .
MR . WE ISS : I thin k yo u are absolutely
right .
MR . POPOK : The l ast pub l ic meeting th at I
was a t t ha t considere d the ea rli er settlement
agreement , you had a full hou se and you h ad four
people tha t go t up to speak , and o n e was Rah e b.
An d t ha t was even --had a lot more in it.
COU NCILMAN PACKER : Is the i nsurance
co mpany going to drop us?
MR . WEISS: We h a ve moved on to a different
insurance company , righ t?
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MR. T REPPEDA : Yes .
COUNCI LMAN JACOBI: Jus t t o protect
ourselves , we are going to h ave ano t her insurance
company back us up with this c h aos .
COUNCILMAN PACKER : It 's just an abject
surrender .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : Is·it ab ject
surrender or is it saying , I don't want to do this
but a t the same time I also don 't want to b e
respons i b l e for 20 0 ,00 0 , 300,000 whatever will
come down th e line .
COUNC IL MAN PACKER :
hap pen .
I don't t hink tha t wi ll
ASSISTA NT MAYOR ROS E N FIEL D: If you don't
accept this , the insurance company has al ready
said .
COUNCI L MAN PACKER : That they would .
AS S I S TAN T MAYOR ROS ENFIELD : That t hey
wou ld .
MR. WEISS: I wi ll tell you th i s --
MR . POPOK: I thin k in this e nviro nme n t,
they will .
MR . WE ISS :
MR. POPOK:
T hat the y what, come back --
The insurance company w i ll come
after us for this 200 ,0 00 .
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MR . WEISS: But the vil l age has to pay to
defend the lawsuit against the i nsurance company ,
which I guarantee wi l l cost more than $10 ,000.
What happens is even if we win th e case ,
the i nsurance company could --they have already
paid a l awyer to ge t involved already , cou l d come
after the village and sue us and say , we wa n t a
hundred thousand dollars.
go and defend that case .
We are going to have to
MR. POPOK : T ha t wil l be a six month to
re vi ew.
COUNCILMAN PACKER: I t can be de f endedr
correc t, in your o p inion?
MR. POPOK : I haven 't resea r ched it, but
there are arguments tha t we made that cove ra g e was
appropriate.
MR. WEISS: We co nvi nced them to take
coverage to b eg in with. We could win, we could
los e, but either way, you are go i ng to pay for us
t o def end t he case .
In ot h er words , even if we win every single
thing , i t 's st ill going to cost th e village more
t h an $1 0 ,000 .
COUNC IL MAN PACKER : Understa n d, but
rea li ty , of cou rse , fi n ancia ll y is one t hing .
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MR. WEISS: Yes .
CO UNCILMAN PACKER: But e t hica ll y and --
wha t is the other word I wan t to use?
MR . WEISS: Morally .
COUNC I LMAN PACKER: Mo rally, I think it's
abject surrender to someone who has twisted t h e
vi ll age 's arm, and we are screami n g ouch and say,
okay, stop .
I personally if we go along , I persona l ly
at a counc il meeting wil l vote no .
COUNC IL MAN JACO BI : I think Raheb realizes
he made a m i stake . I think that he know s h e's end
over end on t h is already. No t only is he twist i ng
arms , b ut it h as beaten him down, too.
ASSIS T ANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: Must this be
decided i n th i s executive session tonight?
MR. POPOK : Wha t I would be looking for is
d i rect i on t h at I can repor t back to h i s l awyer
because he h as a l ready signed the agreement , that
th i s i s go i ng to be co n sidered at the next public
mee tin g.
Normal l y , what we wou l d do i s put i t on the
agenda. We wo ul d wal k out of execu t ive and you
guys would a ct u a ll y vo t e on it and consider i t .
We have a gap here, and I'll be abl e to
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explain it . I 'm not going to make any prom i ses to
him, but I am going t o tell him if I ge t d i rect i on
from the counsel tonigh t , I wou l d like to be able
t o t e l l h im one way or the other .
MR . WEISS : You don 't have to do any t hing
a t all. You can do nothing.
MR . POPOK : Eit h er it 's not going to be
considered or --
MR . WE I SS : Thanks fo r the update . We are
not accepting it, and we will just go ahead and
l et the --i f you don 't direc t us
ASSIS T ANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : Then i t goes
to court.
MR . P OPOK: Yes.
MR . WEISS: There i s three people. I f t wo
of you don 't say, l isten, we are voting to se t t l e
the thing, put it on agenda, then we are not go i ng
to pu t i t on an agenda.
We are going to j ust t ell t he i nsurance
company , t hanks a l ot , go lit i gate the case and
wh atever happens happens.
MR . POPOK: Or I tel l them the counci l wi l l
cons i der i t.
MR . WEISS: No , because we are no t putting
it on an agenda unless we are directed to .
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MR . POPOK : That is what I 'm say in g, o r if
t h a t is the direc tio n .
28
COUNCILMAN JACO BI: Ma rti n, be f o re your
time , Jean , before your time , this issue has bee n
brought before by o ther ways as the people from
the outside wan t ed to come ins i de the gate to play
in the green area .
MR . WE I SS : It is always brought up .
CO UN C ILMAN JACOBI : I t i s always brought
up. It i s going to come up aga i n. This issue
with t h e gu ard gate is one of the main i ssues that
is going to come around again .
COUNCILMAN PACKER: I t hi n k once and for
all it s ho uld be ta k en care of. We are pa inting
th e guard gate now.
MR. TREP P EDA : Tha t comes out of the
security dis tri ct f unds .
ASS I STANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD :
r i ght there .
It says it
CO UNCIL MAN PACKER: I t 's in t he ir budge t .
T he thing i s i f they wan t t o have that
gate , then --
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : Then what?
The point i s --
MR. WEI SS: T hey don 't ha v e t he ability to
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hav e that ga t e without us .
COUNCILMAN JACOBI : You risk the property
values in there. If the city loses , the vi l lage
l oses , they are dead . Thei r p r operty values are
go i ng to fa ll, and our taxes go up and away we go.
MR. WEISS: The assessed value goes dow n .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: The assessed
value goes down, the mil lag e .
COUNCILMAN PACKER : T hat is why . If the
court rules and you fee l that we have an extreme l y
good case .
MR. WEISS: I never said t hat. I never
said that .
COUNCI L MAN PACKER : You never said t h at?
MR . WEISS: No , I did not say that .
COUNCILMAN PACKER: Do you fee l --
MR . WEISS : I feel that we s h ould win, but
to say that we have an e x tremely good case, no,
no. Ex tr emel y good, no . I th i nk this was, as I
told you when I d id my orientation with you years
ago, A l an Gold who is now a federal j u dge came up
w i th this system in order to try to help the
people in that area . I start out every
orientat ion, because I do them a l l the same, I
h ave a l ways been concerned about t hat area.
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Always h ave. I t old a l l of y ou that I am
concerned . I 'm concer n ed about t h e expenditures
in that area . I have t alked to you al l about i t .
I have ta lk ed to yo u abo ut the landscaping .
h ave talked to you about all of i t.
So , no , I wou l d n o t say extremely go od
I
case . I t hi nk t ha t Da vid Wolpin and Michael have
done a very good job he lp ing th i s lawyer from the
insu r ance company p ut toge ther a pretty good
defense, but, no, extremely good is way , way
stronger than we would say .
I think t he re is a , I d on 't k now ,
significant . I think that t he re i s a --I
wou l dn't put any numbers o n it, but
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: Why would he
no t ta k e j us t the $25,000 from t he insura n ce
company?
MR . POPOK : He wants money . My
speculation , he wants the money to cove r the
liens. He wants the net .
MR . WEISS : He is going to g i ve the money
right back to the v il lag e under t he agreement .
are giving him ten .
MR . POPOK: That i s down from 50.
MR. WE ISS : He owes us ten .
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COUNCI LM AN PACKER: He cou l d h ave asked for
a hundred . That we don 't consider , bu t he is
going to end up with $25 ,000 fr om the insurance
company.
MR . WE ISS: T hat is nothing.
COUNC IL MAN PACKER : What i f he ends up wi th
nothing f rom the insurance company and the $10,000
goes in , i t goes out , and h e ends up with zero.
Can we come to him with t ha t? We wil l settle .
Like t hat h e gets nothing and tha t i s it and we
will settle i t .
CO UNCI LMAN JACO BI: The insurance company ,
what is the ir max limi t?
MR . POPOK : R i cha rd was able to obtain from
them their h ighe st number, which is 25,0 00 .
ASS I STANT MA YOR ROSENFIELD: What if you
went back to him and said th e council wants you to
accept the $25 ,000? Is he go i ng to go ahead and
sue? Is he going to go ahea d and pay the lawy ers
and sue?
MR . POPOK: I don 't know as far as to get
i nto his mind.
ASSISTANT MA YOR ROSENF IEL D :
back wi t h that?
Can you go
MR . POPOK: I can always go back wi th a
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counteroffer . My guess is that his lawyer doesn 't
have much contro l over him in terms of a
re l ationship, and that he's already invested as
much as he has invested . I have spoken t o the
l awyer enough. I haven 't been dea l ing with t he
case on a day -t o -day basis so a little bit of t his
i s --my crysta l bal l is a little bit cloudy , but
my gut is he 's not going to take i t.
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD:
go ahead --
Tha t he will
MR . POPOK: That he won 't take i t .
MR. WEISS: We are dea li ng with a very
vola tile plaintiff. You have seen him he re. I
think the r eason it took so lo n g to get back here
was because he was really miffed at us t he first
time when the counc i l au t horized us to put a
settlement on the agenda and then he was, I t hink ,
embarrassed, when i t just got t abl ed. I think we
have gone through the thing aga i n .
through this dance a g ain wi th him .
We have gone
I insisted,
because I didn't want him t o j erk us around , t ha t
he sign this agreement before --I said, I 'm not
putting anyth i ng in fron t of the council unless
you sign because I d idn 't want the council to
approve it and then him come back and say, no , I
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don 't want it .
COUNC I LMAN JACOBI : I hea rd he d i dn't want
to sign it at first .
MR . WEISS : He didn't want to sign it . I
told him, I said, I am not taking i t to t he
executive session because I didn 't wa n t you to be
embarrassed . I think if this settlement is not
approved, then this case is not settling .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: That he will
spend the money to go to court.
MR . WEISS : He wi l l spend the money to go
to court .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSE NF I ELD : I don 't know .
Is he that wealthy?
COUNCILMAN JACOBI : He doesn 't have the
mo n ey.
MR . POPOK: He will go prose. He's the
kind of g uy that will go prose without a lawyer.
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIE L D : F i gh t his own
case in front of a judge?
COUNCILMAN JACOBI : I know for a fac t he
doesn 't have the money.
MR . POPOK : That is just in response. We
can always go back with whatever the wi l l of the
council is.
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ASS I S T ANT MAYOR ROSE NF I ELD : I would really
like to go back and say , the counci l , at th i s
po i nt , take t he 25,000 and run ..
COU NCI L MAN PACKER : An d he still has t o pay
h i s li ens .
COUNC I LMA N JACO BI: Right.
MR. WEISS :
15,00 0 .
He 's going to end up with
You know what ?
ASSISTANT MAY OR ROSENF I E LD: What?
MR . WEISS: We wi ll go back to h im with i t .
We will do i t.
I don't thin k h e w ill accep t it , but i f i t
i s what i t is , you know --
ASSISTANT MAY OR ROSENFI ELD : Would the
homeowners associat io n --b eca u se it 's not us .
I t's not t h e council that gets the money. Wou l d
the homeowners associat i on i f he sett l ed for the
25,000 e r ase the 10 ,0 00?
lie n .
MR. WEI SS: T h ey ca n't .
ASSIS T ANT MAYOR ROS E NF I ELD : They can 't ?
MR . WEISS : No . I t i s us . I t 's t he c ity
ASSIST ANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : Okay.
MR. POPOK: I th in k what is i n f r on t of t he
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council t onigh t is a way t o set t le the case with
absolu ti on .
MR . WEISS : I t hink yo u shou ld basically ,
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again , because t he se things are so t i me consuming ,
this is t h e best settlement we a r e going to ge t in
this case . If you don 't wan t the settlement , we
will make a coun t eroffer .
with it .
T here i s no problem
COUNCILMAN PACKER : Co un t e r offer cannot
hurt .
MR . WEISS: Absolutely not . I t w ill not
h urt.
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : That doesn't
negate th i s o ff er . I f he refuses that , we can
st i ll reconsider this offer or not?
MR . P OPOK : Or he can pu l l i t .
ASS I STAN T MA YOR ROSENFI E LD: He can pu ll
i t?
CO UN CI LMAN J ACOBI : Abso l utely . He will .
MR . POPOK: I think if you wan t to settle ,
t hese are the terms.
ASS I ST ANT MAYOR ROSEN FIELD :
h i m that well.
I don 't know
MR. WE ISS : He is a ve r y volatile person .
I felt very strongly about this. I th i nk that he
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now realizes h e go t himself i n t o this . I think
h is ego is involved. I think h e was sincere when
he fi led . I t hi n k h e was very angry .
I mean, to some ex t ent , you are acting for
the pe op l e i nside the residential area. Do yo u
not have a fee ling about what they would want you
to do? Do yo u not --do they
COUNCIL MAN PAC KE R: I mea n, I have spoke n
to some people , not about th i s pa rticular case at
all , but as far as peop le saying what i s the
execu t ive sess io n , I would say, you know, the
Raheb t h ing . What; what is that al l abou t?
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENcIE L D: People on t he
o t her side of the street hav~ no idea what it is
about .
MR. WEISS : No, no, no . T he people in the
r eside n tial area
ASSISTANT MAYO R ROS E N FIEL D: Yo u don 't
think the peop le i n th e r es i de nti al area?
COUNC IL MAN JACOBI: I agree . Not all of
the m know.
MR . POPOK : Another f actor I am go ing to
throw i n there i s maybe we wi ll lose h i s lawyer
beca u se he is gett i n g a l ittle fed up w i th the
case and he 's not getting paid . T he one
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advantage, h i s lawyer, so far is he has been sane
and he has been a good guy to in teract with and
negotiate, and he delivers what he says he is
going to deliver. There 's a lot of l awyers out
there that aren't like that that Raheb could find .
We got him on the last fumes in the gas tank here .
ASS I STANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: Is it possib l e
just to hold this in abeyance while we do so me
more investigating?
MR . WEISS : Yes . Do anything you want .
ASSISTANT MAYO R ROSENFIELD : I don 't want
it to come up to council yet . I 'm not sure t hat
I 'm ready to real l y definitively decide. I think
tha t maybe we need to talk t o some residents.
MR . WEISS : Is it set for trial?
MR . POPOK : I'm not sure.
COUNCILMAN PACKER: Are we allowed to --
we ll , you can 't put it on an agenda at a council
mee ting .
MR . WEISS: If you want to find out , what I
would do , yo u ha ve Stuart Sobel who is t he head of
t he homeowners association.
COUNCI L MAN PACK ER: Ca n we have a workshop
with them?
MR . WE I SS : I th i nk you shou l d just ask
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Stuart t o find ou t. He rep r ese nts t he people . He
was e lec te d . Ask Stuar t Sobel, do yo u wan t t o
sett l e the case or no t .
Has no b od y spoken to Stuart Sobel about
this?
COUNCILMAN PACKER : I have spoken to him
o n ce about another sub j ect , and I can cal l him .
ha v e no p r oblem .
ASSISTAN T MAY OR ROSENF I ELD : I can call
him . His .d au g ht er goes to my sc h oo l.
MR. WEISS : Would it make a big d iffer e nce
if Stuart said, a bs o lu tely , I want to settle the
case?
ASSISTANT MA YOR ROSENFIELD : I f h e
re p resent s , i f he 's the elected p r esiden t
MR . WEISS: He is t h e elected presi dent .
COUNCILMAN PAC KER: He 's the elected
preside nt of t hat organizat ion .
ASS I STANT MAYOR ROSENFIELD: Then we should
I
have h is word on this. So can we hold thi s f or --
MR . WE I SS : Why do n 't you step outsi de and
ca ll him ?
I do n 't want to wa s t e t i me . I don 't want
you to thin k I a m pus hing .
him, I will call hi m.
If you wan t me to cal l
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CO UNC ILMAN JACOB I : P l ease, call him ,
Richard . I 'm advising Richard, our attorney.
MR . WE I SS: I don't know if I can get him.
I am go in g to ca ll .
MR. P OPOK : Richard , you want a recess?
MR. WEISS : Go off the record for a second .
(Brief recess taken .)
COUNCILMAN PACKER : I believe then we
should hold in abeyance our decision u nt il we hear
from Mr . Sobel and t h e n schedule another executive
session.
COUNCILMAN JACOBI: I second tha t .
ASSIS TANT MAYOR ROSENF IE LD : I 'l l third .
MR . WEISS : I'll te l l you what we did l ast
time if you remember is t h at we app r oved , the
se ttlement was app r oved sub j ec t to me speaking
w ith Mr . Sobel. Remember that?
ASSIS TA NT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : No .
MR . WEISS : Let 's j us t leave it a t
abeya nc e .
COUNC I LMAN PACKER : I would not approve
sub j ect t o hi s speaking to him . I wou l d say l et
us postpone i t , and we can have an executive
session as soon as possible .
ASS I STA NT MAYOR ROSENFIELD : I can co me
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back tomorrow or the next day .
MR. WEISS: You can 't , but I will re ques t
anot he r execu ti ve ses?ion t onight and then we can
do it q u ic k ly .
ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENF IEL D : Can we do i t
that way?
I want to he ar from the homeowne rs
association .
CO UNCI L MAN PAC KER: An d i f he has to call
an exec u t i ve meeting of h is peop l e over the r e,
t hen
MR . WEISS : Okay . Great . So , Jea n , let I s
go back t o the script .
ASS I S TA NT MAY OR ROSENFIELD: I wi l l n ow
reopen the public meeting . The attorney/clien t
session has now been terminated and members of t he
general pub li c are now i nv ited to r e tur n for any
f u rther proceedings or mat te r s.
MR . WE I SS : The pub li c meeting i s now --
let 's adjourn this pu bl ic meet i ng .
COUNCILMAN PA CK ER:
COUNCILMAN JACOB I:
I move f or ad j ournmen t .
I wil l seco nd.
ASSISTA NT MAYOR ROSENF I E L D : All in f avor .
COUNCILMAN PACK E R : Aye .
CO UNCILMAN JACOB I: Aye .
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ASSISTANT MAYOR ROSENFIE LD : Aye .
(Thereupon , the proceedings were adjour n ed
at 6 :25 p.m.)
C E R T I F I C A T E
I, Mary G . Stephenson , FPR , State of Florida a t
1 0 Large , certify that I was author i zed to and did
1 1 st e nog r aphically report the f oregoing p r oceedings and
12 that t he transcript is a true and comp l ete record o f my
13 stenograph i c no t es .
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Dated th i s 20th day of April , 2009 .
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